Job prospects after modular ATPL (UK)? Loan or secure a job?
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
From: in a house
Been through it didn’t get a job - moved on with life.
my advice - don’t do it
If you decide to anyway; get some other skills first do something a bit different first get some money behind you.
if you are willing to spend your own money you will probably be able to keep at it.
easyjet et al only recruit newbies from their ATOs if you want to get straight in with them and others that have a similar set up go integrated.
modular etc is fine but never expect to join an airline - yes it might but you should plan to be an instructor and content on being that way for a good portion of your prime years where you would be developing in another career.
my advice - don’t do it
If you decide to anyway; get some other skills first do something a bit different first get some money behind you.
if you are willing to spend your own money you will probably be able to keep at it.
easyjet et al only recruit newbies from their ATOs if you want to get straight in with them and others that have a similar set up go integrated.
modular etc is fine but never expect to join an airline - yes it might but you should plan to be an instructor and content on being that way for a good portion of your prime years where you would be developing in another career.
Joined: Dec 2005
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 4,972
Likes: 326
From: Hong Kong
Take everything with a pinch of salt. Not everyone has the ability, aptitude or perseverance to become a professional pilot. Someone has to come bottom of the class or get straight 75s in their ATPLs. There are plenty of people that probably shouldn't be in an airliner but are because they bought themselves a licence and got lucky. It's a spectrum. Be at the other end of it.
Remember also it's a cyclical business; a lot of people miss-time it, miss the wave then give up because they can't wait for the next one. Right now it's the perfect time to start paddling, but be quick.
Remember also it's a cyclical business; a lot of people miss-time it, miss the wave then give up because they can't wait for the next one. Right now it's the perfect time to start paddling, but be quick.
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 587
Likes: 60
From: FLSomething
Been through it didn’t get a job - moved on with life.
my advice - don’t do it
If you decide to anyway; get some other skills first do something a bit different first get some money behind you.
if you are willing to spend your own money you will probably be able to keep at it.
easyjet et al only recruit newbies from their ATOs if you want to get straight in with them and others that have a similar set up go integrated.
modular etc is fine but never expect to join an airline - yes it might but you should plan to be an instructor and content on being that way for a good portion of your prime years where you would be developing in another career.
my advice - don’t do it
If you decide to anyway; get some other skills first do something a bit different first get some money behind you.
if you are willing to spend your own money you will probably be able to keep at it.
easyjet et al only recruit newbies from their ATOs if you want to get straight in with them and others that have a similar set up go integrated.
modular etc is fine but never expect to join an airline - yes it might but you should plan to be an instructor and content on being that way for a good portion of your prime years where you would be developing in another career.
If you come out of Modular training there are options everywhere. BA, TUI, Loganair etc etc. and those are just the advertised ones, that’s not including instruction jobs, pilot apprentice schemes etc etc. I get why you’re bitter, but don’t try and project that onto people in a totally different scenario to you.
The getting other experience first, complete waste of time and money. Spend five years learning to be an accountant. Why? For the 12 months where you might be waiting for a job. Great, you’ve just bought £50K of student debt and 5 less years making £150-200K as a training captain at the top of your career.
There are thousands of Modular airline pilots in the uk alone. At some point you need to let it go mate.
Joined: Oct 2023
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
From: N.Ireland
Take everything with a pinch of salt. Not everyone has the ability, aptitude or perseverance to become a professional pilot. Someone has to come bottom of the class or get straight 75s in their ATPLs. There are plenty of people that probably shouldn't be in an airliner but are because they bought themselves a licence and got lucky. It's a spectrum. Be at the other end of it.
Remember also it's a cyclical business; a lot of people miss-time it, miss the wave then give up because they can't wait for the next one. Right now it's the perfect time to start paddling, but be quick.
Remember also it's a cyclical business; a lot of people miss-time it, miss the wave then give up because they can't wait for the next one. Right now it's the perfect time to start paddling, but be quick.
