Flying suits & GA pilots

[egbt]

737

As an aside to the halon thing going on here, I work in telecoms where halon was widely used as a fire extinguisher in computer rooms. Now banned, 'cos you can't breath in halon

Not the case I'm afraid. Halon was used in computer rooms, AFV's and in other enclosed spaces because you could breath in it, provided there was some 02 left after the fire had its share. It was banned for most new installations as it's a CFC.

(Used to work in the industry!)

[MLS-12D]

youngskywalker, don't sweat it ...

It's easy to put your foot in your mouth when contributing to these forums; we've all done it.

[tonker]

If the smoke usually gets you first, do all those who wear egoflage also take a smoke hood?

I average 5-8 hours a day as an instructor and ensure i wear comfortable clothing that puts me in the right frame of mind, something that would do far more for my safety than rolling up dessed like Mav or Goose and then spending the day sweating my nuts off in flammable cotton.

Good point made about driving to the airfield in standard clothing, but in a far more hazardous arena.

[MLS-12D]

Smoke hoods would probably be a good idea in some aircraft (i.e., 'spam cans'). Personally, I usually fly aircraft with canopies that can be opened or jettisoned.

driving to the airfield ... a far more hazardous arena

Incorrect. See generally "The most dangerous part of gliding ...", Aerokurier, February 1993, reprinted 1/98 Free Flight, pages 7, 8 and 18. Although aimed at soaring, similar facts apply to flight in light airplanes.

egoflage ... dressed like Mav or Goose

Your sneering comments have no place in this thread. You're free to wear whatever clothing you wish, but please don't ridicule those who choose otherwise; it's simply discourteous.

[Lisa Simpson]

Went to lunch yesterday and walked passed all the visiting pilots and noted one was proudly sitting legs akimber, wearing a bebadged flying suit. Didn't really think much more of it as we have some ex RAF jets and a Harvard.

As i was driving out i witnessed the pilot sat i his Robin having pre departure heroic photos taken. Odd i thought....he'd taken off his flying suit to go flying!!!!!!!!

What sought of mental state do you have to be in to don a flying suit to walk to a club house for lunch?

[Small Rodent Driver]

Now then.

Sounds like there could be a market for a natty two piece Nomex combo of jacket and trousers. Nice shade of dark green perhaps. Couple that with a Nomex shirt and clip on tie and hey presto! anonymity.

Nobody would know whether you were a safety conscious pilot or just moonlighting for Eddie Stobart.

[Genghis the Engineer]

Coming to this slightly cold, but as a known flying suit wearer.

- What good reason is there NOT to wear one? They are comfortable, keep your clothes clean, have pockets in the right place, and (in extremis) may aid your safety.

The badge issue, and the RAF-green issue are stylistic. I confess that I wear an RAF suit and it has several badges on it. There are two reasons for this. Firstly I have several that I was issued with and haven't worn out yet, secondly I wear the same suits for work flying, where the badges have some significance. I could take them off - but why?


When the green ones wear out (always supposing Lizzie's enterprises doesn't invite me back, which is possible but probably unlikely) I shall buy a different colour.

But in the meantime, of-course many other people wear green growbags who have never been in a military cockpit. This is presumably because they are cheaply and readily available second hand, very comfortable and hardwearing, and perhaps a lot of PPLs like that bit of tacit oneness with the most professional flying organisation in the world?

G

[MLS-12D]

What good reason is there NOT to wear one?

The only good reason that I know of is that they are hot in the summer. Personally, that is an inconvenience that I am prepared to put up with.

that bit of tacit oneness with the most professional flying organisation in the world

This is not the first time that Genghis has made this sort of bombastic reference to the RAF.

Which air force (or non-air force company, unit or association, come to that) is "the most professional flying organisation in the world" is of course highly subjective; and assuming that the RAF has no competition for that title is just plain stupid.

England has many great traditions of which it may rightly be proud; but the reputation of presumptious arrogance isn't something that anyone with any sense would want to perpetuate. It's time to move on (the Empire is no more, and thank God for that!).

