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-   -   Tracey Curtis-Taylor (Merged threads) (https://www.pprune.org/private-flying/579030-tracey-curtis-taylor-merged-threads.html)

SATCOS WHIPPING BOY 25th Sep 2018 08:45

Rebuilds are expensive. If I were on a round the world trip in, say, a Ford Escort and I pranged it I would have a couple of options.
1. Waste time, energy and money getting it built back up to as it was. Running the risk of missing out on good driving conditions and having to worry about getting it through an MOT.
or
2. Source another complete Ford Escort and spray that up. I guess I'd be back on the road in a few days. Only the car reg would be different but that would be what was expected.

Of course option two is the better option as I can still fix my old car in slow time when I get back and get my journey back on track ASAP.

I wonder why, given the number of aircraft at their disposal this latter option was not taken. Given the need to keep an eye on the purse strings it would have been the most logical step to take if time was a pressure due to favorable weather on route etc.

just curious.

Cazalet33 25th Sep 2018 09:14

In the late 1970s we had six Bell 47s, all physically airworthy at the start of the cropspray season, but only five were registered and insured.

There were huge penalties for downtime as some high value crops had to be sprayed in a very short timeframe or they'd be ruined. When a particular aircraft needed to go back to base for a Check, the engineers simply swapped the brass plate and the skeg which bore the G-Reg from one to another and wrote up the difference of engine serial number etc in the Tech Log and Hey Presto! Instant new aircraft for the benefit of the customer. All perfectly legal. It saved a load of money on insurance and admin expenses on the 'phantom' aircraft. Our CAA Inspector was a little uncomfortable about the arrangement, but he had to admit that it was legal and safe and above board.

Looking at the state of the wreckage at Winslow, and how rapidly a pristine new replacement appeared with the same registration number, I suspect that Ewald did something similar. All legit and actually good service for the customer.

SATCOS WHIPPING BOY 25th Sep 2018 09:20

Fascinating. So with my Ford escort analogy, simply respraying the "good" car and putting the old registration plate on it would be akin to what you say there ref the crop-sprayers? Sounds odd but you live and learn.

treadigraph 25th Sep 2018 09:41

Caz, I'm not convinced that was legal knowing the CAA's reluctance to transfer registrations from one airframe to another (it has happened once or twice, one was an HS-125 replaced with a newer aircraft!), and how would you account for differences in airframe hours?

Cazalet33 25th Sep 2018 10:37

Treaders,

We had a lengthy discussion with the CAA as to exactly which component of a Bell 47 constitutes the airframe as every single element is replaceable, unlike with a monocoque airframe.

Was it the bubble? (replaceable). Was it the tubular steel elements (all replaceable, singly or severally)? Was it the engine? Replaceable. Was it the floorboard? (replaceable). In the end we agreed that the only element that was really "the" helicopter was the brass plate. The skeg, painted with the G-reg was also replaceable, and was duly swapped over as the visible identifier.

A Stearman is also a tube frame structure, whose elements are all replaceable. Hence, I suspect that Ewald did something similarly legal and quite clever.

Sam Rutherford 25th Sep 2018 10:49

It's all and only about the plate. So 'rebuilding' is not required - you just shift the plate across to a brand new fuselage and it's magically a vintage aeroplane.

B70 25th Sep 2018 10:52

"I am hearing rumours Jonzarno that the the LAA has received legal threats."

Tracey must surely realise that, in the case of any legal proceedings, former crew-members would be called as witnesses. So far, those crew-members have not spilled the beans for reasons of client confidentiality but, in a court of law, they would be cross-examined and the resulting revelations would be embarrassing indeed.
Presumably, the conspirators behind the ‘solo’ Farnborough take-off deception with Ewald climbing aboard sometime later, would also be invited to tell their stories.

treadigraph 25th Sep 2018 10:54

Understood, just surprised that they would agree. Tiger Moth G-ACDC has been rebuilt a number of times after accidents, probably the left hub-cap and data plate are the only original components :p.

Looking at the post accident pics, the fuselage of the Stearman may have survived undamaged except possibly the rearmost elements; certainly every other component needed replacing and doubtless Ewald had a good stock of wings and other parts to draw on. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, it was astonishing how quickly Lang Kidby's Avro Avian was rebuilt by various British specialists after it's prang here a few years ago, and with no spares resource to access.

