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A plea to BA ground staff

Old 23rd Jan 2011, 16:24
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A plea to BA ground staff

Please, please, please do not treat passengers as so many parcels or live cattle. Please, please, please remember that the money we have paid for our fares goes to pay your salaries. Please, please, please remember that we (the passengers) are the sole reason you (the ground handling staff) are in work and earning money.

We do not want to be called from the lounge or elsewhere to the gate with the announcement that boarding has commenced, and upon arrival at the said gate find that it is not even open.

Please do not tell us it is because you need to have all the passengers rounded up and ready to board. After a few times this defeats the object of the exercise. Regular passengers will not dutifully roll up for your all-too early summonses, because they know you will not start the boarding process for at least another 15 minutes, and we do not like standing in a small area, queuing or otherwise.

Passengers are forced to queue enough as it is when travelling. For example, the queue to check in, another queue for security, a queue to buy currency, queues to get on and off the aircraft, a queue for border controls, a queue for baggage (unless on a day trip - which means I have hand baggage), a queue for taxis. I think you get the picture.

Our time is just as valuable as yours is and you are not doing us any favours at all by condescending to "allowing" us to fly with your employers.

Do not bully elderly passengers with threats of denying them boarding because they have the temerity to ask why they are being kept waiting and when they will allowed to actually board the plane they have been waiting for. Their command of the English language and British Airways' arcane boarding procedures may not be as good as yours.

(This message was inspired by the truly appalling behaviour of two totally self-satisfied and utterly complacent women in BA uniforms at gate Axx at T5 on Friday morning last.)

Last edited by Chuchinchow; 23rd Jan 2011 at 20:10. Reason: Gate number erased to give the guilty parties a fighting chance.
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Old 23rd Jan 2011, 18:25
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That, along with other reasons, is why I go out of my way not to fly with BA. It is not until you start flying with the other airlines you realize what a dinosaur BA really is
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Old 23rd Jan 2011, 23:05
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Whilst I do not condone bad customer service have you ever thought they may be pissed off with being blamed for all the points you yourself are complaining about?
Queues at checkin - staff numbers cut to the bone (if you are short staffed you get on with it , no minimum levels like crew have)
Queue at security - Staff employed by another company
Queue at currency exchg - Staff employed by another company
Queues to get on/off aircraft - because no-one listens and just want to be first on and off
Queue at border control - Staff employed by Government
Queue for baggage - it can take a while to get bags from aircraft depending on stand and other a/c pushing back stopping you reaching the baggage hall
Queue for taxis - What can I say it's another company.
Unfortunately queues are a part of airport/aviation life these days.
One of the reasons you are called to gate early is to try and get everyone in place for when boarding commences, even a small delay can have a huge knock-on effect to the operation and cost a lot of money.
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Old 23rd Jan 2011, 23:42
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May I ask which company you work for, Chuchinchow?

I may have done business with it and should that be the case I just want to make sure that my name is spelled correctly on your pay-check, you see.

Then I will have a good moan about how -since everything is not perfect all of the time- everything is not good enough all of the time. I always feel taller and better after having propped myself up by putting others down.

And now back to the re-run of Upstairs, Downstairs.
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Old 23rd Jan 2011, 23:56
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May I ask which company you work for, Chuchinchow?
You most certainly may, KBPsen. I work for myself.

Baggersup

Got it in one!
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 00:25
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Please, please, please remember that the money we have paid for our fares goes to pay your salaries. Please, please, please remember that we (the passengers) are the sole reason you (the ground handling staff) are in work and earning money.
I'm not ground crew, but last time a passenger (he was rather .... rude, to put it mildly) said " I pay your wages" to me, I laughed it off and told the Captain the story while serving him his tea; minutes later, a "ding dong" in the cabin was heard so off I go to answer the flight deck's call. Only for the Captain to tell me that he's been calculating the said pax's contribution to my wages/year. After taking into consideration (all in average) price and profit of/on (not in a particular order): fuel/landing fees/catering/ parking fees/ ticket price/ pax charge (is it 10 euros in DUB these days?)/ crew salary/ number of pax ( he mentioned a lot of figures and fees - really clever guy, miss flying with him), turns out that a pax's contribution towards my wages was, at the time, exactly 17pence. So he called me into the flight deck, gave me a 20p coin and asked me to give it to said pax as a full refund of his contributions towards my wages with Captain's compliments!

