Hour Building (General & UK)
Join Date: Mar 2006
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ppl hour building and fatpl
Hi just general advice is what Im seeking. I want to complete my PPL in bournemouth and then build the necessary hours to go on to Oxfords modular course. However money is an issue but I dont want to take a year to do my ppl. Im considering putting the ppl on credit card and transferring the balance to keep it 0%. Then comes the hour building- how long does it take to do 150 hrs on average? I know it depends how often u fly but a rough estimate. How have ppl financed a fatpl course at oxford as i dont think they provide a loan for the modular route? any advice appreciated
Join Date: Nov 2005
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Firstly why do you need to do 150 hours, hour building? You need 150 total hours to commence your CPL, that must include 100 hours P1. Your PPL will include 10 hours that you can log P1 so depending on how many hours it takes you to do your ppl will determin how many it will take you to complete your hour building. If say you did your PPl in minimum time 45 hours, then you would need 105 hours of hour building to commence the CPL. If say you did your ppl in 60 hours, then you still need 100 hours, P1, but as 10 can be included from your P1 in the PPL training you can do 90 hours to get to the require 150. Please correct me if this wrong.
As for how long it takes, well 2 hours aday 5 days a week, will take you 10 weeks, providing the weather is good. But bare in mind, most people after their PPL's do their ATPL exams , which is 6-8 months solid work and I mean 7-8 hours study/revision aday!! So trying to fit in flying in as well ain't easy. Best suggestion is to get as much flying in as you can while studying the ATPL's then go to the USA and finish of the hours. You can normally get 30-40 done in 2-3 weeks.
Just my 2p's worth..
As for how long it takes, well 2 hours aday 5 days a week, will take you 10 weeks, providing the weather is good. But bare in mind, most people after their PPL's do their ATPL exams , which is 6-8 months solid work and I mean 7-8 hours study/revision aday!! So trying to fit in flying in as well ain't easy. Best suggestion is to get as much flying in as you can while studying the ATPL's then go to the USA and finish of the hours. You can normally get 30-40 done in 2-3 weeks.
Just my 2p's worth..
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Newbie008
Firstly, Welcome Aboard,
You seem like you know what you want but I feel as though you need to explore a few more avenues first. Strapping your PPL onto a credit card and jostling the terms around to avoid APR is a pretty sure way to end up loosing control of your finances. My advice would be to secure a job full time (if you haven't already) and fly as and when the weather lets you. You can save your money on bad days ready for the good ones to come around.
Initial PPL took me about 5 months not exactly full time but a good part of my life was put aside for studying ect. After that I have flown approximately 60 hours a year in the UK due to money, weather and family life!! The main concern is keeping your hand in once you've raped your card on the training. That was my problem too.
If money is a problem as it is for most of us then Oxford shouldn't enter your vocabulary. There training is very good but you get what you pay for and there prices are extraordinary. Even on the modular Waypoint scheme some of the costs are not evaluated, accomodation for one. If the 5K required for the PPL is an issue forget Oxford, I had to. There is only one scheme I can think of that doesn't take your money first (but does in the long run) and that's CTC. That was my option and I'm going through selection now.
Although it's not what you want to hear but there is no cheap way into this field. At the very least I think you can kiss goodbye to 25K and that will be with alot of plane washing and ferry flights ect to build hours.
Sorry to be bit negative but I think that is the harsh reality of the game.
The Reverand
You seem like you know what you want but I feel as though you need to explore a few more avenues first. Strapping your PPL onto a credit card and jostling the terms around to avoid APR is a pretty sure way to end up loosing control of your finances. My advice would be to secure a job full time (if you haven't already) and fly as and when the weather lets you. You can save your money on bad days ready for the good ones to come around.
Initial PPL took me about 5 months not exactly full time but a good part of my life was put aside for studying ect. After that I have flown approximately 60 hours a year in the UK due to money, weather and family life!! The main concern is keeping your hand in once you've raped your card on the training. That was my problem too.