Nige321 25th Sep 2018 11:06

From a little surfing on Facebook:


TERRY HOLLOWAY - She is a very good pilot who has flown her open cockpit Stearman over much of the globe. She had a “ passenger“ in the front seat for most of the time, and the main passenger was her engineer who is also a pilot. She did the flying ( as did Amelia Earhart who took a navigator on her fateful global attempt, and as did I went across the Atlantic [and across the USA] in an Aztec !). By any measure, whether solo or not, her long flights in that machine were very meritworthy but unfortunately the media screamed “solo” and she and her team did insufficient to correct the headlines. I have flown with her quite a bit, most recently to the LAA Rally a fortnight ago and I have a high regard for her as a pilot and a person. She has done a great deal to encourage young people, particularly females into aviation at a time when GA is in decline and there are acute shortages of Pilots. I therefore find it both sad and disappointing that a bunch of people, who do not know her, are so critical of the her, and that mindless trolls on PPrune continue to be so spiteful and vile about her! She is certainly very gutsy and I put her in the league of heroines even though she was not alone for much of her long distance flights.

Those who have, and continue to criticise and be spiteful about her on the ghastly PPrune social site, and elsewhere, and who have no knowledge of her should be ashamed of the damage they are doing to GA, the LAA and their own reputations.

ANDY SEPHTON - A very good friend of mine, Tracey Curtis-Taylor, has been vilified on an aviation Forum (PPRUNE) and wronged by the LAA. Hopefully the latter will be put right at their coming AGM.
Having flown with Tracey I have to say that I find her to be a highly competent aviatrix with a professional attitude to whatever she does. I find it disappointing to read the disparaging comments from people who have no direct experience of what she has achieved. If you are able to, I request all of my friends and colleagues to give Tracey their support.

I had a lot of respect for Andy Sephton and his work. No more...

Katamarino 25th Sep 2018 12:18

For a bit of balance, let's just say that some of what Ewald says is very much in line with what I and others have experienced. The truth is never found 100% on one side of a story...

Sam Rutherford 25th Sep 2018 12:48

I can't believe I've been dragged back into this again, but if people insist (either publicly or privately) then I am obliged to respond.

Something else that would be helpful, copies of the press releases that were sent to the media in 2013-2016?

And the sponsor request letters from the same period?

These would also prove that it was the media who independently added the word 'solo' to everything.

That is what we're discussing here, isn't it?

airpolice 25th Sep 2018 13:33

Sam, I have a suspicion that you have already had sight of those very documents.

She's already stated the initial idea was for a solo trip and that was abandoned early on.

I think there might need to be more than three questions asked, in order to satisfy everyone on the subject of credibility as a very good pilot. How can she explain the hours discrepancies on FAA documents and her Facebook still claiming that she holds the honorary rank of Commander?

The discreet Goodwood shuffle is going to take some explaining.

Still, the "Alone in an open cockpit" slide and the Herne Bay video, will surely hold centre stage for some time.

The best place to have all this thrashed out in a civilised, properly documented, fair and transparent way, would be in a court of law. How odd that only one side truly wants that, and yet it is the other side who claim to have started the ball rolling, but there's no evidence of it actually happening.

Right Hand Thread 25th Sep 2018 13:39


Terry Holloway. .......unfortunately the media screamed “solo”...

As did she Terry, as did she.

Need I refer you again to the many photographs showing her in front of the ‘alone in a cockpit’ presentation or holding up certificates emblazoned with the ‘S’ word?

Or how about the Herne Bay video where she says TWICE that she flew solo?

Why oh why do her supporters defend her in the face of such blatant evidence? Do they think we are too stupid to see it? It’s like dealing with Trump. Trump Curtis-Taylor*.


* Any journos reading this can have that one on me.

SATCOS WHIPPING BOY 25th Sep 2018 13:47

Those are the questions I have been asking for over and above Jonzarno's ones.

In addition I would like answers to the following

- When exactly did the sponsorship requests begin?
- What did the investors THINK they were getting?
- When was it decided that these would not be a solo flights?
- Why was the solo aspect dropped?
- Were the sponsors informed of this material change?
- If so, when?
- Why was it felt necessary that the front seat would be occupied for the vast majority of the journey by Ewald?
- What steps did TCT take to correct the many SOLO headlines?
- Where is the evidence to show this even happened?
- Why, many months after the return to the UK, was TCT perpetuating the SOLO claim?

