New Visa Requirements for Training in the U.S.A.
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 731
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From: Pacific
Gone West:
Please can you confirm that these new rules are not applicable to training for ratings and certificates if they are not used on large airplanes?
With regard to the NZ and Aus deportations, involving the use of handcuffs and treatment as criminals, I guess that is not surprising when the US govt treats its citizens the same way for being guilty of wanting to fly on an airliner as passenger or crew.
From what has been reported, the NZ guy was not even aware that he was related to Sadam (who, by the way, is not an "international terrorist" but is a head of state of a country that is accused of supporting terrorism). By declaring their intention to attend flying training while in the US on a tourist visa these guys showed they had nothing to hide, and if they had been allowed to enter they still would not have been guilty of an offence unless they did attend the course. A responsible school would have not accepted them without the appropriate visa, and should have advised them before they left NZ or Aus of the revised requirements. Furthermore, if they entered on a B1/B2 they would have been entitled to remain while they had their visa changed to a training visa. I cannot see a crime, no matter how hard I look.
Maybe you have been paying too much attention to the propaganda too?
A US citizen, treated this way, would immediately have gone looking for his lawyer, and who would blame him?
Sorry about the rant. What I really want is facts about training for ratings, as per my question above, and I hope I do not offend, but the facts on the cases of these two fellows are also important, since any of us could be caught up in the red tape as easily.
Please can you confirm that these new rules are not applicable to training for ratings and certificates if they are not used on large airplanes?
With regard to the NZ and Aus deportations, involving the use of handcuffs and treatment as criminals, I guess that is not surprising when the US govt treats its citizens the same way for being guilty of wanting to fly on an airliner as passenger or crew.
From what has been reported, the NZ guy was not even aware that he was related to Sadam (who, by the way, is not an "international terrorist" but is a head of state of a country that is accused of supporting terrorism). By declaring their intention to attend flying training while in the US on a tourist visa these guys showed they had nothing to hide, and if they had been allowed to enter they still would not have been guilty of an offence unless they did attend the course. A responsible school would have not accepted them without the appropriate visa, and should have advised them before they left NZ or Aus of the revised requirements. Furthermore, if they entered on a B1/B2 they would have been entitled to remain while they had their visa changed to a training visa. I cannot see a crime, no matter how hard I look.
Maybe you have been paying too much attention to the propaganda too?
A US citizen, treated this way, would immediately have gone looking for his lawyer, and who would blame him?
Sorry about the rant. What I really want is facts about training for ratings, as per my question above, and I hope I do not offend, but the facts on the cases of these two fellows are also important, since any of us could be caught up in the red tape as easily.
Thread Starter
The Oracle
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,902
Likes: 0
From: Naples, Florida U.S.A.
Jatin,
The information you are quoting is out of date and never was intended for Flight Training. The 18 hours per week was intended for an institution of higher learning and referred to an 18 credit hour workload. The References in that web page are geared to the F-1 Visa.
The Differences between the F-1 and M-1 can be found in:
Sec. 214.3 Petitions for approval of schools.
The INS Rules for the M-1 are here:
Sec. 214.2(m) Students in established vocational or other recognized nonacademic institutions, other than in language training programs --
This is the document which supersedes the web page you linked:
INS Proposes Significant Changes to Rules Governing Visitors and Students
And can be read the new rule making in its entirety here:
Requiring Change of Status From B to F-1 or M-1 Nonimmigrant Prior to Pursuing a Course of Study
I would also suggest that you contact your local Homeland Security Agents. I have found them to be both helpful and informative.
Take Care,
Capt. Richard J. Gentil, Pres.
Naples Air Center, Inc.
The information you are quoting is out of date and never was intended for Flight Training. The 18 hours per week was intended for an institution of higher learning and referred to an 18 credit hour workload. The References in that web page are geared to the F-1 Visa.
The Differences between the F-1 and M-1 can be found in:
Sec. 214.3 Petitions for approval of schools.
(i) F - 1 classification. The following schools may be approved for attendance by nonimmigrant students under section 101(a)(15)(F)(i) of the Act:
(A) A college or university, i.e., an institution of higher learning which awards recognized bachelor's, master's doctor's or professional degrees.
(B) A community college or junior college which provides instruction in the liberal arts or in the professions and which awards recognized associate degrees.
(C) A seminary.
(D) A conservatory.
(E) An academic high school.
(F) An elementary school.
(G) An institution which provides language training, instruction in the liberal arts or fine arts, instruction in the professions, or instruction or training in more than one of these disciplines.
(ii) M - 1 classification. The following schools are considered to be vocational or nonacademic institutions and may be approved for attendance by nonimmigrant students under section 101(a)(15)(M)(i) of the Act:
(A) A community college or junior college which provides vocational or technical training and which awards recognized associate degrees.
(B) A vocational high school.
(C) A school which provides vocational or nonacademic training other than language training.
(A) A college or university, i.e., an institution of higher learning which awards recognized bachelor's, master's doctor's or professional degrees.
(B) A community college or junior college which provides instruction in the liberal arts or in the professions and which awards recognized associate degrees.
(C) A seminary.
(D) A conservatory.
(E) An academic high school.
(F) An elementary school.
(G) An institution which provides language training, instruction in the liberal arts or fine arts, instruction in the professions, or instruction or training in more than one of these disciplines.
(ii) M - 1 classification. The following schools are considered to be vocational or nonacademic institutions and may be approved for attendance by nonimmigrant students under section 101(a)(15)(M)(i) of the Act:
(A) A community college or junior college which provides vocational or technical training and which awards recognized associate degrees.
(B) A vocational high school.
(C) A school which provides vocational or nonacademic training other than language training.
Sec. 214.2(m) Students in established vocational or other recognized nonacademic institutions, other than in language training programs --
This is the document which supersedes the web page you linked:
INS Proposes Significant Changes to Rules Governing Visitors and Students
And can be read the new rule making in its entirety here:
Requiring Change of Status From B to F-1 or M-1 Nonimmigrant Prior to Pursuing a Course of Study
I would also suggest that you contact your local Homeland Security Agents. I have found them to be both helpful and informative.
Take Care,
Capt. Richard J. Gentil, Pres.
Naples Air Center, Inc.
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 136
Likes: 0
From: Dubh linn...Eire
I know this may seem a silly question BUT?????????
Is there any complication or stipulation that when applying for a J1 visa that if you had an M1 visa previously in the same year you cannot qualify. For e.g 2months training in U.S on M1 for Jaa licensces return to U.K for groundschool and then head back state-side on J1 visa. Is this possible.
Is there any complication or stipulation that when applying for a J1 visa that if you had an M1 visa previously in the same year you cannot qualify. For e.g 2months training in U.S on M1 for Jaa licensces return to U.K for groundschool and then head back state-side on J1 visa. Is this possible.