If money is a problem as it is for most of us then Oxford shouldn't enter your vocabulary. There training is very good but you get what you pay for and there prices are extraordinary. Even on the modular Waypoint scheme some of the costs are not evaluated, accomodation for one. If the 5K required for the PPL is an issue forget Oxford, I had to. There is only one scheme I can think of that doesn't take your money first (but does in the long run) and that's CTC. That was my option and I'm going through selection now.
Although it's not what you want to hear but there is no cheap way into this field. At the very least I think you can kiss goodbye to 25K and that will be with alot of plane washing and ferry flights ect to build hours.
Sorry to be bit negative but I think that is the harsh reality of the game.
The Reverand
Join Date: Mar 2006
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Originally Posted by Reverand Lovejoy
Initial PPL took me about 5 months not exactly full time but a good part of my life was put aside for studying ect.
Also, Oxford seem to include MC and JOC, whereas i'm not so sure that other schools include this, (i've read so much recently that i may be getting that mixed up!) and i'm wondering if this is why they are more expensive.
thanks
Join Date: Nov 2005
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Hi the PPl exams and quite hard work but not excessive. I did mine in 6 weeks, while flying full time as well. Works out at 1 exam a week and 1 exam for good measure. I reckon you need to do about 7-10hours work per exam to pass them, really depends on your knowledge already though. The more flying you do the easier some are. Ones like Navigation and Communications are pretty straight forward if you've already done alot of flying by the time you take them. Other's like Airlaw can be pigs.
It is possible and I know people that have done it, to do a week intensive course, 7 days and 7 exams. It seems to work as well..
My recomendation is, Do the Airlaw exam, this has to be done 1st anyway so you can go solo, see how you get on and then judge how long it will take you to complete the rest. Only advice is get them over and done with ASAP so you don't have to worry about them in the run upto your skills test.
Good luck anyway.
It is possible and I know people that have done it, to do a week intensive course, 7 days and 7 exams. It seems to work as well..
My recomendation is, Do the Airlaw exam, this has to be done 1st anyway so you can go solo, see how you get on and then judge how long it will take you to complete the rest. Only advice is get them over and done with ASAP so you don't have to worry about them in the run upto your skills test.
Good luck anyway.
Join Date: Mar 2006
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Thanks for that littco, just another quick question if you don't mind - Do any of these PPL exams overlap/coincide with ATPL exams?
For example, is the air law just a scaled down version of the exams taken during ATPL courses, with the ATPL version to do later on, or is it the same exam?
The reason i ask is, that on ab-initio, 0-fatpl courses, they seem to mention only 14 exams. Are 7 of these the PPL exams, or are there 21 all in all?
Thanks again, in advance
For example, is the air law just a scaled down version of the exams taken during ATPL courses, with the ATPL version to do later on, or is it the same exam?
The reason i ask is, that on ab-initio, 0-fatpl courses, they seem to mention only 14 exams. Are 7 of these the PPL exams, or are there 21 all in all?
Thanks again, in advance
Join Date: Sep 2005
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Littco,
How the heck did manage to do the PPL theory syllabus so quickly mate? 7-10 hours for the WHOLE 7 exams?
I've been struggling with Air Law for what seems a good few weeks now. It's not that it's mentally difficult - just the amount of stuff. It's a memory test after all. Also frustrating as I didn't realise until about 8 hours flying that you had to get Law out of the way before you can fly solo.
Any tips, or have you got a photographic memory?
HW
How the heck did manage to do the PPL theory syllabus so quickly mate? 7-10 hours for the WHOLE 7 exams?
I've been struggling with Air Law for what seems a good few weeks now. It's not that it's mentally difficult - just the amount of stuff. It's a memory test after all. Also frustrating as I didn't realise until about 8 hours flying that you had to get Law out of the way before you can fly solo.
Any tips, or have you got a photographic memory?
HW
Join Date: Mar 2006
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another query ive got is i'd like to do my training at b'mouth being a class d airspace and thought this would give me more experience.Ive got a club about 15 milles away though which is obviously closer, whilst b'mouth is about 35 miles. Does anyone think it matters that much?
