accident in austria, flight UK to hungary (?)

[fluglehrer]

sad story

Kleinflugzeug im Wienerwald abgestürzt - oesterreich.ORF.at

"...Der Pilot war auf dem Weg von England nach Ungarn. Laut Vermutung der Polizei duerfte der Mann vom Nebel ueberrascht worden sein und die Orientierung verloren haben.
Die Identitaet des Piloten ist noch nicht restlos geklaert. Nach ersten Angaben duerfte es sich um einen Englaender handeln. Das Flugzeug habe eine amerikanische Zulassung aufgewiesen....."


brief summary:

pilot flying from england to hungary,
assumption: loss of orientration in fog,
identity of pilot not yet confirmed,
supposed to be british,
n-registered aircraft


no responsibility is taken for the correctness of this information - news from internet

wolfgang, VIE

[172driver]

Oh sh*t. Wasn't there someone on here a little while ago enquiring about flying to Hungary ? A/c looks like a Malibu....

[vanHorck]

The plane was on approach to Bad Voslau and was in contact with approach according to same article

Looks indeed like a Malibu reg N-4-0-3-H-smthg


new info Ein Toter bei Flugzeugabsturz in NÖ | kurier.at

Mailbu confirmed
No other people on board except pilot
Wreck was found 1 1/2 hour after disappearing from radar

[ifonly]

N403HP was a regular a Shoreham I think.

[IO540]

The callsign, from the pic in that report, is N403H with one more letter after that, probably a P or similar. This one looks identical - this is a Jetprop Malibu conversion.

Very sad. I know this one (if it is this one).

What is the airport ICAO code where it went down?

[vanHorck]

LOAV

(LOAV) Voslau Departures, Arrivals, and Information

[172driver]

LOAV. The nearest met station (if that's what you're after) would probably be Vienna Int'l, LOWW

[IO540]

Yes, just worked that one out too.

METAR LOAV 140800Z 16016KT 8000 BKN008SC 04/02 Q1012 BKN
METAR LOAV 140900Z 16014G24KT 5000 -SHRA BR BKN008SC 04/02 Q1013 OVC
METAR LOAV 141000Z 16014G24KT 5000 BR BKN008SC 04/03 Q1013 OVC
METAR LOAV 141100Z 15012KT 5000 BR BKN008SC 04/03 Q1013 OVC
METAR LOAV 141200Z 14012KT 5000 BR BKN006SC 04/03 Q1012 OVC
METAR LOAV 141300Z 14012KT 5000 BR BKN006SC 04/02 Q1012 OVC
METAR LOAV 141500Z 13012KT 5000 BR BKN007ST 04/03 Q1013 BKN

AMD LOAV 141257Z 1413/1424 15013KT 6000 FEW010 BKN012 TEMPO 1413/1416 4000 BR FEW006 BKN006 PROB30 TEMPO 1413/1416 15015G25KT BECMG 1416/1418 15008KT 4000 BR FEW004 BKN007 PROB40 TEMPO 1421/1424 1200 -DZ BCFG BKN003=

There is only one IAP, a VOR/DME circling one, with a 1500ft MDH.

LOWW 141820Z 14011KT 110V170 9999 FEW006 BKN007 05/04 Q1014 NOSIG=
LOWW 141750Z 14009KT 9999 SCT007 BKN008 05/04 Q1014 NOSIG=
LOWW 141720Z 15012KT 9999 FEW007 BKN008 05/04 Q1014 NOSIG=
LOWW 141650Z 14009KT 9999 FEW007 BKN008 05/04 Q1014 NOSIG=

LOWW 141730Z 1418/1524 14013KT 8000 FEW006 BKN008 TX06/1518Z TN04/1506Z TEMPO 1420/1510 4000 BR FEW003 BKN005 PROB30 TEMPO 1422/1510 14008KT 1200 -DZ BCFG BKN003 PROB40 TEMPO 1510/1518 FEW012 BKN020 TEMPO 1515/1524 15015G25KT=

Vienna LOWW is 15nm away and has an ILS RWY11 with a DH of 200ft.