As someone who is ready to embark on the PPL journey - I am realising having an aircraft free to book, along with a flight instructor, at the weekends (I work mon-fri), at my local flying club is a lot more challenging than anticipated and its not going to be as simple as completing a weekly lesson with them. So I'm beginning to look elsewhere and I noticed you mentioned USA, specifically Florida, to complete PPL - have you any suggestions of flying clubs/schools in the USA that I could research. Thanks in advance
Joined: Dec 2005
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 4,972
Likes: 326
From: Hong Kong
Thanks! I try to help or at least be sarcastic. Unfortunately it's been a decade plus since I trained in the US. Flight schools come and go so unfortunately you're on your own but I'm sure there are others who can chip in with some recommendations. The main advantage with Florida (or CA/AZ etc) is the weather. By having 99% of days flyable, you can book in advance and know that you won't be sat looking out of a rainy window, and then fighting others for slots on sunny days. If you turn up on day 1 with all the knowledge squared away, you can concentrate on flying and a 3 week PPL becomes very achievable at 2hrs per day.
Joined: Oct 2023
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
From: N.Ireland
Thanks! I try to help or at least be sarcastic. Unfortunately it's been a decade plus since I trained in the US. Flight schools come and go so unfortunately you're on your own but I'm sure there are others who can chip in with some recommendations. The main advantage with Florida (or CA/AZ etc) is the weather. By having 99% of days flyable, you can book in advance and know that you won't be sat looking out of a rainy window, and then fighting others for slots on sunny days. If you turn up on day 1 with all the knowledge squared away, you can concentrate on flying and a 3 week PPL becomes very achievable at 2hrs per day.
When you say 'turning up with all the knowledge squared away' I'm assuming you mean the exam side of things here? Would you recommended going ahead and starting the learning and booking the exams now? And are the Air Pilot Manuals all you need for this? I noticed Bristol Ground School have an online distance learning PPL theory course but as its quite new I haven't seen much recommendations on it
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
From: in a house
Rubbish. You got your licence close to the 15 years ago in a completely different environment. As has been said, not everyone has the aptitude to actually be a pilot.
If you come out of Modular training there are options everywhere. BA, TUI, Loganair etc etc. and those are just the advertised ones, that’s not including instruction jobs, pilot apprentice schemes etc etc. I get why you’re bitter, but don’t try and project that onto people in a totally different scenario to you.
The getting other experience first, complete waste of time and money. Spend five years learning to be an accountant. Why? For the 12 months where you might be waiting for a job. Great, you’ve just bought £50K of student debt and 5 less years making £150-200K as a training captain at the top of your career.
There are thousands of Modular airline pilots in the uk alone. At some point you need to let it go mate.
If you come out of Modular training there are options everywhere. BA, TUI, Loganair etc etc. and those are just the advertised ones, that’s not including instruction jobs, pilot apprentice schemes etc etc. I get why you’re bitter, but don’t try and project that onto people in a totally different scenario to you.
The getting other experience first, complete waste of time and money. Spend five years learning to be an accountant. Why? For the 12 months where you might be waiting for a job. Great, you’ve just bought £50K of student debt and 5 less years making £150-200K as a training captain at the top of your career.
There are thousands of Modular airline pilots in the uk alone. At some point you need to let it go mate.
I was pretty straight up on my advice then gave an opinion if they decided they want to stick with it. I wouldn’t say that was unreasonable. They know their own personal abilities and determination and scenario, we can’t - but if there was anyone like me in that same scenario on deciding what to do - I wish there was a voice like mine to have listened to.
From my experience I wish I got some other skills to fall back on. Now I am playing catch up with normal life.
Maybe I’ll get back into it, but at least I can do it knowing I have other skills I can use whilst revalidating or in a downturn or as side hustle while buzzing around instructing. I don’t see how having a sense of realism is being bitter.
There are 1000s of pilots, you are right and a cursory look on linkedin shows many fATPL doing other things, could be temporary, I hope so. But also theres not exactly easy to find data on the subject which is why people come here in the first place.
