Pick a field
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Joined: Nov 2012
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From: Cambs
Pick a field
Just re validating my PPL and looking at PFLs. No problems with the approach but still not 100% clear on what constitutes a good field in terms of surface and what that looks like from 2000'. Idea is to avoid the ploughed ones but what does that look like from upstairs? Need to get this right as I'm looking at LAA home builts and those engines do fail from time to time...
Joined: Mar 2012
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From: Central London
On my PPL I was taught:
- Slope. If you can see a slope at all from 2,000 it will be steep when you get to low level, so you need to be landing upwards;
- Surface. Ideally not ploughed, also ideally not with long crops which can flip the aircraft on landing. If you have to land on a ploughed field, land along the furrows rather than across them. Very green/yellow fields probably have long crops, whereas 'brown' fields are probably earth or stubble, so a better bet. Most fields will not have long crops in the autumn/winter;
- Size/shape. The bigger the better obviously and preferably wide so that you have a maximum of approach angles;
- Smoke. Look for smoke to determine wind direction at low level and try to land into wind;
- Safety. Look out for obstructions. Most dangerous are obviously wires, but also farm machinary, hay bales, parked tractors etc;
Also make sure you choose one as close as possible to your position as it's easier to lose height on approach than it is to extend the glide.
Finally, I was taught that you should be regularly looking for suitable fields near your track during the cruise as part of a FREDA check, imagining "where would I go if the engine were to quit now".
- Slope. If you can see a slope at all from 2,000 it will be steep when you get to low level, so you need to be landing upwards;
- Surface. Ideally not ploughed, also ideally not with long crops which can flip the aircraft on landing. If you have to land on a ploughed field, land along the furrows rather than across them. Very green/yellow fields probably have long crops, whereas 'brown' fields are probably earth or stubble, so a better bet. Most fields will not have long crops in the autumn/winter;
- Size/shape. The bigger the better obviously and preferably wide so that you have a maximum of approach angles;
- Smoke. Look for smoke to determine wind direction at low level and try to land into wind;
- Safety. Look out for obstructions. Most dangerous are obviously wires, but also farm machinary, hay bales, parked tractors etc;
Also make sure you choose one as close as possible to your position as it's easier to lose height on approach than it is to extend the glide.
Finally, I was taught that you should be regularly looking for suitable fields near your track during the cruise as part of a FREDA check, imagining "where would I go if the engine were to quit now".
Last edited by taxistaxing; 28th November 2012 at 08:36. Reason: spelling
Joined: Jan 2008
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
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From: Third rock from the sun.
Crops
This might help. It was created for glider pilots but info on crops is relevant to everyone.
Field Crops - Home Page
Field Crops - Home Page
Last edited by snapper1; 28th November 2012 at 08:32.
Joined: Dec 2006
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From: Sussex, UK
Snapper beat me to it- very useful website.
With slopes, look for water (namely rivers) near fields, this will indicate potentially sloping ground (towards the water).
Maybe it's my gliding background, but I'm always looking at landable fields, not just at FREDA checks. As I progress down track I will always have a field or area of fields selected.
With slopes, look for water (namely rivers) near fields, this will indicate potentially sloping ground (towards the water).
Maybe it's my gliding background, but I'm always looking at landable fields, not just at FREDA checks. As I progress down track I will always have a field or area of fields selected.
Joined: May 2008
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From: UK
The key thing is that you can make it. A well flown approach into a poor field is far better than a poor approach into a good field. The other point is to land into wind, well worth trying some tailwind landings back at the airfield to see just how hard they are!
The main things which seem to hurt people are large standing crop, where the undercarriage hits it and you flip upside down. Similar story with landing against a plow furrow.
The other thing is wires going across the field, but these can be difficult to see from 2000'+ and the smaller ones can only come into view at a few hundred feet. If you are carrying out a well flown approach to a field well within range, you should have enough height and control to then manoeuvre away from any cables, either over them or under them, or overshoot to the next field. If you were pushing your luck with the field to begin with, chances are you will hit the cables.
Beyond that, you'd be surprised at just how little room you need if you stall it in and brake hard. I'd rather be hitting the fence/wall at the far end at 10-20Kts than hitting the fence/wall at the start of the field at 70kts.
The main things which seem to hurt people are large standing crop, where the undercarriage hits it and you flip upside down. Similar story with landing against a plow furrow.
The other thing is wires going across the field, but these can be difficult to see from 2000'+ and the smaller ones can only come into view at a few hundred feet. If you are carrying out a well flown approach to a field well within range, you should have enough height and control to then manoeuvre away from any cables, either over them or under them, or overshoot to the next field. If you were pushing your luck with the field to begin with, chances are you will hit the cables.