Join Date: Nov 2005
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Do it at Bornemouth mate, theres nothing like jostling for position in the circuit with 737s whilst in a little cessna to give you good experience, and make you feel a bit cheeky at the same time!
Join Date: Mar 2005
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Originally Posted by sicky
Thanks for that littco, just another quick question if you don't mind - Do any of these PPL exams overlap/coincide with ATPL exams?
The reason i ask is, that on ab-initio, 0-fatpl courses, they seem to mention only 14 exams. Are 7 of these the PPL exams, or are there 21 all in all?
The reason i ask is, that on ab-initio, 0-fatpl courses, they seem to mention only 14 exams. Are 7 of these the PPL exams, or are there 21 all in all?
Even someone who has passed the 7 CPL exam and then decides to go ATPL still has to do all 14 ATPL exams, there is no overlap anywhere along the way.
Join Date: Dec 2004
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sicky, how long it takes depends entirely on you - both how easy you find it, and whether you want to scrape through or understand what you're learning.
Frankly, 7-10 hours is incredible. I don't find learning difficult, but I'd still want at least 20 hours per exam. Then again, I wanted to understand it rather than just pass it and bin the knowledge.
Pick up one of the books and have a look at the volume of information you need to learn. There are groundschools for PPL learning, but if you're sufficiently self-motivated you shouldn't need one.
Frankly, 7-10 hours is incredible. I don't find learning difficult, but I'd still want at least 20 hours per exam. Then again, I wanted to understand it rather than just pass it and bin the knowledge.
Pick up one of the books and have a look at the volume of information you need to learn. There are groundschools for PPL learning, but if you're sufficiently self-motivated you shouldn't need one.
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The PPL exams really aren't very hard, alot of the exams you can just flick through the books and you'll be ok. Alot of it is common sense and with abit of work you can easily get them done whilst you do your PPL flying.
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Remember with the PPL exams, some can be done with minimal work. Ones like Navigation, Human performance & communications can be done in a few hours work, simply because you have already covered alot of the questions in the PPL flying. Ones such as LAW and MET take alot longer through the sheer amount of stuff to read.
On the subject of the ATPL's they are very similar, but go into so much more detail. I have so far done about 40hours a week for the last 5 weeks and still have another 6 weeks before my brush up course and then about another 80-100 hours at the brush up course. So it will be near 400-500 hours of work for 7 exams!
I think I said it earlier but if you plan on doing the ATPL's then make the PPL exams count , the more you learn at PPL the easier it is to understand the ATPL's, it all counts.
On the subject of the ATPL's they are very similar, but go into so much more detail. I have so far done about 40hours a week for the last 5 weeks and still have another 6 weeks before my brush up course and then about another 80-100 hours at the brush up course. So it will be near 400-500 hours of work for 7 exams!
I think I said it earlier but if you plan on doing the ATPL's then make the PPL exams count , the more you learn at PPL the easier it is to understand the ATPL's, it all counts.
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7-10 hours stuedy for each ppl subject in my book is rather a lot. I can honestly say it never took me that long.
We all are of course human and therefore different in many ways and I dont think a definative answer to this question ca be given. There maybe guidlines on this but some people will take more time some less.
We all are of course human and therefore different in many ways and I dont think a definative answer to this question ca be given. There maybe guidlines on this but some people will take more time some less.
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Sounds like it's going to be a hell of a slog to get it all done, 14 exams is a lot of exams and the work put into those exams seems extreme!! However, the satisfaction once they are all passed will be worth every little bit of the effort put in, i'm sure!
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Originally Posted by femaleWannabe
Out of interest, how do the ATPL exams compare to university exams? When I was at uni I was doing 12 exams per year, it was hard going, but doable... are the ATPLs harder?
Having said that, I still find myself scratching my head for a while over some of the more technical concepts and have referred back to A-level Physics books now and again. I know people say you can do ATPLs without any scientific background, but it must be very hard work!