Please, let us have no more of this sort of mindless parochialism.

[J.A.F.O.]

No, sorry, Genghis was right.

[egbt]

bombastic reference to the RAF

Hardly that I think.

and assuming that the RAF has no competition for that title is just plain stupid

Who assumed that?

I think we are allowed our little illusions, of course this is not one of them

I suspect the pilots from colonies who have shown such distinguished service with the RAF would agree and probably understand the Britsh sense of humour better than MLS-12D

[Genghis the Engineer]

Glancing at my logbook, I have at various times been in a professional capacity on board aircraft with Captains serving at that time in the British Army, RAF, RCAF, USN, RN, USAF, Flygvapnet, Armee de L'Air, Royal Thai Air Force, RAAF. Also civilian Pilots employed or qualified by UK-MoD, Westland Helicopters, Cranfield and Embry-Riddle Universities, Slingsby, Rand Kar, Air Atlantique, several Eastern European companies, Britten-Norman, P&M, PFA and BMAA. I've also flown as a passenger with airlines from BA to CSA to Aeroflot, and in various roles with more flying instructors, at more flying schools, than frankly I've any intention to count or list. I have logged 93 aircraft types as operating crew, around half of those in command.

On that basis, it is my considered opinion that the RAF is the most professional flying organisation in the world - this doesn't take away from the fact that most of the organisations I've listed above are also extremely professional, but somebody has to be first.

Sorry MLS, but that's just the way it is.

G

(Mind you, I'd love to spend a few days with the RAFDS, about whom I've heard impressive things).

[Hold27Left]

Genghis the Engineer - Well said


Remember people.. its better to be safe than sorry ..!

[M609]

As an aside to the halon thing going on here, I work in telecoms where halon was widely used as a fire extinguisher in computer rooms. Now banned, 'cos you can't breath in halon

We used to have a CO2 system in our approach control room. (Military, basement, EMP secure with 4M thick walls), but the health and safety people concluded that the chance of us getting out if it fired (alive) was about NIL.
Brilliant idea to install in the first place.....

I confess to being a PPL student with a sage green suit on order. Now....if I can find the badges I wore on the M98 uniform from the RNoAF when I was deployed last winter, I will complete the poser look!

[MLS-12D]

it is my considered opinion ... that's just the way it is.

Ah; now I see. Your opinion is definitive.

I suspect the pilots from colonies who have shown such distinguished service with the RAF would agree and probably understand the Britsh sense of humour better than MLS-12D

One of my grandfathers (English-born) served in the RCAF. He would not agree.

"Colonies", indeed. Some sense of humour.

one-punch-mickey: no disrespect to Scotland (the Brave). I am well aware that England and Britain are not one and the same, and that many Scots have played an important role in the RAF. However, Scots have long suffered from English arrogance, and I didn't want to include you in my complaint.

this is essentially a British website

That was not previously known to me. Now that I have been advised, I will no longer contribute to it.

[Genghis the Engineer]

I believe that the correct term for states such as Canada or Australia is "Self Governing Dominions", we no longer have many colonies (although most of those, like Gibraltar and the Falklands seem quite happy about it).


Now can we get back to talking about (*&*(&(*( flying suits?

G

(Scots born, of English ancestors, consider myself British, and wear flying suits on most occasions I'm in an aeroplane. And anything I post on here is my opinion, I've nobody else's to give).

[G-KEST]

Hello there,

Back after a spell in the USA and a saga of response to CAA charging consultations. Now for a bit of light relief.

In our Skybolt I normally wear a bonedome and a flying suit, usually a surplus USAF since their tailors accomodate my portly but vertically challenged frame better than those who supply the RAF. If display flying then I usually wear one of several very different flying suits or, on occasion, a djellabah when in character as my Arab cousin. In phenominally hot weather I have been known to fly it is a pair of shorts, sandals and a tee shirt but that is a bit stupid if only for the odd bit of lurking locking wire that just loves bare skin.

All the above is true of my flying in any open cockpit aeroplane.

In conventional cabin aircraft I wear normal (?), for me anyway, clothing and a standard headset unless, once more, when I am display flying. I then revert to the garb worn in our Skybolt.

