Advice for a supportive dad
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Advice for a supportive dad
I hope this is the appropriate place for me to post this thread, but I am looking for advice to support my son.
He is 16 and has just started a BTEC in Electrical and Mechanical engineering to support a carrer path that for the last few years he has been solid on (that of becoming an Aircraft Engineer). He has always talked of wishing to be a pilot but it his never been his first career path but over the last few months he has been asking us more about chosing this path.
I have read a number of posts on this site and generally observe that it is expensive and the number of opportunities are limited but we would like to support him if he is serious about this career choice.
The reason for this posting is to get advice on how best to support this. Talking to him, his first choice would be small private aircraft market (eg Exec Jets, pleasure flights etc as opposed to commercial big jets.
He is in the Air Cadets and has had 3 flights in a Grob Tutor and has taken controls for 20 minute in each flight.
The main advice I am after is if we support this training financialy, what would be the correct course of exams to take and are people able to give indicative costs ?
Also we would be interested to know the route into jobs in this area and average ages and whether it is normal to do this training alongside another career path (eg continuing to study and persue a career as an aircraft engineer).
I know some of this is vague and may spawn additional questions but any advice would be appreciated and I am happy to be contacted outside of this forum if that is more appropriate.
best regards
R
He is 16 and has just started a BTEC in Electrical and Mechanical engineering to support a carrer path that for the last few years he has been solid on (that of becoming an Aircraft Engineer). He has always talked of wishing to be a pilot but it his never been his first career path but over the last few months he has been asking us more about chosing this path.
I have read a number of posts on this site and generally observe that it is expensive and the number of opportunities are limited but we would like to support him if he is serious about this career choice.
The reason for this posting is to get advice on how best to support this. Talking to him, his first choice would be small private aircraft market (eg Exec Jets, pleasure flights etc as opposed to commercial big jets.
He is in the Air Cadets and has had 3 flights in a Grob Tutor and has taken controls for 20 minute in each flight.
The main advice I am after is if we support this training financialy, what would be the correct course of exams to take and are people able to give indicative costs ?
Also we would be interested to know the route into jobs in this area and average ages and whether it is normal to do this training alongside another career path (eg continuing to study and persue a career as an aircraft engineer).
I know some of this is vague and may spawn additional questions but any advice would be appreciated and I am happy to be contacted outside of this forum if that is more appropriate.
best regards
R
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Downloaded "So you want to be a pilot"
Have just browsed further and have downloaded the recommened reading(many thanks for link).
Any other guidance / advice wold be apprecited.
Any other guidance / advice wold be apprecited.
Join Date: Sep 2005
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how about getting started by going into gliding? that will help to see if he has the appitude to fly and is cheap. Or even join on of the air cadet gliding schools as an instructor? Presumably you are not wanting to pay for the 60 grand plus that the big schools charge.
So tell him to start one step at a time, glide, get PPL, build up hours, do ATPL written exams, etc etc. I bet he will come out a better hands on pilot than some rich kid thats been to an expensive flight school...
So tell him to start one step at a time, glide, get PPL, build up hours, do ATPL written exams, etc etc. I bet he will come out a better hands on pilot than some rich kid thats been to an expensive flight school...
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Well, he could start out by getting a PPL and see what flying is all about.
FWIW, personally I think being an engineer is more intellectually rewarding and better return for the money. If he were to pursue this path, he would end up with a better all-around appreciation of the industry and with the means to fund any CPL training he might wish to take without putting any undue strain on the family finances. He would also have a transferrable skill.
Other than that, I would suggest to get in touch with your local aviation community and listen to what they say. btw, mostly everyone appreciates a hand with washing the planes/passing the tools/tidying up the workshop... if I were a 16 y.o. with an interest in aviation, I know were I would be
Crossed posts with UAV--same gist
FWIW, personally I think being an engineer is more intellectually rewarding and better return for the money. If he were to pursue this path, he would end up with a better all-around appreciation of the industry and with the means to fund any CPL training he might wish to take without putting any undue strain on the family finances. He would also have a transferrable skill.