Beyond that, you'd be surprised at just how little room you need if you stall it in and brake hard. I'd rather be hitting the fence/wall at the far end at 10-20Kts than hitting the fence/wall at the start of the field at 70kts.
Joined: Jan 2001
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From: In the boot of my car!
RTN11 makes some good points especially about it being better to pick a bad field with a good controlled approach than a good field with a bad approach.
The main point to consider is to keep the aircraft flying under control.
Very few are killed or seriously injured where the aircraft is flown to the ground under control.
They are killed by stall/spin accidents.
Even taking out a hedge is unlikely to kill you while a ploughed field may remove the nose you will probably walk away.
Have one chosen landing area but keep others 45 degrees left or right as options if your chosen area is not working out or has some unseen drawback be prepared to smartly take an option.
Above all do not stretch the glide and keep the aircraft flying!
Pace
The main point to consider is to keep the aircraft flying under control.
Very few are killed or seriously injured where the aircraft is flown to the ground under control.
They are killed by stall/spin accidents.
Even taking out a hedge is unlikely to kill you while a ploughed field may remove the nose you will probably walk away.
Have one chosen landing area but keep others 45 degrees left or right as options if your chosen area is not working out or has some unseen drawback be prepared to smartly take an option.
Above all do not stretch the glide and keep the aircraft flying!
Pace
Joined: Feb 2007
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From: Amsterdam
Agree with the above. And for those looking at that glider site, remember that glider pilots generally have more experience, but above all far more time to select a suitable field (minutes vs. seconds) and a far better glide performance to reach a good field.
In a SEP your time and options are very, very limited. Don't waste time trying to find the best field. Instead, make a good, controlled approach into the nearest field that seems good enough.
In a SEP your time and options are very, very limited. Don't waste time trying to find the best field. Instead, make a good, controlled approach into the nearest field that seems good enough.
Joined: May 2001
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From: UK
Do you drive around the country side - better still do you walk?
If you do make a point of asking yourself - "would I land in that field". Ask the question of yourself throughout the year. Chances are lots of those fields will be around your flying cabbage patch. So next time you fly out of your local airport relate what you have seen to what you now see from the aircraft.
You will surprise yourself how quickly your field selection from the air relates to your findings on the ground.
Next, make a point of flying into some of the more challenging strips. Its good fun. More to the point it will improve your landings no end and you will be surprised how much more comfortable you are landing on a slope (and I mean a proper slope), between trees or other challenges that might present - the first few times you will find it really disconcerting, so perhaps take along a seasoned veteran of farm strip flying. I can think of some perfectly delightful farm strips that scare the hell out of even seasoned flyers the first few times - we are really quite cosseted with respect to the usual "airports" most of us operate from. The fact that they are "scary" make it all the more likely the pilot will loose control during the approach. As I think Pace has already said that's what causes severe accidents, but telling pilots not to loose control is all very well, far better to "know" you can land on an up slope between trees and crops because you have done it before.
Finally, as often as you can, when you land decide where you will touch down and make a point of accepting nothing less. Aim to be precise. Don't allow yourself to float that extra 100 feet. As you get better do the same with glide approaches. You will be amazed how many pilots cant land in a 50 foot box with full control of the throttle never mind without. Enter a few competitions - they are great fun and will improve the accuracy of your landings no end.
Should the worst ever happen you will be really surprised what a difference these three suggestions might make.
Your chances of a good forced land will be immeasurably improved by good field selection, accurate control of the approach and potentially just as important, a precise touch down. All of a sudden you can comfortably get into really tight fields feeling confident you will keep control all the way down.
(Of course you could pull the handle and forget all about this
)
(Edited to add: and if you want some real fun book a week (or day) flying a float plane. You will find it is another way of improving your handling and landing selection significantly - but perhaps surprisingly. Why? Well try it in Scotland. You will be flying in very close proximity to the terrain - tight turns into lochs, keeping the aircraft under control, to setup a stable approach, gaining an appreciation of the tell tale signs as to what the wind is doing - there are no wind socks, no helpful controllers to tell you, and surprisingly the wind on one loch can be 180 degrees different from another loch one valley away. Its good fun as well.
In just the same way for something different you will learn so much from flying a glider or with a glider pilot. Doing it every day all day is the way to improve your skills and once learned, whilst its always good to say in practice, it is also a bit like riding a bike)
If you do make a point of asking yourself - "would I land in that field". Ask the question of yourself throughout the year. Chances are lots of those fields will be around your flying cabbage patch. So next time you fly out of your local airport relate what you have seen to what you now see from the aircraft.