I have just been reading posts over on the LAA forum. Some are saying that the motion should be thrown out but it is too late for that. Doing so would now be undemocratic; the motion has been tabled and it is down to the membership to decide.

What I find odd is why the VP has put this motion forward. Any member can submit a motion and TCT is an LAA member. Is it because she would have been dismissed straight away? Is it because there has been external pressure put on the LAA to revisit (legal threats perhaps).
Eitherway it is for members to decide both those who will vote by proxy and those who turn up on the day. The crucial point is that proxy votes are just as valid as those cast in person. To this end I trust that the LAA will present as much information as possible to ALL members and prevent any last-minute ambushing at Sywell.

The members also need to be aware of the possible outcomes.
Motion rejected: TCT remains without the award. I suggest to prevent further challenges that the decision includes a full and final decision caveat. Unless TCT can come up with solid evidence to support her in the future then the decision stands.
Motion carried: TCT is vindicated and this paves the way for legal damages to be claimed from the LAA.

As I see it there is NOTHING to support the second option. If there were it would have been public by now. I think the press-releases from BiaB pushed the solo aspect, certainly the sponsorship requests will have done because I cannot see any sponsor jumping in to throw millions at a dual jolly to satisfy one persons dream; sponsorship doesn't work like that. When solo flights have occurred it has been with a little subterfuge later on. Wasn't it Goodwood to Le Touquet solo but Ewald was quickly back in the front seat as ballast? He was there at the departure and followed in another aircraft or perhaps more accurately they met up airborne and she followed the other plane into France.

It is down to the LAA membership to decide for themselves. There is tons of evidence to support what is said on here and other forums, but little to zero to counter any of it from BiaB. I am going to wait and see the exact motion wording and then leave it to them to decide which path is morally correct.

Sam Rutherford 25th Sep 2018 13:52

@airpolice

They do say that you should never ask a question to which you don't already know the answer...

Cazalet33 25th Sep 2018 14:46

Here's a role model for Tracey to emulate
 
With acknowledgement to the BBC, and under the Fair Use provisions of copyright law, I'd like to share a small but representative portion of an article which describes someone who really is doing what Tracey pretends to do.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....b4138bf6de.jpg
Pabi Leqhotsa had never flown a plane before this year but now dreams of a career in aviation

Fourteen-year-old Paballo (Pabi) Leqhotsa jumps out of the pilot seat of a four-seater Cessna monoplane giddy with delight.

"It was amazing. I felt like I was in control, do you understand?" she says, spinning round in excitement. Taking control of an aircraft was something the teenager from Soweto, a township just outside Johannesburg, had dreamed of since she was little.

She stands on the runway at Grand Central Airport and whoops with pure joy; the words of delight streaming out of her.
"Driving Zulu Sierra Papa Whiskey Whiskey (her aircraft's call-sign) was so amazing. It was so amazing!"

The woman behind this euphoria is Refilwe Ledwaba, South Africa's first black woman to have flown for the South African Police Service.
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....e940be30a9.jpg
Refilwe Ledwaba has set up a camp and programmes for young people interested in aviation and science as a career choice


Besides being the country's first black female helicopter pilot, Refilwe is also the founder of the Girl Fly Programme in Africa Foundation (GFPA) a non-profit organisation empowering young women to take up science, technology, engineering and mathematics (STEM) subjects.

Every year she organises a flying camp for girls where they learn about robotics, coding and aviation. And then each of them gets a free flying lesson at some point during the year.

"I want the girls to be successful," she says, dressed in her pilot's uniform, watching the teenagers take it in turns to fly. "Not necessarily to choose to become pilots but to become confident young women who can contribute to society, our economy and give back to our communities."

Now, I've got a question for Sam or Ewald or anyone else who knows what they're talking about: During her 44 sectors on the Africa gig, we know that Ewald was in the front seat for 40 of them. During the other four sectors, how many African girls did Tracey, the 300 hour Flying Instructor, give a free trial lesson to? Any?

44 sectors is 45 airfields. At how many of those airfields did she give local area trial flight flying lessons to any African girls (or boys, for that matter)?