I would never in good conscience advise anyone to spend that amount of money to get into it though. It’s my opinion. I share it so others can learn from it and make the right choice for them. Sometimes the best decision is to not take off at all. Is that not the thought process pilots should have?
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
From: Chelmsford
Lots of good advice and real world experience for people like me wishing to take this career path. The ups and downs of the industry, the lack of guarantees, and the risk of exploitation is very clear.
I'm in a slightly different position to most. I'm shoving 50 years old soon, financially stable thanks to a well-paid stable job, mortgages paid, kids growing up, and a 40 year old aviation itch that needs scratching
I hold a PPL(A) with instrument rating, 520 hours, and fly a lovely Cirrus SR22. I think the modular route is the right one for me, given I'm effectively part-way through the training already, and domestic commitments means I can't just reside at a training college for 12 months
Said domestic commitments means I would be aiming for a short haul role in the southeast of England, and If I were to find myself out on my ear during a downturn, I have other options to turn to.
Question here relates to which carriers would hire a self-funded modular frozen ATPL pilot, especially if he did not go through the few select shiny ATOs [I have a 'non-shiny ATO' nearby]? ManFlex40 Lists several carriers including EasyJet and Ryanair. My research so far suggests such carriers only like pilots from the shiny ATOs, so wondering if the situation has changed in recent times?
Many thanks for all the advice in here
I'm in a slightly different position to most. I'm shoving 50 years old soon, financially stable thanks to a well-paid stable job, mortgages paid, kids growing up, and a 40 year old aviation itch that needs scratching
I hold a PPL(A) with instrument rating, 520 hours, and fly a lovely Cirrus SR22. I think the modular route is the right one for me, given I'm effectively part-way through the training already, and domestic commitments means I can't just reside at a training college for 12 months
Said domestic commitments means I would be aiming for a short haul role in the southeast of England, and If I were to find myself out on my ear during a downturn, I have other options to turn to.
Question here relates to which carriers would hire a self-funded modular frozen ATPL pilot, especially if he did not go through the few select shiny ATOs [I have a 'non-shiny ATO' nearby]? ManFlex40 Lists several carriers including EasyJet and Ryanair. My research so far suggests such carriers only like pilots from the shiny ATOs, so wondering if the situation has changed in recent times?
Many thanks for all the advice in here
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 8
Likes: 10
From: United Kingdom
Question here relates to which carriers would hire a self-funded modular frozen ATPL pilot, especially if he did not go through the few select shiny ATOs [I have a 'non-shiny ATO' nearby]? ManFlex40 Lists several carriers including EasyJet and Ryanair. My research so far suggests such carriers only like pilots from the shiny ATOs, so wondering if the situation has changed in recent times?
In total honesty I'd say you're probably just at the tipping point where your age may start to work against you in a hiring situation, but as long as you have the flying qualifications, a full CV and plenty of life experience to bring to the table, I'd suggest you stand just as strong a chance if not moreso than a 20 year old fresh out of flight school who's never had a job. I also came from another profession and felt fairly strong in the interviews as I was able to advertise a lot of aviation relevant skills that I would not otherwise have had. Ended up with job offers from two LCCs and got to choose between them, a combination of right place right time and putting your best foot forward whenever possible.
I'd just say be aware of the lifestyle sacrifices you will have to make for flying to be your job. There are many implications regarding time at home, unsociable and unpredicatable working hours, commuting that will impact someone with a settled family far more than a younger free spirit.
Joined: Nov 1999
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 3,139
Likes: 740
From: UK
All I can say is wow, didn't expect such high quality, in depth responses, thank you so much everyone.
Still have a few nagging questions though:
1) To put it simply why does integrated...exist? In a perfect world, you would think people would go for the cheapest and most flexible option leaving integrated courses deserted, but the opposite seems to be true. Is it just the whiff of a possible advantage when applying for jobs or is there something more I'm missing?....
