Can I legally change Flight School...?
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Join Date: Dec 2013
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Many thanks for all the input so far.
I did not pay all upfront but as per the terms of the contract which stipulated that payments must be made after a certain amount of hours. I made the last payment, of three at 20 hours.
Since that time I have become frustrated and disappointed with my flight instructor and I would like to continue the rest of my training elsewhere.
Regardless of whether or not I am entitled to a refund, I was told by my instructor that in order to officially register the hours I have I must continue with the same organisation I started with.
I was also told that, if I get any additional training with any other certified FI the hours cannot count.
I did not pay all upfront but as per the terms of the contract which stipulated that payments must be made after a certain amount of hours. I made the last payment, of three at 20 hours.
Since that time I have become frustrated and disappointed with my flight instructor and I would like to continue the rest of my training elsewhere.
Regardless of whether or not I am entitled to a refund, I was told by my instructor that in order to officially register the hours I have I must continue with the same organisation I started with.
I was also told that, if I get any additional training with any other certified FI the hours cannot count.
The Original Whirly
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Let's keep it simple. Your instructor is talking rubbish.
I'm also not sure I'd want to train with an organisation/instructor that lies to its students this way.
Your choice....
I'm also not sure I'd want to train with an organisation/instructor that lies to its students this way.
Your choice....
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@Whirlybird nice to see you posting again 
@ Baleares Your instructor should sign off your logbook after each flight
A friend abandoned training due to family circumstances, Almost 10 years later he restarted lessons at a different training establishment....The CAA accepted all his "signed-off" hours in his logbook.
You have paid for your hours trained and exams passed. I would consider sticking it out until the Skills test, as you have already paid. Speak to the boss of the ATO. Tell your grievances and ask for a solution (change of instructor?)
If an agreeable solution is not found, Tell them you intend to write to the CAA.
Remember They are NOT Government officials,they are a business,selling Flying- training....If their service has deteriorated since you paid the last lump of money,it could possibly be seen as a constructive breach of contract.....Your local Trading Standards office is there to protect the public from rogue traders.
Consider visiting them.
Write down all that is concerning you, make it short and factual each point should be a short paragraph and the whole thing should be less than an A4 page
Presenta copy to the ATO and ask for their comments.
You then have a clear and concise case to put to the CAA and local Trading Standards.
If you were in the same position, taking driving lessons,what would you do?
Well, you ARE taking"driving lessons"...same consumer laws,just tighter regulation on ATO's and Student Pilots.
REMEMBER! You are the customer, you have a right to expect certain standards for your money....once you have paid for exams,lessons,etc. THEY ARE YOURS.
The ATO can bluster all it wants but they have to hand over the properly completed paperwork. (Instructor may modify his attitude if he knows that his behaviour has gone to the boss. there's no excuse for lying, no matter how desperate he is for the income from your training hours. )
Good luck, show them you will not accept being messed around.
@ Baleares Your instructor should sign off your logbook after each flight
A friend abandoned training due to family circumstances, Almost 10 years later he restarted lessons at a different training establishment....The CAA accepted all his "signed-off" hours in his logbook.
You have paid for your hours trained and exams passed. I would consider sticking it out until the Skills test, as you have already paid. Speak to the boss of the ATO. Tell your grievances and ask for a solution (change of instructor?)
If an agreeable solution is not found, Tell them you intend to write to the CAA.
Remember They are NOT Government officials,they are a business,selling Flying- training....If their service has deteriorated since you paid the last lump of money,it could possibly be seen as a constructive breach of contract.....Your local Trading Standards office is there to protect the public from rogue traders.
Consider visiting them.
Write down all that is concerning you, make it short and factual each point should be a short paragraph and the whole thing should be less than an A4 page
Presenta copy to the ATO and ask for their comments.
You then have a clear and concise case to put to the CAA and local Trading Standards.
If you were in the same position, taking driving lessons,what would you do?
Well, you ARE taking"driving lessons"...same consumer laws,just tighter regulation on ATO's and Student Pilots.
REMEMBER! You are the customer, you have a right to expect certain standards for your money....once you have paid for exams,lessons,etc. THEY ARE YOURS.