Other than that, I would suggest to get in touch with your local aviation community and listen to what they say. btw, mostly everyone appreciates a hand with washing the planes/passing the tools/tidying up the workshop... if I were a 16 y.o. with an interest in aviation, I know were I would be
Crossed posts with UAV--same gist
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do a google for gapen guide for future pilots or something like that, it lists all the diff ways and costs.
for an airline job you will be looking at spending between 30-80,000!
for an airline job you will be looking at spending between 30-80,000!
Slogger
My son is just about to start his first airline job having been to university and then Oxford Aviation Training. It is very hard to predict the state of the market when your son is old enough but it is fair to assume that the "getting a job" part is the hardest bit. At the moment there are one or two "sponsorship" deals that help a bit with the up front cost. They get their money back one way or another but do at least offer a definite job at the end of training which removes a lot of the stress.
What to do now ? Encourage science subjects rather than arts, continue with Air training Corps and other out of school activities that look good on a CV. If he goes to university he may want to think about the University Air Squadron (although he will at least have to pretend to be interested in the RAF). Visit the Oxford website. Although you will see many opinions about OAT on this forum their website will give you a good idea of ways and means and cost. (reckon £65000 plus living fot 2 years).
Good luck to him and you and please PM me if I can be of any further assistance.
TL
My son is just about to start his first airline job having been to university and then Oxford Aviation Training. It is very hard to predict the state of the market when your son is old enough but it is fair to assume that the "getting a job" part is the hardest bit. At the moment there are one or two "sponsorship" deals that help a bit with the up front cost. They get their money back one way or another but do at least offer a definite job at the end of training which removes a lot of the stress.
What to do now ? Encourage science subjects rather than arts, continue with Air training Corps and other out of school activities that look good on a CV. If he goes to university he may want to think about the University Air Squadron (although he will at least have to pretend to be interested in the RAF). Visit the Oxford website. Although you will see many opinions about OAT on this forum their website will give you a good idea of ways and means and cost. (reckon £65000 plus living fot 2 years).
Good luck to him and you and please PM me if I can be of any further assistance.
TL
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GAPAN is definately a must: http://www.gapan.org/careers/aptitude.htm
There are lots of hoops to jump through. The essentials are; a good aptitude, medical, education (science/maths gcse/alevel) and money to pay for the training (or security for loans) etc.
There are lots of hoops to jump through. The essentials are; a good aptitude, medical, education (science/maths gcse/alevel) and money to pay for the training (or security for loans) etc.
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I'd say, let him finish the program in mechanics ofcourse. It's nice to have a backup incase airlines don't work out. Check around to see if your son will reach an age requirement (and holds a working permit or permanent resident for that country if required) for an airline cadet program (they pay for all the training). If there isn't and he wants to get his private and commercial license, I suggest going to Canada or USA for flight training as it is cheaper, especially since most airports here don't have landing fees.
If you do find a cadet program he will be soon able to apply for. I'd suggest doing a cat. 1 medical exam to make sure he can atleast become a commercial pilot and then get him into some basic flight training, atleast up until he goes solo once. It would be a lot easier during flight grading since he has to demonstrate that he can learn very fast. And if he doesn't get in the first year, not to worry, most people don't. The fact that he'd have a diploma in an aviation related course would mean he could still be working within the industry while he waits to apply again.
He's still young, lots of time.
If you do find a cadet program he will be soon able to apply for. I'd suggest doing a cat. 1 medical exam to make sure he can atleast become a commercial pilot and then get him into some basic flight training, atleast up until he goes solo once. It would be a lot easier during flight grading since he has to demonstrate that he can learn very fast. And if he doesn't get in the first year, not to worry, most people don't. The fact that he'd have a diploma in an aviation related course would mean he could still be working within the industry while he waits to apply again.
He's still young, lots of time.
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The plan ???
All,
many thanks for taking the time to reply and you supportive words and advice.