Still have a few nagging questions though:
1) To put it simply why does integrated...exist? In a perfect world, you would think people would go for the cheapest and most flexible option leaving integrated courses deserted, but the opposite seems to be true. Is it just the whiff of a possible advantage when applying for jobs or is there something more I'm missing?....
This is, (or was) * because students will definitely be properly trained in classrooms by professional teachers. And their flying training will be organised and scheduled, again with professional instructors. The integrated and full time structure brings with it a schedule, an organisation, a consistency, and of course the school needs to maintain a good reputation for the quality of its students.
The scheduled structure tells the airlines that a successful cadet can absorb and assimilate all the ATPL information within a certain timeframe. With modular, a student might be just as good, or might take years to complete the course. Airlines need to know that a cadet has the ability to learn and pass a new type rating, for example, within a few weeks, and pass their 6 monthly recurrent SIM exams every time.
With the modular route there is no guarantee that students will have learned the information in a classroom; in-depth and within a tight timeframe, or have just practised and practised with question banks.
There was a pilot on the Tech Log not long ago, who clearly had no idea whatsoever about the electrical generation systems in their (passenger airliner) aircraft. How could this have been if they had really studied the subject ?
Obviously, there will be plenty of modular pilots who have a full depth of knowledge, but how can airlines know ? Sadly, they won't necessarily spend the time finding out - they might take only the integrated cadets from known schools, to save them a lot of selection work. We had several airline recruiters visit our school to invite applications.
* Just my experience, you understand, based on my own training on a full-time integrated ATPL course at a well known flying school 25 years ago. I am not personally saying that modular is necessarily inferior.
(And I did my integrated full time training in the years before the school prices went really stupid).
.
Last edited by Uplinker; 10th December 2025 at 09:53.
Joined: Apr 2012
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
Posts: 400
Likes: 18
From: UK
Outside of aviation, a lot of training courses in various industries follow the integrated model, when I did the training for my current career it was definitely "integrated", however I was an employee from day one, had a wage and pension etc. so didn't have to worry about funding the training or indeed my living costs.
In aviation, even the most generous training programmes don't pay much in the way of living costs during training unless you have very few commitments, additionally you don't get the protection and rights of employment from day one of training. That might be about to change with a new training programme mooted by one of the low-cost airlines.
Even with the sponsored programmes of the past couple of years , the majority of trainee pilots still have to pay for their own training which leads to a catch-22. If you don't have a wealthy family background then you need to get a job to save money for flight training, if you want to go down the integrated route it would need to be a very good job allowing you to save at least £10k per year if you wanted to get in before 30 unless investment returns were particularly good etc. Going down the modular route in this scenario would allow a trainee pilot to be qualified years earlier whilst staying in their job until receiving an offer from an airline. The integrated route would require someone to give up their lucrative career which has allowed them to save despite there being no guarantee of what the market would be like at the end of training. Getting back into the original career after an 18 month break might be a challenge too, especially given the gap would involve pilot training.
As a result I suspect self-funded integrated courses produce a very specific demographic of pilot, that is usually 18-25 from a wealthy family background.
In aviation, even the most generous training programmes don't pay much in the way of living costs during training unless you have very few commitments, additionally you don't get the protection and rights of employment from day one of training. That might be about to change with a new training programme mooted by one of the low-cost airlines.
Even with the sponsored programmes of the past couple of years , the majority of trainee pilots still have to pay for their own training which leads to a catch-22. If you don't have a wealthy family background then you need to get a job to save money for flight training, if you want to go down the integrated route it would need to be a very good job allowing you to save at least £10k per year if you wanted to get in before 30 unless investment returns were particularly good etc. Going down the modular route in this scenario would allow a trainee pilot to be qualified years earlier whilst staying in their job until receiving an offer from an airline. The integrated route would require someone to give up their lucrative career which has allowed them to save despite there being no guarantee of what the market would be like at the end of training. Getting back into the original career after an 18 month break might be a challenge too, especially given the gap would involve pilot training.