Is her "STEM" stuff just PR fluff, like the solo fluff? Or did she really do something in Africa which is anything like as noble as the work being done by Refilwe Ledwaba? Just asking.

I've also got a question for the HCAP Liverymen: why don't you fetch Refilwe Ledwaba over to the Guild Hall, or whatever nosh house you have your well-dressed soirees in, and give a Prize to a woman who really does deserve one? Just asking.

Sam Rutherford 25th Sep 2018 14:54

The answers to the first two questions are 'none'.

Cazalet33 25th Sep 2018 15:03

Imagine my surprise!

I'm guessing that the answers to my third and fourth questions might be similar? ie yes and no, in that order?

I dare not hold my breath until I get an equally honest answer from HCAP to my question of them.

SATCOS WHIPPING BOY 25th Sep 2018 15:31


Originally Posted by Sam Rutherford (Post 10258062)
The answers to the first two questions are 'none'.

And the answer to the STEM one is also likely to be NONE as she is on record as saying she hates technology.

@Cazalet33. great post and what this should have been about. No doubt someone from BiaB will be along shortly to claim they helped inspire Refilwe. I asked the question many years ago as to how many PPLs could have been given if all of the Round the World jollies funding had been used wisely rather than squandered.

Forfoxake 25th Sep 2018 15:32

Satcos Whipping Boy wrote:

"Eitherway it is for members to decide both those who will vote by proxy and those who turn up on the day. The crucial point is that proxy votes are just as valid as those cast in person. To this end I trust that the LAA will present as much information as possible to ALL members and prevent any last-minute ambushing at Sywell."

and

"It is down to the LAA membership to decide for themselves. There is tons of evidence to support what is said on here and other forums, but little to zero to counter any of it from BiaB. I am going to wait and see the exact motion wording and then leave it to them to decide which path is morally correct."

It is, as you say, up to the LAA membership to decide. But can I suggest that we do not assume that most LAA members will be fully informed on this matter or bother to vote in any event.

They need to be informed and encouraged to vote. I have no doubt that TCT and her supporters will be lobbying LAA members to vote for reinstatement!

In short, we need a vigorous campaign to prevent the award being reinstated but a public forum is not the place to discuss strategy and tactics. Any suggestions how we can do this privately?

Make no mistake, a lot is at stake here especially for those of us who have a LAA permit aircraft and must remain members whatever happens. Maybe not as much as Brexit, but TreCksiT is important!

9 lives 25th Sep 2018 15:34

Ewald has been quoted as saying the following:


A lot of pilots can tell you that TC is simply a good pilot (and navigator).

But the navigational problems TC had in Africa were caused by the lack of proper aviation maps, charts and information.
Tracey had earlier been quoted as saying:


Curtis-Taylor calls herself a "bit of a maverick".

"I have an ipad with my airspace because that's often a very difficult thing when you fly a vintage aeroplane through so many countries, crossing international borders, through military zones, restricted airspace, into international airports, it's very difficult to do with an aeroplane like this."

"This is an aerobatic aeroplane, so I can be turning steeply around things. I had a lot of training, ironically with some military pilots, and I did a little bit of display flying, and formation flying and aerobatic training, so all of that really came together for these expeditions for the sort of flying that we're doing."

"Sometimes I'm only half a wingspan away from rock faces, or flying the dead sea at about 15 feet in formation with another Stearman."

the first thing she said was "I need a drink!"

I ignored procedure,” she admits, eyes twinkling. “The place was deserted, so I just flew through the gorge. I was hauled over the coals by air traffic control for two hours.

There was another time in Uganda, when I flew into a prohibited zone. The controller gave me the wrong directions, so I ended up over the president’s house. By the time I landed, there was a summons to the tower and they tried to impound the plane. I said, 'That’s ridiculous. Arrest me instead.’”

“I’ve had some rough experiences. I’ve been made to fly at the same altitudes as commercial jets. That’s just dangerous.

"Over the sea, I was flying at 10 feet or below over breeding whales"
A pilot is required to fly prepared with suitable navigational information (charts), so if she decided that she was well enough prepared to make the flight, she would have had the charts, or other information (like an up to date database on an Ipad?), or, not make the flight. Yet she'll blame ATC for her failure to navigate (and apparently fly into restricted airspace?). A pilot is required to, or at least expected to abide by at least the spirit of regulations, if not the letter. Low flying? Harassing whales? Wingspan away from gorges walls? Turning steeply around things? Busting restricted airspace? Not actions to be proud of!

