OAT - Please Answer!!
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 278
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From: Euroland
OAT - Please Answer!!
I've been trying to contact OAT using two numbers. One appears to be the main switch for the Airport and the other is the direct dial for customer service printed on the marketing material (which arrived 2 weeks late).
How on earth do you contact this company?? Is there another number I can try? Any direct extensions known for a CFI etc?
Thanks
VOTIME
How on earth do you contact this company?? Is there another number I can try? Any direct extensions known for a CFI etc?
Thanks
VOTIME
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 129
Likes: 0
From: West Mids
VORTIME
E mail me and I will give you a direct dial number for someone who will deal with you or at least get you into contact with the right person.
I dont want to put it on a public forum, I'm sure you understand.
TBL
E mail me and I will give you a direct dial number for someone who will deal with you or at least get you into contact with the right person.
I dont want to put it on a public forum, I'm sure you understand.
TBL
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 355
Likes: 0
Never ceases to amaze me this one.
Ok it’s a couple of years now since I was looking at FTO’s and, things were better for them then, but the total lack of interest was astonishing.
I include all the majors in this one (BAe OATS Cabair etc) If the girlies on the phone who claimed to be in ‘marketing’ worked in the real World they would be shot (or at least fired!).
Someone who is about to invest tens of thousand of pounds in their career OR ANYTHING should be treated like a God. I could not believe the apathy that existed amongst the so called ‘marketing’ departments. If you try to buy a car, double glazing or insurance at a fraction of the price you get ten times better customer ‘comfort’.
Every potential customer should feel that they are the most important person on the planet…or at least be able to get through on the phone!!
When will these people learn that the customer is King and that there are fewer around able to part with £50k or more right now.
If times are hard for FTO’s, I would suggest that they look at the way they treat illusive and vital customer enquiries then, look at the dictionary definition of the word ‘marketing’! which is NOT… ‘sanctimonious, condescending girl on a phone when, she is around to take calls’
Rant over!
I exclude Bristol from the above who, made me feel that not only did they want my money, but they wanted to help.
Ok it’s a couple of years now since I was looking at FTO’s and, things were better for them then, but the total lack of interest was astonishing.
I include all the majors in this one (BAe OATS Cabair etc) If the girlies on the phone who claimed to be in ‘marketing’ worked in the real World they would be shot (or at least fired!).
Someone who is about to invest tens of thousand of pounds in their career OR ANYTHING should be treated like a God. I could not believe the apathy that existed amongst the so called ‘marketing’ departments. If you try to buy a car, double glazing or insurance at a fraction of the price you get ten times better customer ‘comfort’.
Every potential customer should feel that they are the most important person on the planet…or at least be able to get through on the phone!!
When will these people learn that the customer is King and that there are fewer around able to part with £50k or more right now.
If times are hard for FTO’s, I would suggest that they look at the way they treat illusive and vital customer enquiries then, look at the dictionary definition of the word ‘marketing’! which is NOT… ‘sanctimonious, condescending girl on a phone when, she is around to take calls’
Rant over!
I exclude Bristol from the above who, made me feel that not only did they want my money, but they wanted to help.
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 112
Likes: 0
From: Essex
Clear prop I totally agree, I drove from London to visit OAT, I must admit I didn't have an appointment, but they could have been at least a little bit helpful. Instead I just about managed to get a training booklet out of them before the 2 hour drive home. Bristol on the other hand are always very polite and helpful.
Anyway back to the Air law folder
Anyway back to the Air law folder
Why do it if it's not fun?
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 4,782
Likes: 12
From: Bournemouth
I have to agree. Response times are very important.
This is true for anything, of course - it was a big factor in choosing a school for a distance learning course. I figured that if they didn't respond quickly to my original query for information, how long would it take to mark progress tests? Or to help me out if I got stuck? Especially for distance learning, when I'm not going to be within a suitable distance from the school to be able to knock on someone's door and hastle them.
I'd advice all schools to make sure you've got someone answering phones promptly, and replying to postal queries (by first class post if possible), e-mails and faxes the same day.
FFF
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This is true for anything, of course - it was a big factor in choosing a school for a distance learning course. I figured that if they didn't respond quickly to my original query for information, how long would it take to mark progress tests? Or to help me out if I got stuck? Especially for distance learning, when I'm not going to be within a suitable distance from the school to be able to knock on someone's door and hastle them.
I'd advice all schools to make sure you've got someone answering phones promptly, and replying to postal queries (by first class post if possible), e-mails and faxes the same day.
FFF
----------
Ground instructor
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
From: UK
Unconditional personal apology
VORTIME
I cannot answer for the company here at OAS, but I personally acknowledge that this has been a problem in the past.