You will surprise yourself how quickly your field selection from the air relates to your findings on the ground.
Next, make a point of flying into some of the more challenging strips. Its good fun. More to the point it will improve your landings no end and you will be surprised how much more comfortable you are landing on a slope (and I mean a proper slope), between trees or other challenges that might present - the first few times you will find it really disconcerting, so perhaps take along a seasoned veteran of farm strip flying. I can think of some perfectly delightful farm strips that scare the hell out of even seasoned flyers the first few times - we are really quite cosseted with respect to the usual "airports" most of us operate from. The fact that they are "scary" make it all the more likely the pilot will loose control during the approach. As I think Pace has already said that's what causes severe accidents, but telling pilots not to loose control is all very well, far better to "know" you can land on an up slope between trees and crops because you have done it before.
Finally, as often as you can, when you land decide where you will touch down and make a point of accepting nothing less. Aim to be precise. Don't allow yourself to float that extra 100 feet. As you get better do the same with glide approaches. You will be amazed how many pilots cant land in a 50 foot box with full control of the throttle never mind without. Enter a few competitions - they are great fun and will improve the accuracy of your landings no end.
Should the worst ever happen you will be really surprised what a difference these three suggestions might make.
Your chances of a good forced land will be immeasurably improved by good field selection, accurate control of the approach and potentially just as important, a precise touch down. All of a sudden you can comfortably get into really tight fields feeling confident you will keep control all the way down.
(Of course you could pull the handle and forget all about this
)(Edited to add: and if you want some real fun book a week (or day) flying a float plane. You will find it is another way of improving your handling and landing selection significantly - but perhaps surprisingly. Why? Well try it in Scotland. You will be flying in very close proximity to the terrain - tight turns into lochs, keeping the aircraft under control, to setup a stable approach, gaining an appreciation of the tell tale signs as to what the wind is doing - there are no wind socks, no helpful controllers to tell you, and surprisingly the wind on one loch can be 180 degrees different from another loch one valley away. Its good fun as well.
In just the same way for something different you will learn so much from flying a glider or with a glider pilot. Doing it every day all day is the way to improve your skills and once learned, whilst its always good to say in practice, it is also a bit like riding a bike)
Last edited by Fuji Abound; 28th November 2012 at 12:49.
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,982
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From: In the boot of my car!
(Of course you could pull the handle and forget all about this )
When I get around to taking some hours on the Cirrus even I have been converted to using the handle in Certain engine out situations
Pace
Joined: Sep 2008
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From: West Sussex
It is important to land into wind. If you land with a 10kt tailwind you will have almost twice the energy to dissipate when compared to landing with a 10kt headwind. This energy has to be used up, either in a much longer landing roll or in some other undesirable way. A small field into wind will probably be a better bet than a larger field downwind.
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,982
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From: In the boot of my car!
Dobbin
Agreed the ideal is a headwind and a good brisk headwind but if things are not working out for your landing into that headwind landing spot and you realize you will take out the line of trees in front do not be put off taking a crosswind into better profile fields left or right of you.
The biggest killer is fixation on one spot pulling back to make it and stalling in!
Pace
Agreed the ideal is a headwind and a good brisk headwind but if things are not working out for your landing into that headwind landing spot and you realize you will take out the line of trees in front do not be put off taking a crosswind into better profile fields left or right of you.
The biggest killer is fixation on one spot pulling back to make it and stalling in!
Pace
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,549
Likes: 63
From: UK
For gliding I was taught size, shape, slope, surface, stock, obStructions. Maybe there was a 7th S!
Fences across fields often show themselves in a subtle colour change, posts for phone cables or a single power cable by a little circle round the base. Don't fly between trees on the approach if at all possible as the trees can hide posts carrying cables.
If the field is big enough (think East Anglia) you can get away with a downwind landing, and top choice in the glider world for landing is a stubble field. The farmer doesn't take a very expensive combing through a field with a dodgy surface.
Permanant pasture isn't good as it's often rough, but if it's all you can find...
(edit) I am a map freak so I always have a good look at the map (OS, not just the 1/2 mil) and Google Earth before I (try to) go anywhere new, to get a feel for where it might be hard to find a field and where it might be easier. However in a glider I have a good idea I'm going to need a field for a long time in advance.
Fences across fields often show themselves in a subtle colour change, posts for phone cables or a single power cable by a little circle round the base. Don't fly between trees on the approach if at all possible as the trees can hide posts carrying cables.
If the field is big enough (think East Anglia) you can get away with a downwind landing, and top choice in the glider world for landing is a stubble field. The farmer doesn't take a very expensive combing through a field with a dodgy surface.