Let me make one thing clear. YOU don't pay our wages. You merely contribute towards our wages, if that... Put it this way, you pay for an airline ticket, I'm crew on board, by purchasing your ticket you contribute towards my wages and so on...
BUT! As I get off the aircraft, I pay to rent your car/ buy a ticket to ride the bus you're driving/ pay tax to the council and you're a public servant/ pay tax to the NHS and you're a paramedic/ and i could go and on and on and ON!

Don't be such a patronizing little so and so... We ALL pay each others wages, somehow.

Quote:
May I ask which company you work for, Chuchinchow?
You most certainly may, KBPsen. I work for myself.
Good for you, with your attitude business must be blooming!
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 05:50
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Tighslot appealed for more intelligent postings, so let's try to provide one:

After taking into consideration (all in average) price and profit of/on (not in a particular order): fuel/landing fees/catering/ parking fees/ ticket price/ pax charge (is it 10 euros in DUB these days?)/ crew salary/ number of pax ( he mentioned a lot of figures and fees - really clever guy, miss flying with him), turns out that a pax's contribution towards my wages was, at the time, exactly 17pence.
17p x 72 million pax per year = £12,240,000 margin. (Mind you, I think the captain missed a few important costs and salary was double counted), if you look at the bigger picture.

Then there is the matter of payments from airports to Ryanair, for that passenger to arrive at their destination (shouldn't we all descend down a red carpet, if we are sooo valuable?)

Plus inflght sales, car hire, hotels, that the airline gets a slice of.

So customers are revenue streams and employees are overheads, in the final analysis.

Abusing the Sky does make one true point, though, that we are all interdependent for paying each others wages.

It's just that most businesses do not

bully elderly passengers with threats of denying them boarding because they have the temerity to ask why they are being kept waiting and when they will allowed to actually board the plane they have been waiting for.
As a regular user of Terminal 5, I have to agree with Baggersup and CCC about the local knowledge required to navigate it

In particular, the apparent inability to announce gates ahead of time, so that one does not encounter the A/B lounge dliemma, as well as the Magical Mystery Tour that is A10, so remembering

Their command of the English language and British Airways' arcane boarding procedures may not be as good as yours.
is a core competence, IMHO.

Last edited by Joao da Silva; 24th Jan 2011 at 06:06. Reason: Replace Ryanair 2009 pax figures with 2010
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 08:19
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That, along with other reasons, is why I go out of my way not to fly with BA. It is not until you start flying with the other airlines you realize what a dinosaur BA really is
It's all a matter of perspective. I usually fly with AA but due to their recent codeshare agreement with BA I've ended up on a few trans-Atlantic flights with BA. I now worry about AA because BA's service blows AA out of the water and suspect many US-UK commuters might change their loyalties. In any case, I understand I'm coming from the lowest common denominator but you have to consider that BA still has a long way to fall to get to US airlines' levels.
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 08:32
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CCC

If you feel that badly about it, why don't you do something about it, other than rant on here. Use yer feet.

To spout on about how you pay peoples wages, really makes you sound like a jumped up little $%^&.

BA use our oil - does that mean they pay my wage?
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 08:41
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Chuch, did you write to BA and explain what happened? I think that would be a much more productive use of your time.
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 09:11
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Good for you, with your attitude business must be blooming!
It hasn't been this good for a long time, thank you. Turnover has increased by 37% over the same period in 2010, so we must be treating our clients properly.

You see, our secret is to keep our clients totally informed of what is going on. If we need to ask them to do something we tell them why, when and how. If there is any change in plan they are informed in good time.

We do not keep our clients in the dark, we offer them the respect they deserve, and we do all possible to keep them.

Clients, customers - passengers even - are always aware that is THEM who have the choice of using the company or organisation that serves them best.

If not, they take their business elsewhere.
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 09:17
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Chuch, did you write to BA and explain what happened? I think that would be a much more productive use of your time.
Indeed I did.

I await BA Customer Services' usual anodyne, neutral, and ever so slightly missing the point response that BA send out to any criticism.
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 10:05
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Angel

Chuchinchow,

Just out of interest, why do you keep on using us and have you used any other airlines recently or any other LHR terminals.

You see you seem to hate us as an airline.

I know you hate cabin crew like me commenting on threads like this but just was interested to hear your reasons for sticking with us.

Thanks Hokulea for those nice comments about BA.
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 10:15
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You see you seem to hate us as an airline.

I know you hate cabin crew like me commenting on threads like this but just was interested to hear your reasons for sticking with us.
Betty Girl

It is telling that you have used the word "hate" twice in one message.