Having taken your advice and read thru the available materials / researched the net etc, to get him to a level where he would be "qualified" to obtain a career in his current preferred field (ie small aircraft, exec jets, air taxi etc) am I correct in assuming the following path /costs ( i have used a UK based private flying school ie Bristl Airport as a baseline)
PPL - c £3k
PPL - Night Rating c £1k
PPL - IMC c £2.5k
PPL - Multi Engine c £2.5K
CPL - c £5.5k
CPL - IR c £12.5k
I assume these costs are to qualify only and some additional cost will need to be build in to maintain / build flight hours experience ?
I think I will be advising him to continue his studies and obtain work in the aircraft industry (voluntary work as well looks to be a commom thread!) and then work towards his flying qualifications over the next 5 years.
Any validation of the above (or counter comments / corrections) would be appreciated......
R
many thanks for taking the time to reply and you supportive words and advice.
Having taken your advice and read thru the available materials / researched the net etc, to get him to a level where he would be "qualified" to obtain a career in his current preferred field (ie small aircraft, exec jets, air taxi etc) am I correct in assuming the following path /costs ( i have used a UK based private flying school ie Bristl Airport as a baseline)
PPL - c £3k
PPL - Night Rating c £1k
PPL - IMC c £2.5k
PPL - Multi Engine c £2.5K
CPL - c £5.5k
CPL - IR c £12.5k
I assume these costs are to qualify only and some additional cost will need to be build in to maintain / build flight hours experience ?
I think I will be advising him to continue his studies and obtain work in the aircraft industry (voluntary work as well looks to be a commom thread!) and then work towards his flying qualifications over the next 5 years.
Any validation of the above (or counter comments / corrections) would be appreciated......
R
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Just to correct you slightly, The order of things will be:
PPL
Night Rating
ATPL Theory Exams
Hour Building
CPL
ME Rating
ME IR Rating
MCC
In the UK the modular route will cost around £50k and the integrated will be around £85k, approximately anyway. You don't need to do an IMC rating. Also if he is serious about doing this as a career get him down to the CAA at Gatwick to do a Class 1 medical. Without this medical he cannot be a professional pilot.
PPL
Night Rating
ATPL Theory Exams
Hour Building
CPL
ME Rating
ME IR Rating
MCC
In the UK the modular route will cost around £50k and the integrated will be around £85k, approximately anyway. You don't need to do an IMC rating. Also if he is serious about doing this as a career get him down to the CAA at Gatwick to do a Class 1 medical. Without this medical he cannot be a professional pilot.
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Prior to starting the CPL you will also need hour building, and ground school.
He will need to have 150 hours total time, 100 of which must be P1 (pilot in command ie solo flight time)
And also ground school, 14 subjects approx around £2300 for full time ground school, then 14 exams at £62 each.
I see you are in North Wales, there is a couple of flight training schools at Hawarden, might be worth a visit although they dont offer commercial training but the PPL and hours building can be done there. There might even be oppurtunity for work experiance there.
Canarvon and Welshpool also offer PPL training and hour building.
I had always wanted to fly with the RAF, so joined Air Cadets etc, applied to RAF for aircrew but eyesight let me down, so joined as an engineer instead, I enjoyed it but still really wanted to fly, so left RAF and started the long road to saving enough cash to be able to fund it. I am now qualified and looking for a job, but its nice to have eng quals to fall back on.
Regards
NT
He will need to have 150 hours total time, 100 of which must be P1 (pilot in command ie solo flight time)
And also ground school, 14 subjects approx around £2300 for full time ground school, then 14 exams at £62 each.
I see you are in North Wales, there is a couple of flight training schools at Hawarden, might be worth a visit although they dont offer commercial training but the PPL and hours building can be done there. There might even be oppurtunity for work experiance there.
Canarvon and Welshpool also offer PPL training and hour building.
I had always wanted to fly with the RAF, so joined Air Cadets etc, applied to RAF for aircrew but eyesight let me down, so joined as an engineer instead, I enjoyed it but still really wanted to fly, so left RAF and started the long road to saving enough cash to be able to fund it. I am now qualified and looking for a job, but its nice to have eng quals to fall back on.
Regards
NT
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