As a result I suspect self-funded integrated courses produce a very specific demographic of pilot, that is usually 18-25 from a wealthy family background.
Joined: Dec 2025
Aviation Qualifications: Spotter
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
From: London
Hi manflex,
Regarding no. 1, I agree that real world experience would be something more valuable for me than anything money can buy. Even testing the waters and establishing connections in other fields (mostly engineering like I mentioned before) would be a great way to build up a 'Plan B' in case aviation doesn't work out. I think that I will take your advice and go find myself a job after sixth form (although I was hoping to start working some retail jobs in S5 (Year 12 in England) and save up some money on the side), the advantages are innumerable. I have also investigated the University Air Squadrons which are run by the RAF (as well as the gliding scholarship which is available from 16 years old) and it seems like a decent way to get hands on with aircraft while doing a degree at uni. Working airside ops at my local field (EDI) might be a shout also? What do you think?
With no. 2, I was looking around at flight schools in my area (Edinburgh) and unfortunately one of my top picks (Tayside) just entered administration a few months ago. I'll keep nosing around but by the time I actually start training things could be very different. Do you think it's better to do a 'semi-integrated' (i.e. save up for the full cost and do modular in one big burst) or learn part-time on the side? My one concern with the latter is that it could take infinitely longer if training is only confined to weekends and holidays as opposed to doing it full time, especially with things like cheaper hour-building opportunities in the States (not like you can commute to Florida for a day or two!).
If you wouldn't mind, could you tell me the name of your ATO? You can PM me if it suits.
By 'school placement', do you mean the ATPL school refers students to EZY? Or it's like a tagged integrated program? And do they type rate with EZY as well?
Just a month or two ago I read about Tui offering training which is then bonded for a few years on something like a 25k salary, would you endorse this type of training or are there hidden risks involved? Many people on this forum advise to steer well clear of anything bonded but to be honest it seems like an attractive offer. At the same time, if it's too good to be true, it probably is. And money is not an issue; I would happily accept 25k for a few years if it meant being paid to fly around 737s.
That's good to hear, hopefully if I put my head down and study study study I can eventually get to the happy place
Many thanks for your reply, it's certainly been very helpful. Best of luck in your studies
Regarding no. 1, I agree that real world experience would be something more valuable for me than anything money can buy. Even testing the waters and establishing connections in other fields (mostly engineering like I mentioned before) would be a great way to build up a 'Plan B' in case aviation doesn't work out. I think that I will take your advice and go find myself a job after sixth form (although I was hoping to start working some retail jobs in S5 (Year 12 in England) and save up some money on the side), the advantages are innumerable. I have also investigated the University Air Squadrons which are run by the RAF (as well as the gliding scholarship which is available from 16 years old) and it seems like a decent way to get hands on with aircraft while doing a degree at uni. Working airside ops at my local field (EDI) might be a shout also? What do you think?
With no. 2, I was looking around at flight schools in my area (Edinburgh) and unfortunately one of my top picks (Tayside) just entered administration a few months ago. I'll keep nosing around but by the time I actually start training things could be very different. Do you think it's better to do a 'semi-integrated' (i.e. save up for the full cost and do modular in one big burst) or learn part-time on the side? My one concern with the latter is that it could take infinitely longer if training is only confined to weekends and holidays as opposed to doing it full time, especially with things like cheaper hour-building opportunities in the States (not like you can commute to Florida for a day or two!).
If you wouldn't mind, could you tell me the name of your ATO? You can PM me if it suits.
By 'school placement', do you mean the ATPL school refers students to EZY? Or it's like a tagged integrated program? And do they type rate with EZY as well?
Just a month or two ago I read about Tui offering training which is then bonded for a few years on something like a 25k salary, would you endorse this type of training or are there hidden risks involved? Many people on this forum advise to steer well clear of anything bonded but to be honest it seems like an attractive offer. At the same time, if it's too good to be true, it probably is. And money is not an issue; I would happily accept 25k for a few years if it meant being paid to fly around 737s.