The new management is aware of the problem and will deal with it. A recent change in the telephone network has not helped. The following link should give you all the contact information you need.
http://www.oxfordaviation.net/oxford/index.htm
Failing this contact me and I'll pass on your details for immediate contact.
Regards to all potential customers and current ones, and thanks to Boy Lard for your input.
PFD
I cannot answer for the company here at OAS, but I personally acknowledge that this has been a problem in the past.
The new management is aware of the problem and will deal with it. A recent change in the telephone network has not helped. The following link should give you all the contact information you need.
http://www.oxfordaviation.net/oxford/index.htm
Failing this contact me and I'll pass on your details for immediate contact.
Regards to all potential customers and current ones, and thanks to Boy Lard for your input.
PFD
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 278
Likes: 0
From: Euroland
Err!!!
Ok, I've tried 4 differnet numbers now including direct lines. I sure wish I could manage your marketing department - a commission on all these lost sales would be great!!
However, customer satisfaction obviously isn't a concern...further to posting an apology, it might be nice to answer the phones today!
You've lost my business, wipe 50k from the books this year...giving Bristol a call now...
However, customer satisfaction obviously isn't a concern...further to posting an apology, it might be nice to answer the phones today!
You've lost my business, wipe 50k from the books this year...giving Bristol a call now...
Joined: Feb 2000
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 17,503
Likes: 1,845
From: England
If you buy a £50,000 car the dealer is going to make something like £7,500 out of you + servicing and repeat business.
A large FTO might make £1,000 out of you and then you're off over the horizon.
As a PPL instructor I saw the books at my little school. They made £300 out of each student. Over three weeks.
The fact that the student is paying big money but the school only makes small money is the reason why there is so much antagonism between school and student. Students expectations are high. Schools margins are low.
WWW
A large FTO might make £1,000 out of you and then you're off over the horizon.
As a PPL instructor I saw the books at my little school. They made £300 out of each student. Over three weeks.
The fact that the student is paying big money but the school only makes small money is the reason why there is so much antagonism between school and student. Students expectations are high. Schools margins are low.
WWW
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 683
Likes: 34
From: Over here but sometimes over there.
There have been hundreds of postings here about OAT.I cannot think of one that ever slated the standard of Instructing or the Instructors,it was always the Admin and Sales staff.(Perhaps that`s where the cut backs should be made.)
Anyway over the last couple of months I have visited a couple of local Schools regarding a CPL course and some hours building after I have finished the ATPL`s.One couldn`t be bothered to answer my e-mails,the other did.I then picked a rainy day and went and visited both schools as there was a likelihood of students and Instructors being grounded due to the weather.
One school gave me a quick run round the premises and scribbled some prices on a bit of scrap paper.
The other I was there for over 2 hrs,chatting to Instructors and Students.Given access to the last 2 yrs worth of students and told to contact any I wished.
They send me their Club news letter when I am not a member and keep in touch.
Only little things I know ,but guess who`s getting my Business??
Anyway over the last couple of months I have visited a couple of local Schools regarding a CPL course and some hours building after I have finished the ATPL`s.One couldn`t be bothered to answer my e-mails,the other did.I then picked a rainy day and went and visited both schools as there was a likelihood of students and Instructors being grounded due to the weather.
One school gave me a quick run round the premises and scribbled some prices on a bit of scrap paper.
The other I was there for over 2 hrs,chatting to Instructors and Students.Given access to the last 2 yrs worth of students and told to contact any I wished.
They send me their Club news letter when I am not a member and keep in touch.
Only little things I know ,but guess who`s getting my Business??
Last edited by Delta Wun-Wun; 21st May 2002 at 17:17.
Jet Blast Rat
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,081
Likes: 0
From: Sarfend-on-Sea
FFF in my experience of the students I have helped through groundschool tuition who were distance learning Bristol had easily the best response times. Worksheets were typically marked and in the post the day they were received, with worked solutions to any incorrect questions.
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 129
Likes: 0
From: West Mids
VORTIME,
If you were going to spend £50K on a car/house/investment I would sincerly hope that you would wait to see what each thing had to offer before throwing in the towel that easily!
Personally I had so much trouble pinning people down (Before I joined) I flew in unannounced (To marketing obviously) to try and catch them unawares!
You have had two people from OATS, one and instructor and one a student offering you help, neither of whom will make a single cent out of you being there. Doesnt this tell you something about the place? It may be difficult to get answers, it may be frustrating and some,but once you are here there are a great bunch of instructors who regularly give up their free time/breaks/lunch hours to help students who are struggling one on one.
