Volcanic ash cloud and Private / VFR flying (merged)
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 649
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From: .
At least it provides us with a well-needed respite from all the election bollocks on the telly...
Placing a blanket ban on SVFR is a touch extreme, however... not sure what the thinking behind that is.
No rest for the wicked eh FBW
Smithy
Placing a blanket ban on SVFR is a touch extreme, however... not sure what the thinking behind that is.
No rest for the wicked eh FBW
Smithy
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,040
Likes: 35
From: Home
volcanic ash, where?
Complete and utter overreaction for low level traffic. Tried to go to Jersey this afternoon could go IFR but not even S//VFR available as Zone shut to all traffic. Severe blue sky over most of UK FIR.
Health and safety gone mad.
Health and safety gone mad.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
From: England
I spoke to a radar controller and a member of NATS in the South of England today and although they cannot stop VFR flights they recommended NOT to fly any GA flights. Listening in on the RT with the same controller after midday they made a point of saying "....the pilot must ensure safeflight etc" with a big emphasis on the word safe.
The Metoffice is also showing ash from the surface upwards covering the entire UK now.
Also speaking to an engineer today, he said any volcanic ash that gets into the cylinders is like sand/grit and will wear the engine.
All because the skies are blue does not make it safe to fly. There is no way a GA pilot can ensure the flight is safe when ash is reported from the surface upwards so they should not be flying.
If in doubt still speak with the Metoffice for their opinion before flying.
The Metoffice is also showing ash from the surface upwards covering the entire UK now.
Also speaking to an engineer today, he said any volcanic ash that gets into the cylinders is like sand/grit and will wear the engine.
All because the skies are blue does not make it safe to fly. There is no way a GA pilot can ensure the flight is safe when ash is reported from the surface upwards so they should not be flying.
If in doubt still speak with the Metoffice for their opinion before flying.
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,434
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From: Scotland
I would have thought that any ash capable of damaging an engine would be noticeable by taste, smell or recognised by some other form of human senses.
The sky out there is clear blue, vis, a long way.
More arse covering hype thickened with large quantities of bullsh!t.
The sky out there is clear blue, vis, a long way.
More arse covering hype thickened with large quantities of bullsh!t.
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 13,787
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From: EuroGA.org
I would have thought that any ash capable of damaging an engine would be noticeable by taste, smell or recognised by some other form of human senses.
The sky out there is clear blue, vis, a long way.
More arse covering hype thickened with large quantities of bullsh!t.
The sky out there is clear blue, vis, a long way.
More arse covering hype thickened with large quantities of bullsh!t.
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 395
Likes: 63
From: UK
With regard to cars, let's recall that -
(a) cars generally have air filters and
(b) they are pulling in air much more slowly than a jet hoovering through the upper atmosphere at 500knots or thereby.
So, unless the fall of ash is sufficiently severe that you observe significant visibility drop, I'd not worry unduly about your car.
(a) cars generally have air filters and
(b) they are pulling in air much more slowly than a jet hoovering through the upper atmosphere at 500knots or thereby.
So, unless the fall of ash is sufficiently severe that you observe significant visibility drop, I'd not worry unduly about your car.
A little less conversation,
a little more aviation...
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 696
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From: Bracknell, UK
Ah, its damn tricky stuff this invisible volcanic dust - we got some on the Pitts at Elvington a couple of years ago..absolutely lethal - smashed the ends off the prop, knackered the camshaft and the cylinders and beat the daylights out of the gear. Obviously, we couldn't see the dust, and some might claim it was actually the tarmac hiding underneath the dust that did the damage....but I know invisible killer volcanic dust when I don't see it.
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 896
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From: Strathaven Airfield
Just back from a nice flypast at Glasgow International in a weightshift microlight.
Some things you can do today that you just wouldn't any other day - or every ash cloud has a silver lining!
Some things you can do today that you just wouldn't any other day - or every ash cloud has a silver lining!
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,160
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From: An ATC centre this side of the moon.
Guess that was you that Glasgow phoned me about as they lost contact with you to the west of the zone!!.....said you were going to 129...something, why not call Scottish for a cheery service on 119.875??
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 246
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From: UK
Sometimes you do. When I used to go to the IOM VFR the clearance given was SVFR.
No idea why... I never asked for it.
No idea why... I never asked for it.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
From: England
It's not visible in the air...
Not all dangers to aviation are visible to the human senses. Can human senses detect carb icing conditions from the ground in clear blue skies?
Listen to the experts such as NATS and the MetOffice rather than fall for the 'if you cannot see the danger then it must be Ok' type reasoning.
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
From: sandyland
Cabin Doors
Are not the guys at NATS just wonderful! Thank the Lord they did not recommend the guy to have (with emphasis) a dangerous flight. Get a life, it is your types attitude that has taken the Great out of Great Britain. Just think where we would be had Columbus, Alcock etc listened to the PC and Health and Safety sect. There is I know a GA to ATPL flight school in Al Ain. It is an area that suffers from more or less continual sand ingress as a result of desert winds. Cessnas, A320, A340 B777 all use the facility on a daily basis no problems have been recorded. And before you do, sand can rise to serious flight levels during dust storms and often does. Maybe they fly safe because Nats and the others mentioned are not located out there!
Are not the guys at NATS just wonderful! Thank the Lord they did not recommend the guy to have (with emphasis) a dangerous flight. Get a life, it is your types attitude that has taken the Great out of Great Britain. Just think where we would be had Columbus, Alcock etc listened to the PC and Health and Safety sect. There is I know a GA to ATPL flight school in Al Ain. It is an area that suffers from more or less continual sand ingress as a result of desert winds. Cessnas, A320, A340 B777 all use the facility on a daily basis no problems have been recorded. And before you do, sand can rise to serious flight levels during dust storms and often does. Maybe they fly safe because Nats and the others mentioned are not located out there!
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 13,787
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From: EuroGA.org
The other thing is that that famous 1982 B747 flew into a solid cloud of the stuff, more or less right above the volcano. At night, they would not have seen a thing. All you have is radar, and if the stuff has no water content / conductivity, it won't show up.
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 13,787
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From: EuroGA.org
Was this recently?
I am off to the norffff of engoland tomorrow.... was going to go IFR at FL140 but it doesn't look like that piece of Mac hardware in Brussels, packed to the brim with NATS notams, is going to swallow it...