Tax relief on training.
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I was told that if you could show that you will be flying clients around as part of your business then you could at least claim the VAT back - not sure about any tax breaks though
Join Date: Dec 1999
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Tax breaks for self-funded type ratings?
I have recently been offered a job with an airline on the condition that I pay for a type rating. I was wondering whether the Inland Revenue would see any part of this as being tax deductable? To make matters clear, I would be an employee (not self-employed or freelance) only working for one company. I don't think i would actually be an employee until completion of the rating...if that makes a difference.
Does anybody out there in PPRuNEland have any ideas or similar experiences?
Thanks
Does anybody out there in PPRuNEland have any ideas or similar experiences?
Thanks
Join Date: Feb 2005
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Yes there is tax breaks available. As you would imagine those guys up there that run at Oxford are on it all ready.
They have arranged tax breaks for the APP student they are sending down to Excell to do self funded type ratings.
The cheeky buggers are are even bunging aload of their APP students initial fATPL training on to the tax man as well!
Im sure Gordon and his mates will be on to it pretty quick just as they were when we used to get NCVQ relif on our flying.
Ironic isnt it - us Modular guys are now subsidising Oxfords APP graduates Initial fATPL training and Type training through our taxes!
They have arranged tax breaks for the APP student they are sending down to Excell to do self funded type ratings.
The cheeky buggers are are even bunging aload of their APP students initial fATPL training on to the tax man as well!
Im sure Gordon and his mates will be on to it pretty quick just as they were when we used to get NCVQ relif on our flying.
Ironic isnt it - us Modular guys are now subsidising Oxfords APP graduates Initial fATPL training and Type training through our taxes!
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Funnily enough, balpa's tax advisor reckons that the training required to get the job would not be tax deductable...otherwise all university students could claim that their education was essential in getting certain jobs. Gordon would be very upset then!
I wonder what the score really is?
I wonder what the score really is?
Part of your problem lies with the fact that if you are paying for your type rating with a UK company which you will subsequently be working for, the company will claim back tax relief on your training at the full corporate rate - so the tax relief will be going to them and not you.
This is common. All airlines in the UK who charge you the full cost of your type rating are actually making money out of you when it comes to tax paying time. Sounds unfair - that's because it is! But the pilot workforce have only themselves to blame as they are only too willing to pay for their own training to get that first job.
I look forward to the time when demand outstrips supply again and this sharp practice ceases.
This is common. All airlines in the UK who charge you the full cost of your type rating are actually making money out of you when it comes to tax paying time. Sounds unfair - that's because it is! But the pilot workforce have only themselves to blame as they are only too willing to pay for their own training to get that first job.
I look forward to the time when demand outstrips supply again and this sharp practice ceases.
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You cannot claim for expenses that put you in a position to undertake or obtain that employment. You could claim for expenses that are incurred wholly, exclusively and necessarily in carrying out that employment.
What this means simply is, if your current employer ( not future employer) requires you to carry out a type rating for which they will not pay, then you are eligible to submit a claim for the costs of doing so which the revenue may accept are wholly and exclusively incurred in this sole pursuit, and which are absolutely necessary.
If you are offered employment on the condition you obtain a type rating at your own expense, that does not qualify. This would be an expense that was incurred to enable you to be in a position to obtain employment.
I will try and find the exact wording on the inland revenues website, but you can ask your local revenue office for more details.
Dan.
Those companies cannot actually do that. If what you are suggesting is they charge an individual the full cost of providing the service, and then subsequently claim back from the revenue the same amount as an incurred business expense. That would likely be fraudulant. If they subsidize the cost, or claim the allowance for the accepted provision of the business services that is a different matter. Of course the individuals contribution would also be considered as income to the business, and treated accordingly for tax purposes.
What this means simply is, if your current employer ( not future employer) requires you to carry out a type rating for which they will not pay, then you are eligible to submit a claim for the costs of doing so which the revenue may accept are wholly and exclusively incurred in this sole pursuit, and which are absolutely necessary.
If you are offered employment on the condition you obtain a type rating at your own expense, that does not qualify. This would be an expense that was incurred to enable you to be in a position to obtain employment.