The ATO can bluster all it wants but they have to hand over the properly completed paperwork. (Instructor may modify his attitude if he knows that his behaviour has gone to the boss. there's no excuse for lying, no matter how desperate he is for the income from your training hours. )
Good luck, show them you will not accept being messed around.
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I have become frustrated and disappointed with my flight instructor
You paid for flight training service and you're experiencing compatibility issues with your current instructor. Approach the ATO and file a request to substitute the instructor. Hopefully, the new one will be the right match for you.
However though, make sure you have credible arguments to substantiate your request to opt for another instructor. Elaborate your criteria for a suitable instructor and work with the ATO to address that.
With the proper attitude and approach, you should be able to proceed with your training and achieve your target.
WP
Last edited by worldpilot; 24th Jul 2014 at 11:25.
The Original Whirly
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worldpilot,
As someone who's in the past changed all sorts of professionals from flight instructor to doctor's practice, I'd say be careful with this one. People don't generally like their fellow professionals being criticised. Words like "communication breakdown", "personality clash" and similar often achieve better results than outright criticism of an individual. You don't get on with the guy; you want to change instructor. Shouldn't be a big deal. Happens all the time. Ask and see what happens. Save the big guns for later; chances are they won't be required. Flying schools generally like to keep their customers happy. Maybe baleares just picked the one bad egg in the box; let's hope so.
cockney steve - thankyou; it's nice to even be recognised on here still.
However though, make sure you have credible arguments to substantiate your request to opt for another instructor. Elaborate your criteria for a suitable instructor and work with the ATO to address that.
cockney steve - thankyou; it's nice to even be recognised on here still.
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One thing the EU seems quite keen on is stopping restrictive practices and restraint of trade, I would think this would come under both these and there will be laws against it!
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' Maybe baleares just picked the one bad egg in the box'
Perhaps they just don't gel
Perhaps the FI is good egg and Baleares is lazy & never prepared and / or useless ( not suggesting he is)
I had a student who blamed his previous , me and his subsequent FI on his PPP and lack of progress
Any way rant over
Baleares have chat with your FI and if still not happy the CFI and try and avoid any legal recourse suggestions
Perhaps they just don't gel
Perhaps the FI is good egg and Baleares is lazy & never prepared and / or useless ( not suggesting he is)
I had a student who blamed his previous , me and his subsequent FI on his PPP and lack of progress
Any way rant over
Baleares have chat with your FI and if still not happy the CFI and try and avoid any legal recourse suggestions
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@Whirlybird
It is my assumption that for whatever reason, the chemistry between Beleares and the instructor is the problem.
It reminds me of a similar situation I experienced at OBA, Florida, where I did my flight training. The instructor was hesitating to sign me off to solo, apparently because my stall recovery wasn't satisfactory enough.
Well, I requested having another instructor to verify my stall recovery and the new instructor signed me off immediately after the verification process.
It wasn't in my interest to continue wasting my time with an instructor who is hesitant in his assessment of my capabilities. His approach wasn't addressing my target of becoming a safe and confident pilot. Instead, he was putting unnecessary hurdles in my way.
BTW, OBA Florida, was not easy to deal with. During my endeavor at OBA, there were massive complains and a lot of frustrated students leaving for whatever reasons (broken planes, weather, accommodation, instructors, scheduling issues, etc) and not able to attain their target. But with dedication and focus, difficulties could be appropriately addressed and target met.
WP
You don't get on with the guy; you want to change instructor.
It reminds me of a similar situation I experienced at OBA, Florida, where I did my flight training. The instructor was hesitating to sign me off to solo, apparently because my stall recovery wasn't satisfactory enough.
Well, I requested having another instructor to verify my stall recovery and the new instructor signed me off immediately after the verification process.
It wasn't in my interest to continue wasting my time with an instructor who is hesitant in his assessment of my capabilities. His approach wasn't addressing my target of becoming a safe and confident pilot. Instead, he was putting unnecessary hurdles in my way.
BTW, OBA Florida, was not easy to deal with. During my endeavor at OBA, there were massive complains and a lot of frustrated students leaving for whatever reasons (broken planes, weather, accommodation, instructors, scheduling issues, etc) and not able to attain their target. But with dedication and focus, difficulties could be appropriately addressed and target met.