A "good pilot" (as quoted from Ewald) would not do the things which Tracey seems to have boasted about in the forgoing quote. A good pilot would be ashamed and apologetic were they have been compelled into any one of these dangerous situations. The list of dangerous flying, and the apparent eagerness to boast about it is not the stuff of a good pilot, nor one who should be awarded!

If Tracey would like be thought of as a mentor to female aviators, I am alarmed at the prospect that she would boast to those impressionable minds that such dangerous flying (including two crashes) is the way forward to be a future pilot of pride! A "good pilot" would admit, apologize, work to improve, and not boast. Other people who defend Tracey as a good pilot, to be advanced over other pilots as a model of airmanship are doing their own image a disfavour. Similarly, organizations who would award a pilot with the errors attributed to (or admitted by) Tracey diminish their own relevance.

B Fraser 25th Sep 2018 16:05


Originally Posted by Katamarino (Post 10257919)
The truth is never found 100% on one side of a story...

Mr Katamarino sir,

Let's have a look at an account of her exploits written by an independent local writer "down route". The background is that TCT spent many hours having lunch in a posh Indian hotel and this was followed up by the usual vacuous article that tends to follow such non-events. The writing style is fairly standard for this type of article written in the APAC region. The offending word appears in the second paragraph. You have to ask yourself whether the information was given during her presentation or the writer had to look it up after the event. I would expect that it was given first hand. Even then, where would the author look other than the official site for the trip ? There are also the usual references to "basic period instruments" and no mention of the latest laptops slaved to a GPS.

A high-flying lunch with British aviatrix, Tracey Curtis-Taylor at The Taj Mahal Hotel, New Delhi -

Katamarino 25th Sep 2018 16:11


Originally Posted by B Fraser (Post 10258113)
Mr Katamarino sir,

Let's have a look at an account of her exploits written by an independent local writer "down route". The background is that TCT spent many hours having lunch in a posh Indian hotel and this was followed up by the usual vacuous article that tends to follow such non-events. The writing style is fairly standard for this type of article written in the APAC region. The offending word appears in the second paragraph. You have to ask yourself whether the information was given during her presentation or the writer had to look it up after the event. I would expect that it was given first hand. Even then, where would the author look other than the official site for the trip ? There are also the usual references to "basic period instruments" and no mention of the latest laptops slaved to a GPS.

A high-flying lunch with British aviatrix, Tracey Curtis-Taylor at The Taj Mahal Hotel, New Delhi -

I was not referring to TCT's solo claims.

Katamarino 25th Sep 2018 17:25

All those pontificating about current, correct charts always being on board have clearly never flown in Africa.

Guys, you have a solid argument on the solo claims. Don't split off into things you know nothing about to try and find more mud to sling, it only adds fuel to the flames of those who accuse the PPRuNe thread of being a witch hunt.

Right Hand Thread 25th Sep 2018 18:12


Originally Posted by Katamarino (Post 10258160)
All those pontificating about current, correct charts always being on board have clearly never flown in Africa.

Guys, you have a solid argument on the solo claims. Don't split off into things you know nothing about to try and find more mud to sling, it only adds fuel to the flames of those who accuse the PPRuNe thread of being a witch hunt.

Well said. Concentrate on this and spreading the word among LAA members.

Make no mistake, this was supposed to be an ambush at the AGM. TCT and her acolytes have had months to collect votes, we have only a couple of weeks to offer a balanced view.

Above The Clouds 25th Sep 2018 18:18


Originally Posted by Katamarino (Post 10258160)
All those pontificating about current, correct charts always being on board have clearly never flown in Africa.

Guys, you have a solid argument on the solo claims. Don't split off into things you know nothing about to try and find more mud to sling, it only adds fuel to the flames of those who accuse the PPRuNe thread of being a witch hunt.

Well actually I have done a lot more flying in Africa than you realise, however as you pointed out to keep the thread on track I have duly deleted my post.

ATC

Forfoxake 25th Sep 2018 18:18


Originally Posted by Right Hand Thread (Post 10258185)
Well said. Concentrate on this and spreading the word among LAA members.

