BA Strike - Your Thoughts & Questions
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How many flights can some one get per year or is it unlimited and this is where seniority would come into play?
Are these for long haul as well as short haul.
Are they class limited..economy/flexible economy/business/First?
That figure is an Awful lot of trips.
From the main CC thread it appears the union asked that the TS be reinstated and they would suspend industrial action..not cancel it.
And i believe that Unite have allready said many of the proposals on the table are significantly improvements to the last offer ( but worse than what was offered last year)
but Bassa just keep saying no. And have even voted with a show of hands for a " no negotiation" stance.
As a normal working Joe this is what gets me so damn mad about the strikers and i suspect the rest of BA and the country. V, Good pay, excellent perks and they are striking.
Me and my Wife can't even afford premium economy when flying atlantic. I sincerely hope CC TS isnt pushing the price up of anything other than economy seats by creating an artifical scarcity. Mind saying that, while 60,000 is a lot in the scheme of things its a drop in the ocean.
Are these for long haul as well as short haul.
Are they class limited..economy/flexible economy/business/First?
That figure is an Awful lot of trips.
From the main CC thread it appears the union asked that the TS be reinstated and they would suspend industrial action..not cancel it.
And i believe that Unite have allready said many of the proposals on the table are significantly improvements to the last offer ( but worse than what was offered last year)
but Bassa just keep saying no. And have even voted with a show of hands for a " no negotiation" stance.
As a normal working Joe this is what gets me so damn mad about the strikers and i suspect the rest of BA and the country. V, Good pay, excellent perks and they are striking.
Me and my Wife can't even afford premium economy when flying atlantic. I sincerely hope CC TS isnt pushing the price up of anything other than economy seats by creating an artifical scarcity. Mind saying that, while 60,000 is a lot in the scheme of things its a drop in the ocean.
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Keep it up BASSA!
I would like to say thank you to BASSA, as due to the IA BA have have just renewed Mrs. J's gold memember even though it looked like she would drop down to silver.
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From the other thread... The CAA and Boeing have just approved a drop in minimum crew on the 767 down to 5 for under 240 pax.I don`t know if this was from a request by BA but it could mean 1 more crew off a 767.
Perhaps BA are planning their rostering with 2500 fewer CC for a few (3) months. Perhaps this ties in with the September recruitment? I for one would accept a lower service for this period if it got rid of the grumpy 'wagon dragons' and allowed BA to restore a sensibly costed service.
My sympathies lie with those whose, perhaps misguided/misdirected, actions will cause them to regret their stance.
Perhaps BA are planning their rostering with 2500 fewer CC for a few (3) months. Perhaps this ties in with the September recruitment? I for one would accept a lower service for this period if it got rid of the grumpy 'wagon dragons' and allowed BA to restore a sensibly costed service.
My sympathies lie with those whose, perhaps misguided/misdirected, actions will cause them to regret their stance.
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Wagon Dragons
I for one would accept a lower service for this period if it got rid of the grumpy 'wagon dragons' and allowed BA to restore a sensibly costed service.
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I'm rather amazed that Mr. Holley's missives are about crews over-indulging, cakes and pouting that he hasn't met Mr. Walsh, rather than serious issues regarding what this strike means for BASSA's members.
Clearly, Mister Holley has nothing substantive to write about as - to paraphrase Willie Walsh some months ago - he is not sitting at the top table. On the contrary, Duncan Holley is on the table.
Last edited by Chuchinchow; 30th May 2010 at 09:30.
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giggle
Pre coffee fug and it has just occured to me this whole dispute is like lord of the rings.
I think we are at Return of The king.
Saruman is defeated and locked in his tower ( Duncan H). Aragorn ( Willie Walsh ) is taking a breather wondering what to do. The Orcs ( BA strikers) are now looking at unite for leadership. Unite ( Sauron) are bottled up in their fortress desperately making plans for a final push.
Supporting cast
Nazgul/Wrath Riders .. Bassa Reps
Golem...Mr Simpson
Hobbits..Working CC
gave me a giggle anyway.
I think we are at Return of The king.
Saruman is defeated and locked in his tower ( Duncan H). Aragorn ( Willie Walsh ) is taking a breather wondering what to do. The Orcs ( BA strikers) are now looking at unite for leadership. Unite ( Sauron) are bottled up in their fortress desperately making plans for a final push.
Supporting cast
Nazgul/Wrath Riders .. Bassa Reps
Golem...Mr Simpson
Hobbits..Working CC
gave me a giggle anyway.
After all the claims and counter claims running through the thousands of posts on this sorry saga, perhaps it is time to remind ourselves that the initial dispute was about whether Cabin Service Directors should take an active part in the service to passengers.
To protect their hallowed 'managerial' roles on world wide fleets, a BASSA council dominated by CSDs was prepared to lead 12000+ cabin crew (many working under completely different conditions) into a twelve day strike over Christmas. Even though that was avoided, their subsequent actions have caused untold damage to BA and alienated most of the other staff in the airline. As an ex-union man, I cannot recall any industrial action which has had so little support - never mind active antagonism - from the staff as a whole.
I have yet to see it denied on these forums that many of the BASSA council have conveniently been able to avoid personal consequences by being off sick.
I feel very sorry for junior crew who have been so cruelly misled and may see their future careers blighted by the stubborn refusal of their 'leaders' to accept the reality of the economic situation facing the airlines of the world.
SB
To protect their hallowed 'managerial' roles on world wide fleets, a BASSA council dominated by CSDs was prepared to lead 12000+ cabin crew (many working under completely different conditions) into a twelve day strike over Christmas. Even though that was avoided, their subsequent actions have caused untold damage to BA and alienated most of the other staff in the airline. As an ex-union man, I cannot recall any industrial action which has had so little support - never mind active antagonism - from the staff as a whole.