In terms of material I prefer Nomex or equivalent but appreciate the protection is but minimal in an Avgas fire. My instructions to RFFS at airshows is that if the aircraft has been burning in the cockpit area for longer than 30 seconds then would they please first deal me a very smart blow on the head with their heaviest fire axe. Though I know one of the UK's finest plastic surgeons as a personal friend, at 67 I have no wish to suffer the utter agony of 90% third degree burns for longer than I need.

I own five bonedomes -
Two RAF Mark 1 with inner cloth helmets, oxygen mask microphone and RAF electrics.
One ex-USAF Gentex helicopter helmet with boom mike and US military standard electrics plus a convertor to civil compatibility.
One ex-USAF Gentex fighter helmet with boom mike and civil electrics.
One civil Helmets Limited Mark 10 with boom mike and civil electrics.
The last two have Headsets Inc. ANR modifications that make long trips bliss. Unless you have tried it you will not believe the difference in sound comfort levels.

I really do believe in bonedomes since, in the first of my two airshow non-landings (aka crashes), my ex-RAF Mark 1 bonedome was utterly smashed on the right side in a manner similar to the effect of hitting a boiled egg shell at breakfast. If I had been wearing a cloth or leather helmet then it would have been my skull that took the impact. I know of at least one such accident where the attractive and skilled female aerobatic pilot lived on as a complete vegetable for three years after the accident before she mercifully passed away.

It is sensible to wear clothing appropriate to the task. If others regards it as posing then so be it. My views and garb will not alter.

Cheers,

Trapper 69

[aluminium persuader]

Flew into Rougham on Sunday, and wore my flying suit this time rather than leave it decorating the back of the door in my spare room. Cooked rather in the sun that came out PM, but felt safer at least.

Here's a fast ball from the out-field:

My kids' car seats (which they need in the a/c) are lovingly crafted in plastic, polystyrene & nylon. Oh,

Now, maybe there's a market for...!

[Deaf]

Is there something that can be added to cotton, wool etc as a flame retardent. I seem to recall something reasonably common (ammonium sulphate?) added to to rinse water. This was back in the days of nightdresses and kerosene heater.

[Alvin Steele]

I own a pair of RAF flying gloves for pre-flighting this was because I was fed up getting silly niggly little cuts.........(you know the sort...the tiny ones that bleed profusely all over your clothes during the flight......and you don't have an Elastoplast)
That said, I do feel self concious about them and dont wear them in flight (apart from the time I flew a 152 with an oily throttle stem)
I completely agree about the nomex suits safety merits, but I'd feel a dweeb wearing one in one of the clubs DR400's, I wouldnt have a hang-up about them in a Cub, Chippie etc etc or in any type during aero's training.....but in your regular typical spam can I would feel self concious....but thats just me.
I did like the idea of the earlier poster of nomex trousers and tops designed more for the PPL spam can drivers, deffo a market there......Transair, are you listening?

On to light aircraft risks, I may be deluding myself, but I feel a hell of alot more scared during the drive to and from the airfield than I do whilst flying.
The cost,time and effort required to learn to fly eliminates many lunatics that driving a car can't, aside from the usual suspects in dangerous driving....the boy racer, you have idiots on mobiles, drink, drugs.....taking the row they've had with their 'other halves' out onto the roads....not to mention 'visitors' to the country who haven't passed a test or are driving on their own country's license...........then there are motorbikes.


Tim.....(you didnt really think I was called Alvin did you?)

[aluminium persuader]

Know what you mean, Alvin, but the average car is much stronger that an a/c, has airbags all over and much bigger doors and much less fuel. Plus when an accident is imminent you hit the brakes to a stop you're not then going to rapidly accelerate in a downwards direction. I'd guess that most g/a accidents happen at t/o or ldg, by extension arond the 60-80kts area. Make that 80-100 mph in something resembling a citroen Dyane with large fuel tanks tucked nicely on each side, add a nasty x-wind, wet runway etc ...!

However, always look on the bright side; might never happen!