I neither "hate" you as an airline, nor do I "hate" cabin crew like you or anyone else. British Airways is neither worse nor better than any other air transport company. It is very noble of you to spring to your employers' defence at every possible opportunity, but not every employee is necessarily as dedicated and as zealous as you are in maintaining customer goodwill.

Please, Betty Girl, remember PPRuNe's cardinal rule: kick the ball, not the player.
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 10:50
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Angel

Well sorry that you see my post like that.

The only reason I used that word twice was because that feeling oozes out of a lot of what you post.

Having said that, I do find you quite amusing at times and so would miss it if you didn't post.
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 11:12
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Service delivery

Service delivery requires everyone in the chain to respect their role in the chain and to respect the customer.
Whilst BG clearly delivers her part of the bargain, it does happen in BA that other folk do not always deliver their part of the bargain.

As to "who pays wages", er, it is simple. Whilst I have not said that to people in the service sector, the fact is that some folk in the service sector can forget the customers' perspective some times.

I guess there are exceptions, where everyone delivers great service, but the whole team do need to work at it.
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 12:10
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Churchinow perhaps I can pass on a little anecdote and see if that will alter your thought process..........

Over a 10 years period some time back my father averaged a flight as a passenger every 10 days. He flew a variety of airlines in UK, Europe, USA and Canada, and having had an interest in aviation all his life was probably more clued up about how things worked than most who fly.

When I started working for an airline in the mid 70's I quickly realised that he actually didn't know too much about the whys and wherefores of an airport operation. It caused quite a few interesting discussions between us at first. There are a multitude of difficulties placed in the way of the simple process of getting passenger checked in and to the boarding gate, and very few are there because of the airline(s)

As a passenger it isn't necessary for you to know everything about how it works, in the same way you don't have to know exactly how a power station is manned and managed in its operation. Obviously it is necessary to give you information re flight status in good time. 'Flight Boarding' or similar such as 'Gate Open' are generic terms used to put it in the passengers mind to get to the gate.

One of the most frustrating delays is 'late passengers to the boarding gate'. It is bad enough when it is only two or three, but if over 15 then it is a big problem. Unfortunately passengers have so many distractions on the way to a boarding gate (coffee shops, shops of all sorts etc) that it happens way to often.

Have you wondered why staff who arrive new to the company keen and eager to do well and good at interfacing with customers can fade into 'processors'? Alas a lot of the passengers who now fly are bored with the experience and maybe even dislike it. They just want to get the flight over with with as little interaction with others as possible. So after a few years the bright and cheery staff member learns to keep low key and minimalist in the way they deal with passengers. Sad but true. As with many areas in life, the ability to interact is removed by the need to be 'efficient and productive'.

I agree there are some bad staff in all companies, and there are some good staff having a bad day perhaps............... but whilst BA is not my airline of choice I do think you have gone over the top in yr criticism and the comment re paying their wages is a bit of a red herring as you only pay a small proportion and not everyone feels as you do.

I think I am right in saying that the year that BA won the 'Worlds Favourite Airline' award, they also finished top of the list for the least favourite! They just carried so many more passengers than most others.
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 13:55
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But can't we expect professional behaviour?

Everyone seems to be ignoring what I assume really got Chu-ey's goat:
Do not bully elderly passengers with threats of denying them boarding because they have the temerity to ask why they are being kept waiting and when they will allowed to actually board the plane they have been waiting for.
Once we've flown from T5 - or any major - once or twice, we realise that we are being processed, which I don't like, it makes me feel like a piece of cheese. But when agents behave as unprofessionally as
the ... two totally self-satisfied and utterly complacent women
seem to have been doing, then surely there's reason for complaint?

Isn't there?

Anyone want to address that?
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 15:54
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At T5 my strategy is always to arrive at the gate (this is assuming the flight is on time) slightly less than 10 minutes before the 'gate closes' time on the boarding pass. I find this means most people have already boarded and you are also 'protected' from them closing the flight without you on board.

However, exceptions to this are
- domestics when overhead space is at a premium
- longhaul from T5B where they normally have a seperate line for Club, First and Silver/Gold which works pretty well.

However I take the OP's point that T5 is a bit of a nightmare for a first-timer, but as soon as you learn how to use it properly it becomes very efficient indeed. But you need to learn!
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Old 24th Jan 2011, 17:42
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If you think T5 is bad now , wait until T5C is up and running
There will be a Hell of a lot less bussing which is good but I agree with the above. T5 works well with those who are familiar......
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