Fixed Wing to Rotary
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 105
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From: Dublin
Fixed Wing to Rotary
Hey guys.
Just a little question that I hope some of you more learned people could answer for me.
At the minute i'm studying for PPL exams however i'd also like to go for my PPL H at some time in the future.
The exams from what i can see are the same Air Law, Met, Nav, HF.
Is the material the same? Does having done your PPL exams mean you dont need to do the PPL H ones?
I read a maximum 6 hours fixed wing can go towards your rotary. Has this been changed?
And finally have any of you done both? Would you advise it? And have you any advice on the topic to give me.
Im planning on posting this in rotary section too to see if i can get more hits.
Thanks for reading all.
Just a little question that I hope some of you more learned people could answer for me.
At the minute i'm studying for PPL exams however i'd also like to go for my PPL H at some time in the future.
The exams from what i can see are the same Air Law, Met, Nav, HF.
Is the material the same? Does having done your PPL exams mean you dont need to do the PPL H ones?
I read a maximum 6 hours fixed wing can go towards your rotary. Has this been changed?
And finally have any of you done both? Would you advise it? And have you any advice on the topic to give me.
Im planning on posting this in rotary section too to see if i can get more hits.
Thanks for reading all.
Joined: Dec 2001
Aviation Qualifications: Military
Posts: 1,286
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From: I have no idea but the view's great.
Angry palm trees be the devil's work.
LASORS Section C2.3 says that you get credit for Aviation Law & Operational Procedures, Navigation and Radio Aids, Meteorology, Human Performance & Limitations and JAR-FCL Communications. So that leaves Flight Planning and Principles of Flight (which for helicopters is known as Theory of Flight as it is unproven - all I know is that if the wings are going faster than the fuselage, it can't be safe).
LASORS Section C2.3 says that you get credit for Aviation Law & Operational Procedures, Navigation and Radio Aids, Meteorology, Human Performance & Limitations and JAR-FCL Communications. So that leaves Flight Planning and Principles of Flight (which for helicopters is known as Theory of Flight as it is unproven - all I know is that if the wings are going faster than the fuselage, it can't be safe).
Fleet Manager
Joined: Aug 2006
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 7,090
Likes: 2,952
From: Ontario, Canada
Wilco,
Yes, I did my PPL(H) a few years back, after 30 years with a PPL(A), then did my CPL(A). CPL(H) is a ways off yet$$.
I can't speak with any knowledge about the UK rules, but In Canada, I got many hours of flying credit toward PPL(H) from PP(A), and only had to sit one 30 question differences exam for Helicopters.
Do your PPL(A) first, so you're not paying the big bucks to be airborne, just to learn which way is up - do that initial flying on something with a low hourly cost.
The two types of flying are surprizingly different, but both very worth learning well. Each will give you respect for the other! I went on to do advanced role training in MD500D's, and was amazed not only at what the helicopter could do, but what I could make it do with my modest skill!
I highly recommend training in Schweizer 300. My choice was not the R22 (I had flown both). After you have 20 hours fixed wing, go threat yourself to an hour in the S300. Ask to have an autorotation demonstrated to you. Fixed wing forced approaches will seem very gentle, with lots of time, after that!
Good luck!
Yes, I did my PPL(H) a few years back, after 30 years with a PPL(A), then did my CPL(A). CPL(H) is a ways off yet$$.
I can't speak with any knowledge about the UK rules, but In Canada, I got many hours of flying credit toward PPL(H) from PP(A), and only had to sit one 30 question differences exam for Helicopters.
Do your PPL(A) first, so you're not paying the big bucks to be airborne, just to learn which way is up - do that initial flying on something with a low hourly cost.
The two types of flying are surprizingly different, but both very worth learning well. Each will give you respect for the other! I went on to do advanced role training in MD500D's, and was amazed not only at what the helicopter could do, but what I could make it do with my modest skill!
I highly recommend training in Schweizer 300. My choice was not the R22 (I had flown both). After you have 20 hours fixed wing, go threat yourself to an hour in the S300. Ask to have an autorotation demonstrated to you. Fixed wing forced approaches will seem very gentle, with lots of time, after that!
Good luck!
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,631
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From: Los Angeles, USA
Helicopters have a habit of biting you with the bug, real hard. After I'd done my PPL A, I got hooked so badly on helicopters I didn't ever want to fly fixed wing again. In fact, I let my PPL A lapse for that very reason - FW just didn't have the allure. Eventually an engine failure (and money) ended my training in H's and I never did do the skills test, even though I was close. And I've since rediscovered the joys of FW and the travel possibilities that it offers, something you can't do in helicopters.