That's good to hear, hopefully if I put my head down and study study study I can eventually get to the happy place
Many thanks for your reply, it's certainly been very helpful. Best of luck in your studies
Joined: Dec 2025
Aviation Qualifications: Spotter
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
From: London
Came across this thread and really got to learn alot of things. So far I have concluded integrated path is worth it , if u have ton of money lying around. Well I am wondering.
- If saving up for few years and then opting for integrated is much better or doing modular (if one can afford) alongside lifestyle. Starting modular straight now saves times but raise questions on cert reputation given Jet, BA big names hires mostly integrated.
- Another query, if saving up for integrated for few years and do it once for all suits resonable then why not might as well can look at airline cadet programms like raynier (can cost more) but job guarantee is much higher.
I am open to suggestions and different perspectives as if you were in my shoes what path you would have choosen.
Many thanks
Happy new year(in advance)
Many thanks
Happy new year(in advance)
Joined: May 2024
Posts: 82
Likes: 2
From: United Kingdom
Outside of aviation, a lot of training courses in various industries follow the integrated model, when I did the training for my current career it was definitely "integrated", however I was an employee from day one, had a wage and pension etc. so didn't have to worry about funding the training or indeed my living costs.
In aviation, even the most generous training programmes don't pay much in the way of living costs during training unless you have very few commitments, additionally you don't get the protection and rights of employment from day one of training. That might be about to change with a new training programme mooted by one of the low-cost airlines.
Even with the sponsored programmes of the past couple of years , the majority of trainee pilots still have to pay for their own training which leads to a catch-22. If you don't have a wealthy family background then you need to get a job to save money for flight training, if you want to go down the integrated route it would need to be a very good job allowing you to save at least £10k per year if you wanted to get in before 30 unless investment returns were particularly good etc. Going down the modular route in this scenario would allow a trainee pilot to be qualified years earlier whilst staying in their job until receiving an offer from an airline. The integrated route would require someone to give up their lucrative career which has allowed them to save despite there being no guarantee of what the market would be like at the end of training. Getting back into the original career after an 18 month break might be a challenge too, especially given the gap would involve pilot training.
As a result I suspect self-funded integrated courses produce a very specific demographic of pilot, that is usually 18-25 from a wealthy family background.
In aviation, even the most generous training programmes don't pay much in the way of living costs during training unless you have very few commitments, additionally you don't get the protection and rights of employment from day one of training. That might be about to change with a new training programme mooted by one of the low-cost airlines.
Even with the sponsored programmes of the past couple of years , the majority of trainee pilots still have to pay for their own training which leads to a catch-22. If you don't have a wealthy family background then you need to get a job to save money for flight training, if you want to go down the integrated route it would need to be a very good job allowing you to save at least £10k per year if you wanted to get in before 30 unless investment returns were particularly good etc. Going down the modular route in this scenario would allow a trainee pilot to be qualified years earlier whilst staying in their job until receiving an offer from an airline. The integrated route would require someone to give up their lucrative career which has allowed them to save despite there being no guarantee of what the market would be like at the end of training. Getting back into the original career after an 18 month break might be a challenge too, especially given the gap would involve pilot training.
As a result I suspect self-funded integrated courses produce a very specific demographic of pilot, that is usually 18-25 from a wealthy family background.
). Then the last part will be integrated for all my ratings and hopefully an interview and type rating. I am doing my theory with BGS which is what a lot of these integrated schools will use. If anything the ability to take in and learn information without having your hand being held is a positive in my eyes at least.I was earning good wedge managing 100+ people in a Factory then at the end of 2020 the company lost a contract and boom my job was gone and the factory closed. No job is safe regardless of how you are trained. No different to no guarantee of a job with flying. I have never felt so positive about my chances in the current climate. Brexit did a lot of trouble to the UK but one thing it did do is make the job market a hell of a lot better for people in the UK. Hence why loads of companies with EU registered planes are discounting courses to get pilots trained plus the English ones cannot just pick students from EU countries to fill their needs.