Permanant pasture isn't good as it's often rough, but if it's all you can find...
(edit) I am a map freak so I always have a good look at the map (OS, not just the 1/2 mil) and Google Earth before I (try to) go anywhere new, to get a feel for where it might be hard to find a field and where it might be easier. However in a glider I have a good idea I'm going to need a field for a long time in advance.
Last edited by cats_five; 28th November 2012 at 17:43.
Joined: Aug 2012
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From: Wales
Hi, if you look at your chances of finding a suitable field from an agricultural standpoint, you will realise that it is the time of year which is a major factor in finding a good field....
Nov, Dec, Jan, Feb, most fields will be waterlogged, unless frozen.
March, Apr, May; Firm ground and short crops in almost every field.
June, July, Aug; Lots of growth = tall crops. Only harvested grass fields or grazed pasture land available ('Hey you, watch my cows!')
Sept, Oct; Most fields now harvested, but some now ploughed up again.
If size really matters, some counties have some very small, stone walled fields (Yorkshire, Scotland etc.) Whereas Linolnshire and that flat Southern area has some very large 60+ acre flat fields.
Nov, Dec, Jan, Feb, most fields will be waterlogged, unless frozen.
March, Apr, May; Firm ground and short crops in almost every field.
June, July, Aug; Lots of growth = tall crops. Only harvested grass fields or grazed pasture land available ('Hey you, watch my cows!')
Sept, Oct; Most fields now harvested, but some now ploughed up again.
If size really matters, some counties have some very small, stone walled fields (Yorkshire, Scotland etc.) Whereas Linolnshire and that flat Southern area has some very large 60+ acre flat fields.
Joined: May 2008
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From: UK
size, shape, slope, surface, stock, obStructions. Maybe there was a 7th S!
Surroundings.
Last on the list, but when it comes down to a choice of field, where are you going to go after you land. Golf clubs are ideal, as there's usually a bar
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,467
Likes: 189
From: 11 GROUP
Real forced landing
The clue is in the word 'forced'.
Time will be against you,so you have to keep whatever 'system' you choose SIMPLE,and easy to recall.
Fly the machine
Find a spot (that you can reach)
Fly the machine
Be decisive and once you make the decision give it your best shot,rather than be swayed by doubt.
Fly the machine.
Better to make a poor decision,and execute it well than delay and have no choice.
Fly the machine.
Plant it on the desired spot, not to fast, and under full control.
Get some 'sidslipping' practice, it can be a real lifesaver and offers an even better view of whats ahead.Does not have to be full bloodied sideways,but even a gentle 'slip' under full control makes for a very controlled engineless approach.
If you think you may not clear an obstuction and can not turn to avoid DO NOT try to ease the nose up early to get over. Keep your best speed UP and aim just below its top and ease over at the appropriate time.
During 'en-route' stage of any flight keep up to date on the local 'WIND DIRECTION',.Flying downwind or x-wind will give more distance from a given height,and knowing the direction will be one less 'box to tick'
A few glider flights is time well spent.
Jot down FLDIV on your flightplanning form just to remind you it can happen rather than it will.
Being 'AWARE' cuts down the delay in taking action and gives you an edge.
Dont bore the other club members in the bar with tales of how many fields you flew over and could have landed in.
Time will be against you,so you have to keep whatever 'system' you choose SIMPLE,and easy to recall.
Fly the machine
Find a spot (that you can reach)
Fly the machine
Be decisive and once you make the decision give it your best shot,rather than be swayed by doubt.
Fly the machine.
Better to make a poor decision,and execute it well than delay and have no choice.
Fly the machine.
Plant it on the desired spot, not to fast, and under full control.
Get some 'sidslipping' practice, it can be a real lifesaver and offers an even better view of whats ahead.Does not have to be full bloodied sideways,but even a gentle 'slip' under full control makes for a very controlled engineless approach.
If you think you may not clear an obstuction and can not turn to avoid DO NOT try to ease the nose up early to get over. Keep your best speed UP and aim just below its top and ease over at the appropriate time.
During 'en-route' stage of any flight keep up to date on the local 'WIND DIRECTION',.Flying downwind or x-wind will give more distance from a given height,and knowing the direction will be one less 'box to tick'
A few glider flights is time well spent.
Jot down FLDIV on your flightplanning form just to remind you it can happen rather than it will.
Being 'AWARE' cuts down the delay in taking action and gives you an edge.
Dont bore the other club members in the bar with tales of how many fields you flew over and could have landed in.
Last edited by POBJOY; 29th November 2012 at 20:04.