I will try and find the exact wording on the inland revenues website, but you can ask your local revenue office for more details.
Dan.
Those companies cannot actually do that. If what you are suggesting is they charge an individual the full cost of providing the service, and then subsequently claim back from the revenue the same amount as an incurred business expense. That would likely be fraudulant. If they subsidize the cost, or claim the allowance for the accepted provision of the business services that is a different matter. Of course the individuals contribution would also be considered as income to the business, and treated accordingly for tax purposes.
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Im really not that clear. How are Oxford Aviation and Excell able to save the APP graduates Tax on both the cost incurred in getting the b 737 type rating and Jet MCC/JOT traning then?
Join Date: Jan 2005
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Yes Im a Capt on heavy jets, I hate the idea of all these self funded people, its destrying the terms and conditions of existing aircrew, and its also making a mokery of any company loyalty.
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Bealzebub has it right: I went into this with the tax man some time ago.
The only glimmer of light is that you may claim back the VAT. To do this you would need to set up a company (~£200) and have the course invoiced to that company.
Could save you a bob or two.
Good luck.
The only glimmer of light is that you may claim back the VAT. To do this you would need to set up a company (~£200) and have the course invoiced to that company.
Could save you a bob or two.
Good luck.
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With the greatest of respect Captain at your cervix73 - bollocks then to what you think about us wanabees trying every trick left to us in the book to break into this business.
If shelling out £20k for a self funded type rating gets me in the game to one day become a Captain like your good self i`l do it gladly and to hell with how it effects your salary, pension, terms and conditions and time off - Ive got to eat as well!
If shelling out £20k for a self funded type rating gets me in the game to one day become a Captain like your good self i`l do it gladly and to hell with how it effects your salary, pension, terms and conditions and time off - Ive got to eat as well!
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Father Murray....as a FRESHLY qualified captain......who 4 years ago was scratching around in 152's, and anything else with wings that I could fly, Im afraid your response typifies the "I want it all now!" culture. Dont think for one second that I dont know how it feels to be a wannabe, I had 5 years of it!
Regardless of whether you are 20 something, or the wrong side of 30 (like I am) the simple fact of the matter is this, you pay for your type, your going to be paying for line training, then dont be surprised if you have to pay for LST's, recurrency, and anything else an airline that can see how desperate you are to part with your money will find they can squeeze out of you.
As for how it affects my terms and conditions, that will be negligable, the only person you will penalise is yourself and those in a similar position to yourself, you will be saddled with more debt, a lower salary oh and lest I forget the on-going costs of training. Father Murray, you are the ruination of this industry(along with plenty of other sheep) who if they used a little more common sense, a lot less impatience and foolishness, would in all probabilty get a decent flying job, without having to outlay a penny.
One last thing, if your paying for a type rating, you havent exhausted every trick in the book, all your doing is throwing money at the problem.
Regardless of whether you are 20 something, or the wrong side of 30 (like I am) the simple fact of the matter is this, you pay for your type, your going to be paying for line training, then dont be surprised if you have to pay for LST's, recurrency, and anything else an airline that can see how desperate you are to part with your money will find they can squeeze out of you.
As for how it affects my terms and conditions, that will be negligable, the only person you will penalise is yourself and those in a similar position to yourself, you will be saddled with more debt, a lower salary oh and lest I forget the on-going costs of training. Father Murray, you are the ruination of this industry(along with plenty of other sheep) who if they used a little more common sense, a lot less impatience and foolishness, would in all probabilty get a decent flying job, without having to outlay a penny.
One last thing, if your paying for a type rating, you havent exhausted every trick in the book, all your doing is throwing money at the problem.
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No tax deductions as far as I understand. ALthough, once you are rated you can always work for an airline in a tax-free country that wants rated pilots (ie putting it the other way around).
And ignore these other comments... If you believe buying a type rating puts you just 1 year closer to a job, go compare the numbers between instructing for a year, and paying for a rating and then being employed for the remaining 11 months. And I know where I would rather be at the end of the year...
Oh, and not even in America are they paying for recurrent training.
