Typical Working hours
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Join Date: Aug 2003
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Typical Working hours
Hi,
I have been flying as a PPL for the last 3 years and have logged 100 hours. For the last 12 months I have seriously been looking into moving into the commercial flying arena and looked into the various prospects, ways to achieve an ATPL etc..
Nothing New there on this website!!
However, I cannot seem to find much information on typical hour rostas or working conditions that pilots can expect, (except a few moans on the budget airlines) Could anyone advise me on what shifts, rostas one could expect to work for a typical airline in the UK? Thanks!!
I have been flying as a PPL for the last 3 years and have logged 100 hours. For the last 12 months I have seriously been looking into moving into the commercial flying arena and looked into the various prospects, ways to achieve an ATPL etc..
Nothing New there on this website!!
However, I cannot seem to find much information on typical hour rostas or working conditions that pilots can expect, (except a few moans on the budget airlines) Could anyone advise me on what shifts, rostas one could expect to work for a typical airline in the UK? Thanks!!
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Hi RIKW1975
I'm in a similar situation to you but have managed to find some info on here.
From what I read on short haul european e.g. Thomsonfly you could expect to do 4 or 5 on and 3 off usually upto 10 hours per day.
If you look on the "Terms and endearment" forum on here and look at the Thomsonfly thread it seems to be where the most info can be found.
Please let me know if I am miles out with those figures or if you find further info.
Sparks-Flying
I'm in a similar situation to you but have managed to find some info on here.
From what I read on short haul european e.g. Thomsonfly you could expect to do 4 or 5 on and 3 off usually upto 10 hours per day.
If you look on the "Terms and endearment" forum on here and look at the Thomsonfly thread it seems to be where the most info can be found.
Please let me know if I am miles out with those figures or if you find further info.
Sparks-Flying
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Now now Joyce, don't lead the poor chap down the wrong path.
you are correct we can only do 900 hours a year but this only applies to the actual time in the seat. not the check in turn round training, positioning, check out, delays office duties, paperwork prep etc etc etc. so realistically you will be in uniform for at least 8 to ten hour EVERY day you put the uniform on - even if you only fly for a few hours.
my experience is that flight crews will certainly do 1800 hours a year easilly.
I woun't even comment on the money for old rope bit..... if you don't know, I couldn't teach you.
edited for spelling.....loaded doing the old rope thing but too busy to type slowly.......
you are correct we can only do 900 hours a year but this only applies to the actual time in the seat. not the check in turn round training, positioning, check out, delays office duties, paperwork prep etc etc etc. so realistically you will be in uniform for at least 8 to ten hour EVERY day you put the uniform on - even if you only fly for a few hours.
my experience is that flight crews will certainly do 1800 hours a year easilly.
I woun't even comment on the money for old rope bit..... if you don't know, I couldn't teach you.
edited for spelling.....loaded doing the old rope thing but too busy to type slowly.......
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But Mr. Scotsman - all those other things you mention, they're not, like, actually working.......it's more like bumming around, waiting to work...
Let the retorts commence!V1R
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Can't remember exactly,
ATPL with an airline 900 hrs ish pa
dependent wether long haul, short haul, and airline you work for.
If working for a low cost, short haul expect to work near the maximum with long days up to 4 sectors per day for example uk to spain return then uk to ireland return all in one day.
Long haul could be from a five hour to whatever bearing in mind we use a third pilot for a break above eight hours.
There again you might get lucky and work for a large airline but based at a regional airport and only work 500 hrs pa.
You might even work 400 hrs one year, 800 the next 900, the next, you just don't know. You are not allowed to exceed the maximum. Like said earlier, money for old rope (but quality old rope). 900 hrs pa equates to 24 working weeks per year based on a 37.5 hr working week, not bad.
It is actually more complicated than this and too complex to explain in this thread.
ILS 119.5
ATPL with an airline 900 hrs ish pa
dependent wether long haul, short haul, and airline you work for.
If working for a low cost, short haul expect to work near the maximum with long days up to 4 sectors per day for example uk to spain return then uk to ireland return all in one day.
Long haul could be from a five hour to whatever bearing in mind we use a third pilot for a break above eight hours.
There again you might get lucky and work for a large airline but based at a regional airport and only work 500 hrs pa.
You might even work 400 hrs one year, 800 the next 900, the next, you just don't know. You are not allowed to exceed the maximum. Like said earlier, money for old rope (but quality old rope). 900 hrs pa equates to 24 working weeks per year based on a 37.5 hr working week, not bad.
It is actually more complicated than this and too complex to explain in this thread.
ILS 119.5
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Our pattern used to be 6 days on 3 days off, now experimenting with 5/2/5/4. We average between 120-180 duty hours a month and in the last 12 months i have worked just over 1600 duty hours of which 836 were actual flight hours.
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Don't be fooled by the number of hours logged as they will make the job seem easy.
Just take a look at how many hours a week the average pilot's car is parked in the company car park.
Probably more hours than the average employee!
Just take a look at how many hours a week the average pilot's car is parked in the company car park.
Probably more hours than the average employee!
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Take a look at CAP 371. I'd guess for most airlines the crew will work pretty much the maximum permitted - factor in the typical sector lengths and you've got your answer.
As for Joyce's comments, the average person's 1800 working hours each year tend not to be done in the dead of night, weekends and public holidays. Nor does the average job have to be done right all the time.