WP
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I changed twice (!).
Started at one flying school then FI lost his medical and there were no replacements. So I changed schools, but then after all theory exams and QXC for entirely work pressure related reasons took a break for a short while.
A few months later original FI was back in the air, and after talking to both I finalised my training and took skills test with first school.
Both CFI's certified the relevant parts of the logbooks pertinent to their time of training, and certified copies of the training records were exchanged each time so effectively the 'new' FI each time knew what had been covered by the previous. The CAA accepted this. Neither training organisation saw it as unusual.
So far as experience goes, one was a grass strip, the other a busy commercial airport so I feel I had the best of both worlds.
Undoubtedly, however, the change and the break in training were a major reason why my qualifying hours were higher than I'd originally hoped for which needs to be borne in mind when deciding to change.
All I would add is the importance of maintaining relationships. If I'd fallen out at either stage I wonder how the request for certifying the logbook would have gone down.
This was in 2013, the regulations may have changed since then of course.
Good luck
Started at one flying school then FI lost his medical and there were no replacements. So I changed schools, but then after all theory exams and QXC for entirely work pressure related reasons took a break for a short while.
A few months later original FI was back in the air, and after talking to both I finalised my training and took skills test with first school.
Both CFI's certified the relevant parts of the logbooks pertinent to their time of training, and certified copies of the training records were exchanged each time so effectively the 'new' FI each time knew what had been covered by the previous. The CAA accepted this. Neither training organisation saw it as unusual.
So far as experience goes, one was a grass strip, the other a busy commercial airport so I feel I had the best of both worlds.
Undoubtedly, however, the change and the break in training were a major reason why my qualifying hours were higher than I'd originally hoped for which needs to be borne in mind when deciding to change.
All I would add is the importance of maintaining relationships. If I'd fallen out at either stage I wonder how the request for certifying the logbook would have gone down.
This was in 2013, the regulations may have changed since then of course.
Good luck
Thread Starter
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Just want to thank everyone for their input.
For the record, I am not lazy or inept! I just don't "get on" with my instructor.
I had a few lessons with the CFI and really improved during that period. Problem is there is only one instructor and the CFI and he is busy. I will talk to him but don't want to create a bad atmosphere!
This was an awful lot of money for me, and a life dream. I really want it to be safe, instructive but also fun!
best wishes to all
For the record, I am not lazy or inept! I just don't "get on" with my instructor.
I had a few lessons with the CFI and really improved during that period. Problem is there is only one instructor and the CFI and he is busy. I will talk to him but don't want to create a bad atmosphere!
This was an awful lot of money for me, and a life dream. I really want it to be safe, instructive but also fun!
best wishes to all
The Original Whirly
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baleares,
As I see it, the reasons why you don't get on don't matter. You don't get on, so this chap is not a good instructor for you. And....he lied to you! I see that as enough reason not to want to fly with him, putting everything else aside.
The CFI may be busy, but he won't want to lose a student to another school. Ask if you can fly with him, at any time that's convenient for him, and be prepared to wait. Don't be fobbed off with "busy"; it's an excuse. I've had busy instructors, and I've been a busy instructor, and you can fit people in at some point if it's necessary. I bet he'd rather do that than have you leave! I suspect he's just trying to give the other instructor some students, but you probably don't have to go along with that if you don't want to and insist that you can't. And don't worry about a bad atmosphere; this is your money and your decision.
As I see it, the reasons why you don't get on don't matter. You don't get on, so this chap is not a good instructor for you. And....he lied to you! I see that as enough reason not to want to fly with him, putting everything else aside.
The CFI may be busy, but he won't want to lose a student to another school. Ask if you can fly with him, at any time that's convenient for him, and be prepared to wait. Don't be fobbed off with "busy"; it's an excuse. I've had busy instructors, and I've been a busy instructor, and you can fit people in at some point if it's necessary. I bet he'd rather do that than have you leave! I suspect he's just trying to give the other instructor some students, but you probably don't have to go along with that if you don't want to and insist that you can't. And don't worry about a bad atmosphere; this is your money and your decision.