I hope you change your mind, but if you dont I really hope that you dont give in as easily as this at the first obstacle when it comes to flying!
Maybe see you at OATS, maybe not
TBL
If you were going to spend £50K on a car/house/investment I would sincerly hope that you would wait to see what each thing had to offer before throwing in the towel that easily!
Personally I had so much trouble pinning people down (Before I joined) I flew in unannounced (To marketing obviously) to try and catch them unawares!
You have had two people from OATS, one and instructor and one a student offering you help, neither of whom will make a single cent out of you being there. Doesnt this tell you something about the place? It may be difficult to get answers, it may be frustrating and some,but once you are here there are a great bunch of instructors who regularly give up their free time/breaks/lunch hours to help students who are struggling one on one.
I hope you change your mind, but if you dont I really hope that you dont give in as easily as this at the first obstacle when it comes to flying!
Maybe see you at OATS, maybe not
TBL
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 355
Likes: 0
The Boy Lard
I don’t think anyone here has questioned the abilities of the instructors at OATS BAe Cabair etc
I have personal experience of two of these FTO's and the standards of teaching is excellent at both.
You seem to miss the point of this thread which revolves around the fact that the 'front of house' at all major schools is crap,…to say the least.
These schools pay marketing girls in the region of £15 to £20k PA I suspect and they are doing their instructors and employers a disservice.
WWW, this is not about PPL schools and clubs, they can be excused, but £m turnover companies cannot, and should get their act together.
By the way Boy Lard I am so impressed that you ‘flew in to see them’!!!....most of us lesser mortals had to resort to the humble 'phone
I don’t think anyone here has questioned the abilities of the instructors at OATS BAe Cabair etc
I have personal experience of two of these FTO's and the standards of teaching is excellent at both.
You seem to miss the point of this thread which revolves around the fact that the 'front of house' at all major schools is crap,…to say the least.
These schools pay marketing girls in the region of £15 to £20k PA I suspect and they are doing their instructors and employers a disservice.
WWW, this is not about PPL schools and clubs, they can be excused, but £m turnover companies cannot, and should get their act together.
By the way Boy Lard I am so impressed that you ‘flew in to see them’!!!....most of us lesser mortals had to resort to the humble 'phone
Last edited by clear prop!!!; 21st May 2002 at 19:31.
Jet Blast Rat
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,081
Likes: 0
From: Sarfend-on-Sea
Some schools realise that good admin and flight operations are just as important to a student as the quality of the instruction. It is hard to be happy and settled enough for successful studies if admin problems keep cropping up. There are several around that realise this, and others that don't. As the employee of an FTO I cannot really fairly list which I know of that I consider fall into each category. I would recommend you choose a few to visit and judge for yourself.
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 129
Likes: 0
From: West Mids
I wasnt going to allow myself to try and defend myself but I'm tired of people bashing OATS and people who post and have a go at someone trying to help.
Clearprop please read:
"Personally I had so much trouble pinning people down (Before I joined) I flew in unannounced (To marketing obviously) to try and catch them unawares!"
ie I was having immense trouble with front of house too, but AFTER many many phone calls like the mere mortal I am, I decided to take a different tack and fly in, theres more than one way of cracking a nut.
I offered to help VORTIME because, guess what, I know how difficult it is to get through to the right person.
I am quite confident that I didnt misss the thrust of this thread, I was just disappointed that VORTIME was "giving in so easily" (My words)
My reference to the instructors was to try and show that the "perceived attitude" of the Marketing department does not run through the school, as you rightly say the instructors are excellent, and its a shame for VORTIME to miss out on at least the opportunity to make an informed decision.
VORTIME if you read this and you would still like to visit mail me your number and I will have a senior ground instructor give you a call.
Cheers
TBL
Clearprop please read:
"Personally I had so much trouble pinning people down (Before I joined) I flew in unannounced (To marketing obviously) to try and catch them unawares!"
ie I was having immense trouble with front of house too, but AFTER many many phone calls like the mere mortal I am, I decided to take a different tack and fly in, theres more than one way of cracking a nut.
I offered to help VORTIME because, guess what, I know how difficult it is to get through to the right person.
I am quite confident that I didnt misss the thrust of this thread, I was just disappointed that VORTIME was "giving in so easily" (My words)
My reference to the instructors was to try and show that the "perceived attitude" of the Marketing department does not run through the school, as you rightly say the instructors are excellent, and its a shame for VORTIME to miss out on at least the opportunity to make an informed decision.
VORTIME if you read this and you would still like to visit mail me your number and I will have a senior ground instructor give you a call.