I flew the H300 and like DAR said, they're really nice flying machines. Slow, a little bit dated, but very benign and built sturdy. They have a very forgiving skid that will absorb most abuse. And a gentle autorotation with plenty of rotor inertia compared to the R22. They also have the stick where it belongs - between your legs
Today my finances are better and I'm older and I will probably finish my PPL H after I've done my instrument at some point. I did go up for 2 hrs a couple of months ago and had a great time. Challenging hard work after nearly 16 years, but I could still hover!
I flew the H300 and like DAR said, they're really nice flying machines. Slow, a little bit dated, but very benign and built sturdy. They have a very forgiving skid that will absorb most abuse. And a gentle autorotation with plenty of rotor inertia compared to the R22. They also have the stick where it belongs - between your legs
Today my finances are better and I'm older and I will probably finish my PPL H after I've done my instrument at some point. I did go up for 2 hrs a couple of months ago and had a great time. Challenging hard work after nearly 16 years, but I could still hover!
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 517
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From: London UK
all I know is that if the wings are going faster than the fuselage, it can't be safe
Helicopters are fun! I learned on the R22 because it was the cheapest option, or so I was told. It was still about twice as expensive as fixed wing.
I also found that all those hours practicing hovers, etc improved my fixed wing landings a lot.
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,413
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From: England & Scotland
Funny how we see our machines as the "safe" option. Losing an engine, (not yet happened to me but I practice) I need something the size of a football penalty area with an approach angle of about 45 degrees to put her down safely. I have les than 20 knots fwd speed when I touch down.
I can also land on water, if no grass available.
I think that compares favourably in the survival stakes with greater gliding range but a shallow approach angle at higher touchdown speed, still needing a kilometre of flat grass.
Guess we each love what we do.
Wilcox - get your ticket then book into a heli-friendly hotel or restaurant for lunch with wife or girlfriend (don't take both, they usually don't get on). Lots of brownie points for that one!
John
I can also land on water, if no grass available.
I think that compares favourably in the survival stakes with greater gliding range but a shallow approach angle at higher touchdown speed, still needing a kilometre of flat grass.
Guess we each love what we do.
Wilcox - get your ticket then book into a heli-friendly hotel or restaurant for lunch with wife or girlfriend (don't take both, they usually don't get on). Lots of brownie points for that one!
John
Joined: Dec 2001
Aviation Qualifications: Military
Posts: 1,286
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From: I have no idea but the view's great.
For a helicopter, the precise opposite is true!
Fleet Manager
Joined: Aug 2006
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 7,090
Likes: 2,952
From: Ontario, Canada
so ugly the earth repels it.
"A helicopter is a collection of vibrating parts all fatiguing at a different rate, over an oil spot".
Joined: Dec 2009
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
Posts: 371
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From: New Zealand
I think all fixed wing pilots should have at least one lesson in a helicopter just to get an appreciation for just how different to fixed wing flying rotary flight actually is.
John R81: I don't know where you get the notion that a fixed wing needs 1000m of grass to land on. A lot of the strips I fly from and to are significantly shorter than that.
John R81: I don't know where you get the notion that a fixed wing needs 1000m of grass to land on. A lot of the strips I fly from and to are significantly shorter than that.
Hovering AND talking
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 5,711
Likes: 1
From: Propping up bars in the Lands of D H Lawrence and Bishop Bonner
I think all fixed wing pilots should have at least one lesson in a helicopter just to get an appreciation for just how different to fixed wing flying rotary flight actually is.
On a serious note, one aspect of which a fixed-wing pilot should be aware, is the responses required in an rotary emergency are the converse to those in a fixed-wing emergency. There has sadly been a few rotary accidents/fatalities involving a high-houred fixed-wing pilot but who only had recently passed a helicopter PPL. To that end, I would certainly advise having an instructor who flies both.
Cheers
Whirls
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 282
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From: Southern UK
If trying to maximise benefit of the fixed wing experience prior to rotary get a tailwheel rating and some hours using it.
It nurtures the instinct of using your feet to nail heading and manage yaw rates which is quite a large part of helicopter slow speed handling.
2 cents
W
It nurtures the instinct of using your feet to nail heading and manage yaw rates which is quite a large part of helicopter slow speed handling.
2 cents
W