And ignore these other comments... If you believe buying a type rating puts you just 1 year closer to a job, go compare the numbers between instructing for a year, and paying for a rating and then being employed for the remaining 11 months. And I know where I would rather be at the end of the year...
Oh, and not even in America are they paying for recurrent training.
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Paying for type ratings etc
Atyercervix73 and others.
Curious as to what those who are currently employed, who claim to be affected by the Wannabes desire to start on the ladder of employment etc etc are willing to do to help rectify the situation?
If we are all in this together and it is acknowledged that you have a more powerful voice than us, how will you help us to help you?
Will you ballot BALPA? Will you form an alliance and write collectively to the airlines or the Government? Will you lobby the Training / Recruitment Captains whilst down route?
Or as I suspect.............
Will you do nothing!
If anyone actually thinks that paying £X,000s is what we want to do. Think again. I want to be employed for the merits I have to offer the company. The loyalty and professionalism I will show in exchange for the training and a fair wage representative of my experience. Unfortunately, it would appear that market forces don't have a conscience or understand the meaning of sympathy.
Until such times as they do, or the market swings in our favour and whilst humans need sustenance to exist, you will get Wannabes who feel they have nowhere else to turn or nothing else they can do.
Airline profit margins are not huge and they are businesses. I don’t support it, but I understand it.
Soap box away now.
Curious as to what those who are currently employed, who claim to be affected by the Wannabes desire to start on the ladder of employment etc etc are willing to do to help rectify the situation?
If we are all in this together and it is acknowledged that you have a more powerful voice than us, how will you help us to help you?
Will you ballot BALPA? Will you form an alliance and write collectively to the airlines or the Government? Will you lobby the Training / Recruitment Captains whilst down route?
Or as I suspect.............
Will you do nothing!
If anyone actually thinks that paying £X,000s is what we want to do. Think again. I want to be employed for the merits I have to offer the company. The loyalty and professionalism I will show in exchange for the training and a fair wage representative of my experience. Unfortunately, it would appear that market forces don't have a conscience or understand the meaning of sympathy.
Until such times as they do, or the market swings in our favour and whilst humans need sustenance to exist, you will get Wannabes who feel they have nowhere else to turn or nothing else they can do.
Airline profit margins are not huge and they are businesses. I don’t support it, but I understand it.
Soap box away now.
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Bealzebub,
That's my point and I don't whinge about it. Sadly I think is will only get worse in the near future.
However if I were qualified I wouldn't whinge about eroding terms and conditions due to Wannabes wanting to reach their aspirations.
The momentum behind it is too strong to stop and I was merely pointing out the fact that this situation is not the fault of the Wannabes.
But thanks for the enlightening comment.
That's my point and I don't whinge about it. Sadly I think is will only get worse in the near future.
However if I were qualified I wouldn't whinge about eroding terms and conditions due to Wannabes wanting to reach their aspirations.
The momentum behind it is too strong to stop and I was merely pointing out the fact that this situation is not the fault of the Wannabes.
But thanks for the enlightening comment.
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Tax relief on training
Hi all.
I am about to start my ICAO to JAR Comm/IF conversion and looking to try to claim back tax towards the cost of training.
I believe that if i open a company for myself and operate as a sole trader i will be able to do this.
Does anyone have any experience of doing this?
Thanks in advance.
Edge70.
I am about to start my ICAO to JAR Comm/IF conversion and looking to try to claim back tax towards the cost of training.
I believe that if i open a company for myself and operate as a sole trader i will be able to do this.
Does anyone have any experience of doing this?
Thanks in advance.
Edge70.
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I've been registered as a sole trader for years, could I put the cost of my flying training through the books? I wish!!! The tax man would owe me a fortune. I would love to know the answer. Anyone?
Why do it if it's not fun?
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No experience, but it has been discussed here a few times before, so if you do a search you might find something.
The general concensus was that you would have to prove to the taxman that your expenses incurred in training were a necessary part of your legitimate other business - and this is extremely difficult to do.
FFF
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The general concensus was that you would have to prove to the taxman that your expenses incurred in training were a necessary part of your legitimate other business - and this is extremely difficult to do.
FFF
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