On the other hand, maybe I'm a bit out of my depth on this one - I'm a simple controller. Shall we talk about having to have a break after an hour's work??
As for Joyce's comments, the average person's 1800 working hours each year tend not to be done in the dead of night, weekends and public holidays. Nor does the average job have to be done right all the time.
On the other hand, maybe I'm a bit out of my depth on this one - I'm a simple controller. Shall we talk about having to have a break after an hour's work??
Just a numbered other
Joyce,
my duty hours year to end Oct 2004 1890, flying 887.
If you don't call the time at work outside flying, work: You ain't doin' enough
Make a long flight to Spain, with all those stops, wouldn't it?
my duty hours year to end Oct 2004 1890, flying 887.
If you don't call the time at work outside flying, work: You ain't doin' enough
Shall we talk about having to have a break after an hour's work??
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There is a reason that pilots are exempt from most of the EU working directives - (us and Doctors) - it would limit the airlines use of us too much. We can be rostered 55 hours duty in a week, which can go to 60 with delays. Personally I have managed 63 hours in 7 days, due to loopholes in the regulations.
I work for one of the major UK holiday airlines.
Up until last year I was usually doing 7 on-2 off, now its 6 on- 2 off but you normally don't finish until around 6-7pm before the days off and start again at 6.30am (or before). So by the time you get home after the last duty at around 8pm, you lose that evening, so your only free evening is the following one, and then the next day you're in bed by 8pm for the 4am start.
Its bloody hard work, and these days its not only in the summer - we have overseas contracts that take some of the pilots away from the UK for the winter, leaving plenty of work for those left behind.
In fact, last month my roster was for 99.5 hours flying/ 170 hours duty, and December has 180 hours duty time on it, although there are a few days which are standbys (at the moment). The best bit of this roster was that I had a run of 7 days, where the middle day was a day off. The flight before finished at 2050z and the flight after it started at 0630z.
And here was me thinking that airlines had to roster to CAA/JAA regulations!!!!!
We tend to fly 2 sector days, but that might mean a 12 hour duty day, and as mentioned, when you factor in the constant change to the start times (eg. one day start at 4am, next day start at 5pm, etc.) its tiring.
I work for one of the major UK holiday airlines.
Up until last year I was usually doing 7 on-2 off, now its 6 on- 2 off but you normally don't finish until around 6-7pm before the days off and start again at 6.30am (or before). So by the time you get home after the last duty at around 8pm, you lose that evening, so your only free evening is the following one, and then the next day you're in bed by 8pm for the 4am start.
Its bloody hard work, and these days its not only in the summer - we have overseas contracts that take some of the pilots away from the UK for the winter, leaving plenty of work for those left behind.
In fact, last month my roster was for 99.5 hours flying/ 170 hours duty, and December has 180 hours duty time on it, although there are a few days which are standbys (at the moment). The best bit of this roster was that I had a run of 7 days, where the middle day was a day off. The flight before finished at 2050z and the flight after it started at 0630z.
And here was me thinking that airlines had to roster to CAA/JAA regulations!!!!!
We tend to fly 2 sector days, but that might mean a 12 hour duty day, and as mentioned, when you factor in the constant change to the start times (eg. one day start at 4am, next day start at 5pm, etc.) its tiring.
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Depends what you want and you take on the career/life balance.
I work low cost. The hours are way too long to give you any sort of a life. Great when you're starting out-lots of flying , quick command. Not when you're not.
Smaller airlines give you a better life generally than the major ones as you have much more control over what and when you do you thing. And after you've turned down the neighbour's 3rd invitaion to lunch cos you're working, that matters believe you me.
I work low cost. The hours are way too long to give you any sort of a life. Great when you're starting out-lots of flying , quick command. Not when you're not.
Smaller airlines give you a better life generally than the major ones as you have much more control over what and when you do you thing. And after you've turned down the neighbour's 3rd invitaion to lunch cos you're working, that matters believe you me.
Just a numbered other
now its 6 on- 2 off but you normally don't finish until around 6-7pm before the days off and start again at 6.30am (or before).
LoCo flying is pure grind. No fun at all.
For those that say 'vote with your feet' just watch the crew turnover rate. It would be cheaper (sfer too) to treat people bettr and keep them than to constantly roll-over pilots.
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Thanks for your info!!
I guess the hours conflict a lot with the personal life. Do any of you find it hard working the hours and only seeing familly / friends once or twice a week?
I guess the hours conflict a lot with the personal life. Do any of you find it hard working the hours and only seeing familly / friends once or twice a week?
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Think I must have it pretty good - A week of earlies which is two sectors - start 0600 finish 1130 followed by a week of lates which is 4 sectors - start 1400 finish 2015. No night flying and the odd day at a weekend once per month. Add hoc charters now and then.
Iam flying a nice modern EFIS equipped turbo prop from a local airport. Might not command a senior jet F/O salary but its all about a balance in life between doing the job you enjoy and family time - plus time to earn a secondary income im my spare time - now beat that!
Should I try and move on up the ladder to earn more money on a jet with a low cost etc -Methinks I would be crazy!!!
What would you all do?
Iam flying a nice modern EFIS equipped turbo prop from a local airport. Might not command a senior jet F/O salary but its all about a balance in life between doing the job you enjoy and family time - plus time to earn a secondary income im my spare time - now beat that!
Should I try and move on up the ladder to earn more money on a jet with a low cost etc -Methinks I would be crazy!!!
What would you all do?