Make no mistake, this was supposed to be an ambush at the AGM. TCT and her acolytes have had months to collect votes, we have only a couple of weeks to offer a balanced view.

Well said!

Cazalet33 25th Sep 2018 19:01


There was another time in Uganda, when I flew into a prohibited zone. The controller gave me the wrong directions, so I ended up over the president’s house. By the time I landed, there was a summons to the tower and they tried to impound the plane.
Here's what Entebbe looks like on an iPad screen:
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....1f0840f971.jpg
The Prohibited zone looks pretty clear to me!

And HCAP gave her a prize for navigation for that?

pulse1 25th Sep 2018 20:46

Last time, TCT and her followers tried to stop the proxy votes on the grounds that those of us who voted that way did not hear her arguments and could therefore not be influenced.

So, now would be a good time and place (or the LAA website might be even better?) for her to present her arguments for the LAA to restore her award where those of us who will vote by proxy can be persuaded to change our minds.

Essentially, as far as I can see, there is only one main issue which led the majority of LAA members to vote against her two years ago. That is her false claims to have flown "solo" for her African flight for which there is indisputable evidence in the Herne Bay video and the Powerpoint presentation backdrop used at her many talks. There is also clear evidence that for most of her flights she was accompanied by Ewald, an experienced instructor, airline pilot and owner of the aircraft.

If she wants the award restored, she must explain her case to the wider LAA membership before the end of this month, I would suggest. Members will be voting soon after they receive the October issue of Light Aviation.

Right Hand Thread 25th Sep 2018 20:51


Originally Posted by pulse1 (Post 10258334)
f she wants the award restored, she must explain her case to the wider LAA membership before the end of this month, I would suggest. Members will be voting soon after they receive the October issue of Light Aviation.

That is of course only fair.

Will someone also be allowed to present the case for the other side?

Jonzarno 26th Sep 2018 00:48


Originally Posted by Right Hand Thread (Post 10258336)
That is of course only fair.

Will someone also be allowed to present the case for the other side?

I agree completely that Ms Curtis-Taylor should be afforded every opportunity to make her case. She should, however, also have her feet held to the fire to answer the Three Questions, and I give them here again so that she, and anyone going to the meeting can refer easily to them. I hope that the Mods will forgive me for quoting yet again a post I made earlier in this thread, but I am concerned that the essence of this argument may get lost in the sheer volume of, quite understandable, posts addressing other aspects of Ms Curtis-Taylor’s activities.

Here are the questions to which I believe the LAA should insist on answers before considering reinstating their award:

1. What is the reconciliation between Ms Curtis-Taylor's well documented claim to have flown her african flight "solo". Please see the video clip published earlier in this thread in which she personally makes that claim, and her subsequent public statement that the flight was not solo?

2. Given the above, what was she doing in the picture of her, published several times earlier in this thread, standing in front of a huge picture depicting the route and claiming she had been "Alone in an open cock-pit [sic] plane"?

3. By what authority, and with what qualification, does she wear RAF wings?

#3Questions

It is a shame that neither Ms Curtis-Taylor, nor any of her surrogates who have posted here and elsewhere, has yet taken the many opportunities they have been given to answer these questions of which she is well aware. Perhaps this will be her last opportunity to grasp the nettle and address them either with good answers or a genuine apology. It remains her call.

Edit: IMHO it is as much her apparent refusal to address these simple factual questions as the actual answers to them that is important for the LAA, and other bodies that have honoured her, to consider.




airpolice 26th Sep 2018 06:29

I doubt very much that any interaction she has with the audience at the AGM will be of the Q&A type.

Her supporters need to ask themselves this, are they satisfied with the answers that she has given them, to the three questions? In the event that she refuses to satisfy her own team, why are they standing by her? In the massively unlikely situation where they can be told anything that makes it all seem OK, what happens to their reputation?

I anticipate her delivering just a statement. Long, rambling and full of man hate, declaring who the main players are, in this conspiracy to subjugate all women. With of course, more of the empty threats of legal action.


The earlier point about the need for membership to be verified, prior to a vote, is sad but true.