Cheers
TBL
Ground instructor
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
From: UK
No reply from VORTIME
Dear Pruners and VORTIME
Since my post yesterday requesting VT to get in touch I have had no response either here or via email. We checked the telephone numbers on the website this morning. One went through to our Front desk and the other to an answer service in marketing, which I don't like, but it was early.
Also on the contact page are email addresses and a fax.
Since I have had no reply to my offers of help I have to conclude one of 2 things.
1. Either this is a wind up by a sad individual possibly from a rival company (the paranoid answer).
or
2. VT has thoroughly researched this, and has decided to go elsewhere.
I just hope his or her decision has not been based just on the fact that where he's going to answered the phone. Make sure you talk to current customers if possible.
My offer of help still stands, I would be the first to admit that we are not perfect in the Initial contact department, but we are trying to improve.
Regards and good luck to all.
PFD
Since my post yesterday requesting VT to get in touch I have had no response either here or via email. We checked the telephone numbers on the website this morning. One went through to our Front desk and the other to an answer service in marketing, which I don't like, but it was early.
Also on the contact page are email addresses and a fax.
Since I have had no reply to my offers of help I have to conclude one of 2 things.
1. Either this is a wind up by a sad individual possibly from a rival company (the paranoid answer).
or
2. VT has thoroughly researched this, and has decided to go elsewhere.
I just hope his or her decision has not been based just on the fact that where he's going to answered the phone. Make sure you talk to current customers if possible.
My offer of help still stands, I would be the first to admit that we are not perfect in the Initial contact department, but we are trying to improve.
Regards and good luck to all.
PFD
Why do it if it's not fun?
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 4,782
Likes: 12
From: Bournemouth
Send Clowns,
I'm not surprised when you say that Bristol students get the best response times in your experience. When I was looking for information from schools, they were the second quickest in getting back to me, and this was a big factor in choosing to study with them. (Can't actually remember who the quickest was - I have the full list at home, but whoever was quickest I rejected for some other reason.)
I can also confirm that, now I'm well into my studies, there response times are excellent. I generally e-mail my progress tests to them, and always get a response within one working day (with one exception, when Noush apologised for the delay, which was because she was away from the office for a few days).
I can't help think that the fast responses to initial inquiries and the fast responses to progress tests are connected.
(Although admittedly, as Delta Wun Wun says, there have been many complaints here about the admin part of OATS, but none at all about their instructors - and this contradicts my assertion that the two are connected.)
FFF
--------------
I'm not surprised when you say that Bristol students get the best response times in your experience. When I was looking for information from schools, they were the second quickest in getting back to me, and this was a big factor in choosing to study with them. (Can't actually remember who the quickest was - I have the full list at home, but whoever was quickest I rejected for some other reason.)
I can also confirm that, now I'm well into my studies, there response times are excellent. I generally e-mail my progress tests to them, and always get a response within one working day (with one exception, when Noush apologised for the delay, which was because she was away from the office for a few days).
I can't help think that the fast responses to initial inquiries and the fast responses to progress tests are connected.
(Although admittedly, as Delta Wun Wun says, there have been many complaints here about the admin part of OATS, but none at all about their instructors - and this contradicts my assertion that the two are connected.)
FFF
--------------
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 317
Likes: 0
From: UK
OATS
You're not alone in struggling to get anyone in OATS Marketing to call. Never in my life have I been ignored so many times when about to grease an organisation's palms with over £50 000 - I can only presume they are so flooded with cash as to not need such a meagre sum!!
This week I have left two messages to call back about course dates and I am on the standby list for August and have been down to see them personally for two hours plus been to two open days in the last 12 months. It's not as if I'm a time-waster - they are my number 1 choice for FTO BUT I am having reservations if this is how they are treating me before I pay them.
It isn't unfairly bashing OATS to expect them to return calls like every other service-orientated organisation or better still maybe they could actually pay someone to occasionally answer the phone - novel idea I know!!
OATS - you have a SERIOUS customer service problem.
Desk-pilot - sick of calling 01865-844253 and leaving messages for Susan Price.
This week I have left two messages to call back about course dates and I am on the standby list for August and have been down to see them personally for two hours plus been to two open days in the last 12 months. It's not as if I'm a time-waster - they are my number 1 choice for FTO BUT I am having reservations if this is how they are treating me before I pay them.
It isn't unfairly bashing OATS to expect them to return calls like every other service-orientated organisation or better still maybe they could actually pay someone to occasionally answer the phone - novel idea I know!!
OATS - you have a SERIOUS customer service problem.
Desk-pilot - sick of calling 01865-844253 and leaving messages for Susan Price.