1200Z ascent Tops around 5000ft AMSL, clear above. Cloudbase right on the deck, more or less.

What is the time of the crash?

[vanHorck]

IO540

No time mentioned yet.

1730 is press posting local time, search was in excess of 1 1/2 hour so crash must have occurred before 1600 local time

[vanHorck]

Plane alledged to have come down west of Bad Voslau near a ruin called Merkenstein, Hohen Lindkogels (some 860m above sea level)

47*58'56.18"N
16*8'32.30"E

according to Google Earth

The airport is just east of the city Bad Voslau, the alleged crash site a few miles to the west of the city

[172driver]

What is the time of the crash?

The Austrian TV website mentions 'missing since early afternoon', so probably around 1400 or so local.

[BackPacker]

There is only one IAP, a VOR/DME circling one, with a 1500ft MDH.

Actually not a VOR/DME circle to land, but a VOR/DME which takes you to a MAPt, at which point you have to cancel IFR and join a VFR circuit if you have the field in sight, or perform a missed approach under IFR to the SSE.

No part of this mixed IFR/VFR procedure, nor the missed approach, takes you west of Voslau. The position that vanHorck listed is 1 nm west of Tango, one of the VFR arrival points, and is about 5 nm west of the airport. Terrain there is 1076 FT MSL, with Tango specifying a minimum of 2500 FT MSL. The VFR circuit is NNE of the field.

If you have access to the Eurocontrol site, here are the procedures and VFR charts:

http://www.ead.eurocontrol.int/eadba...2003-12-25.pdf
http://www.ead.eurocontrol.int/eadba...2005-03-18.pdf

[IO540]

The Jeppesen chart, 30 Nov 2007, shows it as a "circle to land" as the only option. This is standard, as any final approach track which is more than X degrees (30?) off the runway heading is called a circling procedure.

And you must be visual at the MAP which is at 1505ft QNH.

Which is exactly the same thing as you are saying.

Like the EAD plate, the Jepp plate also says you should cancel IFR by the MAP at the latest. So the actual landing is not made under IFR - a curious scheme! Not that it makes any difference in this case...

But why is the EAD plate dated 2003? The Jepp plate says the last change was a general procedure change, which could be anything.

[fluglehrer]

at LOAV
IFR Approach Bad Vöslau LOAV

wolfgang, VIE

[IO540]

The odd thing about this procedure is that you are supposed to cancel IFR when visual, but the missed approach procedure is a clear IFR procedure with a VOR hold.

So, let's say the cloudbase is 1600ft QFE so you get visual just before the MAPt, you cancel IFR, then for whatever reason decide to go missed, and you now need to get an IFR clearance in a damn big hurry, because you are going to be re-entering IMC to fly the missed approach. How is this means to work?

The hold at 4000ft appears to be OCAS so nobody is actually going to care but you will be illegal unless you get a new IFR clearance, and LOAV presumably can't give you one.

[fluglehrer]

ATC over here use the following language in that case:

"......report cancelling IFR or starting missed approach."

so in any case you should be on the 'safe' side, either

continue towards the runway in use, and be able to stay VMC all the time,

or

start missed approach by turning towards SNU VOR and climb.


wolfgang , VIE

PS: presently i don't know whether the pilot had filed VFR oder IFR

[IO540]

presently i don't know whether the pilot had filed VFR oder IFR

Looking at the weather ................... also practically nobody would be flying a Jetprop VFR on a long trip like this; at 1999kg the usual reason for VFR is not there.

[172driver]

Austrian TV website now reports pilot as probably Dutch national en route UK-Hungary. No more new details.

[IO540]

Callsign confirmed as N403HP.

[Butterfly_2]

The pilot was the Vice President of the company I work for and a good friend of me and my colleagues. Many of them, including myself, have often been flying with him in one of his aircrafts (also this crashed Malibu) for business trips. He was a very good and safe pilot. Always very well prepared and never taking any risks. We will miss him!
On my long flights I had with hem, he was always talking to me about flight safety and analyzing aircraft crashes, so now I realize he must have been on these kind of websites more than thousand times.
May he R.I.P.