Yes the majority of those on integrated courses costing 100+k do come from rich families but if I could go back 20 years to when I was twenty and living with my parents I would be getting a HGV licence. Max out my overtime and earn 60k a year. Within 3 years you would have enough to fund a integrated course and be in the right side of a narrow body by mid twenties. That is available to anybody who is willing to put in the graft regardless of background quite easily. I wish I had my head screwed on a lot more when I was younger in that respect!
Joined: Dec 2005
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 4,972
Likes: 326
From: Hong Kong
Mine is half "modular" and half integrated. I am doing the majority of my hour building at my local airfield which is cheap @£130 an hour and is 20-30 minutes from my home. I am also doing my ATPL theory at home (Oh the joys of that ). Then the last part will be integrated for all my ratings and hopefully an interview and type rating. I am doing my theory with BGS...
). Then the last part will be integrated for all my ratings and hopefully an interview and type rating. I am doing my theory with BGS...Integrated courses are all about milking you for as much money as possible, sending you to somewhere sunny to do most of your flying in places where flying costs half as much, delaying your training in favour of any other customer who happens to be paying more than you and then wrapping it up in a glossy package that says "We're better".
but if I could go back 20 years to when I was twenty and living with my parents I would be getting a HGV licence. Max out my overtime and earn 60k a year. Within 3 years you would have enough to fund a integrated course and be in the right side of a narrow body by mid twenties. That is available to anybody who is willing to put in the graft regardless of background quite easily. I wish I had my head screwed on a lot more when I was younger in that respect!
You obviously have your class 1 medical and PPL already - what else does your local airfield offer? My advice is to do your commercial cross country and get your IMC rating as soon as you have 25 hours. Get as much IFR/XC/night hour building as you can.
That way once you have the ATPL exams your IR can be done in 10 hours.
Joined: May 2024
Posts: 82
Likes: 2
From: United Kingdom
Reality check. There's is no such thing as 'half integrated', you're going modular. It's one or the other. Some integrated providers will allow you to hold a PPL but nothing more and certainly not ATPL theory.
Integrated courses are all about milking you for as much money as possible, sending you to somewhere sunny to do most of your flying in places where flying costs half as much, delaying your training in favour of any other customer who happens to be paying more than you and then wrapping it up in a glossy package that says "We're better".
Now this you have 100% right.
You obviously have your class 1 medical and PPL already - what else does your local airfield offer? My advice is to do your commercial cross country and get your IMC rating as soon as you have 25 hours. Get as much IFR/XC/night hour building as you can.
That way once you have the ATPL exams your IR can be done in 10 hours.
Integrated courses are all about milking you for as much money as possible, sending you to somewhere sunny to do most of your flying in places where flying costs half as much, delaying your training in favour of any other customer who happens to be paying more than you and then wrapping it up in a glossy package that says "We're better".
Now this you have 100% right.
You obviously have your class 1 medical and PPL already - what else does your local airfield offer? My advice is to do your commercial cross country and get your IMC rating as soon as you have 25 hours. Get as much IFR/XC/night hour building as you can.
That way once you have the ATPL exams your IR can be done in 10 hours.
My local airfield offers night and IMC which I will be doing. I am not far off my 25 hours solo but will commit to it once I have gotten my first module out of the way on my ATPL. All my flying since passing my test has been XC as I normally book 3 hour slots. I am planning to do my commercial cross country to Holland and back with a stop in the UK to make up the requirement. It is a requirement for the place I want to do my ratings to have a 300 mile XC before which I presume is the commercial XC as I haven't read up on this yet?
Like you have mentioned it keeps my options more opened and my hours not wasted by putting as much as possible into IFR etc.
Joined: Dec 2025
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 215
Likes: 213
From: England
I think some airlines like to see that their candidates have attended a full-time integrated ATPL course at a flying school.