Lind1795 26th Sep 2018 06:49

As with many others taking part in this discussion I had thought it had ceased and, whilst still irritated by Tracey's shenanigans, felt it was correct the matter should rest.
I was staggered to suddenly discover she has relit the fire. Incredible. What does this say about her and her supporters? There is a great lack of introspection on Tracey's part and inability to admit she is and has been wrong. Is this constant need to be in the limelight and absorb adoration from a variety of naïve, some not so naïve, supporters her driving force?

I am female and embarrassed beyond measure by her behaviour. I am also a pilot and feel Tracey has committed a great disservice to female pilots. Tracey has let her own sex down and as a female pilot I am abhorred at her behaviour. She has not represented female pilots well and this business to try and have the LAA award restored defies belief. Just for the record the men I have flown with (quite a few!) have not been sexist in the least.

With regard to flying and reward the greatest reward I felt was when I took a blind man and his wife and son flying. It was simply a lovely thing to have done and the gentleman concerned was an inspiring example to us all. Do you really need anything more? Just for the record I received no remuneration of any kind for this flight - I did not want it.

I sincerely hope the LAA members do not vote in Tracey's favour and this matter is put to rest once and for all. You cannot keep on having votes until you get the result you want! I also hope those other organisations who chose to heap awards on her are watching all this very carefully indeed!

newsjunkie 26th Sep 2018 08:09

Cazalet33 thank you for introducing us to the amazing Refilwe Ledwaba. What an incredible woman. Her story says it all and demonstrates what is possible if your motivations really are to inspire young people and not just to garner a public profile and build a lucrative public speaking career. Like SWB I wonder what she might have been able to do if Boeing and Artemis had given her a massive stash of cash. I also wonder how she has coped with the "institutional misogyny" of the aviation world. It’s funny that those who make accusations of misogyny never ask themselves how it is that plenty of women, as Clareprop,Lind1795 and others have pointed out, seem to be able to thrive in the industry. If they did they might realise it’s not the gender that gets people’s backs up, just the elaboration of the truth and the boasting.

SATCOS WHIPPING BOY 26th Sep 2018 09:39


Originally Posted by Lind1795 (Post 10258621)
As with many others taking part in this discussion I had thought it had ceased and, whilst still irritated by Tracey's shenanigans, felt it was correct the matter should rest.
I was staggered to suddenly discover she has relit the fire. Incredible. What does this say about her and her supporters? There is a great lack of introspection on Tracey's part and inability to admit she is and has been wrong. Is this constant need to be in the limelight and absorb adoration from a variety of naïve, some not so naïve, supporters her driving force?

I am female and embarrassed beyond measure by her behaviour. I am also a pilot and feel Tracey has committed a great disservice to female pilots. Tracey has let her own sex down and as a female pilot I am abhorred at her behaviour. She has not represented female pilots well and this business to try and have the LAA award restored defies belief. Just for the record the men I have flown with (quite a few!) have not been sexist in the least.

With regard to flying and reward the greatest reward I felt was when I took a blind man and his wife and son flying. It was simply a lovely thing to have done and the gentleman concerned was an inspiring example to us all. Do you really need anything more? Just for the record I received no remuneration of any kind for this flight - I did not want it.

I sincerely hope the LAA members do not vote in Tracey's favour and this matter is put to rest once and for all. You cannot keep on having votes until you get the result you want! I also hope those other organisations who chose to heap awards on her are watching all this very carefully indeed!

+10 for that post Lind1795.
Sums it all up rather nicely and demonstrates it is flyers of both sexes that find this all a sorry state of affairs.

We have been described as "vile internet trolls" and if that is the title given to someone willing to wade through the smoke and mirrors put up by BiaB et al then we are guilty as charged. The wealth of historical evidence to support what we have been saying for the past few years is still out there for all to see. None of this would have happened had TCT stepped up and said

"Hey, I'm sorry about the confusion, as soon as we saw the misunderstanding happening we wrote to the press and TV stations running our story to correct them" - any subsequent SOLO tales in the papers would have been brushed aside as journalistic error, we would be right behind TCT and what she was doing and none of this would be happening right now.

Same with the awards..."Thank you kindly but I cannot accept this. This was a massive team effort and wasn't done for glory - you can support us in other ways by..."

Sadly this didn't happen, the charade continues. A bloody mess fueled by a gigantic ego and it will only end in tears.

Haraka 26th Sep 2018 10:03

According to her latest Wicki version . On its history page :

"Corrected Winslow, FAA report 594567 confirms fuel contamination: "The carburetor fuel screen was removed and a gray / tan liquid was drained from the carburetor".

Sam Rutherford 26th Sep 2018 10:19

It does seem that the TCT machine is happy to continue bashing through blatant untruths!

https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.aviation/brief.aspx?ev_id=20160511X13726&key=1
NTSB Identification: WPR16LA106
14 CFR Part 91: General AviationAccident occurred Wednesday, May 11, 2016 in Winslow, AZProbable Cause Approval Date: 12/12/2016Aircraft: BOEING B75N1, registration: N56200Injuries: 2 Uninjured.
NTSB investigators may not have traveled in support of this investigation and used data provided by various sources to prepare this aircraft accident report.The private pilot reported that, earlier in the day, she had flown three flights, totaling about 5 hours of flight time, which included uneventful takeoffs from two airports with a higher density altitude than that which existed at the accident airport; the calculated density altitude at the time of the accident was about 7,223 ft.
The pilot reported that, before takeoff for the accident flight, she conducted an engine run-up and pretakeoff checks, which included leaning the mixture to account for the density altitude. She also conducted a static-power check, which was in the normal range. The pilot reported that, during takeoff for the personal cross-country flight, the airplane accelerated and climbed out normally with the tachometer indicating 2,250 rpm. As the airplane climbed to about 50 ft above ground level, the engine began to lose power, and the airplane started to descend. The pilot turned the airplane left to maintain clearance from obstacles and verified the throttle, mixture, propeller, fuel, and carburetor heat settings. Subsequently, the airplane struck the ground and rolled about 20 ft, the right main landing gear impacted vegetation, and the airplane cart-wheeled. The pilot reported that, just before landing, she observed the tachometer indicating 2,000 rpm.It is likely that the engine’s partial loss of power, in combination with the high-density altitude, prevented the airplane from being able to maintain a positive climb rate during takeoff. Postaccident examination of the airplane and engine run did not reveal any evidence of any preexisting anomalies that would have precluded normal operation; therefore, the reason for the partial loss of engine power could not be determined.


The National Transportation Safety Board determines the probable cause(s) of this accident as follows:
  • The partial loss of engine power during takeoff initial climb in high-density altitude conditions for reasons that could not be determined because a post accident examination of the airplane and engine revealed no anomalies.

My underlining, but from an official FAA document.


Just done a geo-locate on the person who changed the page again. Hungary. Hmmmm. I wonder if we know anyone based in Hungary?





Sam Rutherford 26th Sep 2018 10:31

For the removal of doubt:
  1. I have not been driving this thread, but I have been happy to supply absolutely correct and truthful information to it.
  2. I do not (still!) have any personal issues with Tracey, never have done. That may change as she tries to make it personal - though I'm trying to remain professional.
  3. My last post before the latest news broke was in July, asking people to let it drop as it had run it's course. My last post before that was in November 2017 (I, like many, have better things to do!).
  4. I've only been brought back in because the whitewashing and lies have restarted. Yes. Lies. Go on, sue me.
  5. I've now heard that from a number of sources that they have been contacted, asking for dirt on me, by Tracey and her supporters. I imagine this is part of the age-old strategy of deflection/avoidance - still trying to duck the questions that deserve answers.
  6. I guess, then, that the gloves are off and I can really go for it? Release all that I have?
Once again, I have only ever told one version of this story, it has not changed from day one (and nor will it). I suppose that we're soon to hear version 5 from TCT? For the avoidance of doubt...

Sam Rutherford 26th Sep 2018 10:37

Oh, and Ewald told me that they have changed the voting rules at the LAA (specifically with regards to Tracey).

Anyone know something about this? Perhaps not the case?

I hope not, changing the voting rules and not telling the members would be very uncool.

Sam Rutherford 26th Sep 2018 11:18

Boeing: Boeing Supporting Curtis-Taylor's S. Africa-to-UK Flight in Vintage Biplane

CAPE TOWN, South Africa, Nov. 4, 2013 – With support from Boeing [NYSE: BA], pilot Tracey Curtis-Taylor has taken off on a 7,000-mile (11,000-kilometer) solo journey...


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