This is, (or was) * because students will definitely be properly trained in classrooms by professional teachers. And their flying training will be organised and scheduled, again with professional instructors. The integrated and full time structure brings with it a schedule, an organisation, a consistency, and of course the school needs to maintain a good reputation for the quality of its students.
The scheduled structure tells the airlines that a successful cadet can absorb and assimilate all the ATPL information within a certain timeframe. With modular, a student might be just as good, or might take years to complete the course. Airlines need to know that a cadet has the ability to learn and pass a new type rating, for example, within a few weeks, and pass their 6 monthly recurrent SIM exams every time.
With the modular route there is no guarantee that students will have learned the information in a classroom; in-depth and within a tight timeframe, or have just practised and practised with question banks.
There was a pilot on the Tech Log not long ago, who clearly had no idea whatsoever about the electrical generation systems in their (passenger airliner) aircraft. How could this have been if they had really studied the subject ?
Obviously, there will be plenty of modular pilots who have a full depth of knowledge, but how can airlines know ? Sadly, they won't necessarily spend the time finding out - they might take only the integrated cadets from known schools, to save them a lot of selection work. We had several airline recruiters visit our school to invite applications.
* Just my experience, you understand, based on my own training on a full-time integrated ATPL course at a well known flying school 25 years ago. I am not personally saying that modular is necessarily inferior.
(And I did my integrated full time training in the years before the school prices went really stupid).
.
This is, (or was) * because students will definitely be properly trained in classrooms by professional teachers. And their flying training will be organised and scheduled, again with professional instructors. The integrated and full time structure brings with it a schedule, an organisation, a consistency, and of course the school needs to maintain a good reputation for the quality of its students.
The scheduled structure tells the airlines that a successful cadet can absorb and assimilate all the ATPL information within a certain timeframe. With modular, a student might be just as good, or might take years to complete the course. Airlines need to know that a cadet has the ability to learn and pass a new type rating, for example, within a few weeks, and pass their 6 monthly recurrent SIM exams every time.
With the modular route there is no guarantee that students will have learned the information in a classroom; in-depth and within a tight timeframe, or have just practised and practised with question banks.
There was a pilot on the Tech Log not long ago, who clearly had no idea whatsoever about the electrical generation systems in their (passenger airliner) aircraft. How could this have been if they had really studied the subject ?
Obviously, there will be plenty of modular pilots who have a full depth of knowledge, but how can airlines know ? Sadly, they won't necessarily spend the time finding out - they might take only the integrated cadets from known schools, to save them a lot of selection work. We had several airline recruiters visit our school to invite applications.
* Just my experience, you understand, based on my own training on a full-time integrated ATPL course at a well known flying school 25 years ago. I am not personally saying that modular is necessarily inferior.
(And I did my integrated full time training in the years before the school prices went really stupid).
.
personally I’ve done a lot of safety pilot jumpseating for cadets under line training in the last 12 months and have seen a number of modular students, I’m not sure I see a correlation between modular and being of a lower quality but I will say the most at sea cadet I came across was a significantly older (over 40) man who had done a modular course, he seemed dramatically behind the curve and anecdotally I’ve heard from trainers we are failing a lot more people in line training and or doing dramatically more than the standard line training footprint since Covid, take that for what it’s worth.
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,305
Likes: 35
From: Vietnam
You basically said it was his age. Most of this is all anecdotal evidence anyway. I have sat with many low time people of both modular and Integrated and found that the amount of aviation knowledge (not flying) is a good indicator.
Can you tell me the difference between an A330 and A340? We got told a Saab 340 was infront of us and FO asked me what that was.
This is anecdotal as well but I think works better than modular Vs integrated cause I have had great from both and awful from both as well.
Can you tell me the difference between an A330 and A340? We got told a Saab 340 was infront of us and FO asked me what that was.
This is anecdotal as well but I think works better than modular Vs integrated cause I have had great from both and awful from both as well.