I have yet to see it denied on these forums that many of the BASSA council have conveniently been able to avoid personal consequences by being off sick.
I feel very sorry for junior crew who have been so cruelly misled and may see their future careers blighted by the stubborn refusal of their 'leaders' to accept the reality of the economic situation facing the airlines of the world.
SB
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Wisdom from the "other" thread
As for the ex employee who represents BA crew. I watched some of the Lord of the Rings movie and its clear that that you cannot give up the ring of power unless it is prized from your fingers. Ask Mugabe, Blair, Brown and the ex employee who still represents cabin crew.
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Scotbill you raise a very good point.
I do believe that BA could do themselves a favour by stating publicly:
(1) How many BASSA reps are off sick long term.
(2) How many BASSA reps deliberately avoided striking by going off sick at the time.
I don't think people understand the levels deceit from these well-paid phonies. They are the pigs from Animal Farm (no, not the famous Dutch movie, the George Orwell classic).
If you are signed off sick and spotted at Bedfont, you should be dismissed for defrauding the company.
If you were claiming sickness benefits and going off partying, they'd be all over you like a cheap suit; why should private companies have to hold to a higher standard? At the very least, it would weaken their unfair dismissal claim.
I do believe that BA could do themselves a favour by stating publicly:
(1) How many BASSA reps are off sick long term.
(2) How many BASSA reps deliberately avoided striking by going off sick at the time.
I don't think people understand the levels deceit from these well-paid phonies. They are the pigs from Animal Farm (no, not the famous Dutch movie, the George Orwell classic).
If you are signed off sick and spotted at Bedfont, you should be dismissed for defrauding the company.
If you were claiming sickness benefits and going off partying, they'd be all over you like a cheap suit; why should private companies have to hold to a higher standard? At the very least, it would weaken their unfair dismissal claim.
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Simpson on BBC News 1030
Giggling his way through questions as though butter wouldn't melt! Taking shots at WW who has suggested more talks in 3 weeks! THAT.............is very interesting. Simpson didn't think so and nearly burst a blood vessel. Unite appear to think they are blameless and have tried all they can. Why don't they try getting BASSA to start living in the world we live in?
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RTR
Simpson is really p****d off because Mr Walsh has refused to meet him for at least a week whilst Unite have their Manchester love in.
Simpson knows that the strike is failing & that in a week's time there will be no requirement for further talks as BA will be pretty well back to normal & Bassa will be neutered.
I'm supporting BA!
Simpson knows that the strike is failing & that in a week's time there will be no requirement for further talks as BA will be pretty well back to normal & Bassa will be neutered.
I'm supporting BA!
Originally Posted by ChicoG
I do believe that BA could do themselves a favour by stating publicly: (1) How many BASSA reps are off sick long term. (2) How many BASSA reps deliberately avoided striking by going off sick at the time.
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Just looked at the interview again and the BBC report that WW he was willing to meet them in Manchester - Unite turned that down. Simpson said that WW then said he could "meet them the week after next." Simpson was staggered by that. Wonder what he was expecting?
As for Duncan Holley I still say that he should keep his mouth shut. I could never be persuaded that ANYONE who is not recognised as representing BASSA members. i.e. by default he no longer has contact with BA since being sacked by them or the office facilities that BA provided. His position in a court of law would almost certainly be persona non grata. Unless an eagle can tell us otherwise.
As for Duncan Holley I still say that he should keep his mouth shut. I could never be persuaded that ANYONE who is not recognised as representing BASSA members. i.e. by default he no longer has contact with BA since being sacked by them or the office facilities that BA provided. His position in a court of law would almost certainly be persona non grata. Unless an eagle can tell us otherwise.
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Unite are in a daydream!
Listening to Simpson on BBC at lunchtime today I thought what bad luck for the striking BA CC to have joined such a dumb union. Simpson was absolutely convinced that BA had called the strike! Mr Simpson please remember UNITE CALLED THE STRIKE, not BA. This has to be a nail in the coffin for unions that cannot negotiate properly on behalf of their members. The writing was on the wall for all BA crew - both flight deck and cabin - and there was never any doubt that serious economies had to be made. It is the managements job to manage and they are working hard to get the airline onto a sustainable long term financial footing. If they don't all the BA jobs are at risk. All I can say is that from what I am hearing a very substantial number of strikers are rueing the day they decided to strike and even more the day thay decided to join BASSA. There is hope for us all!
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"How does staff travel work?
Travel concessions are a non-contractual benefit provided at the company's discretion
Current and retired staff used more than 60,000 bookable concessions during 09/10, a significant rise since a more flexible policy was introduced in April 2009.
The airline incurs direct costs of putting an additional passenger onto a plane and the costs of the infrastructure that supports staff travel.
Colleagues pay a £10 booking fee to cover some of the costs.
Although strictly a personal tax liability, BA chooses to pick up the tax bill on behalf of both employees and pensioners and settles this with Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs every year."
I worked for the best part of 50 years, without any "perks". I have read all the cc posts elsewhere and know enough that there are many very good people working for BA.
That said, reading these posts it is difficult not to conclude that BA has become an airline run for the benefit of its employees. Cheap/free flights and tax liability paid by the company.
Should I and my family continue to patronise these people? I think not.
Travel concessions are a non-contractual benefit provided at the company's discretion
Current and retired staff used more than 60,000 bookable concessions during 09/10, a significant rise since a more flexible policy was introduced in April 2009.
The airline incurs direct costs of putting an additional passenger onto a plane and the costs of the infrastructure that supports staff travel.
Colleagues pay a £10 booking fee to cover some of the costs.
Although strictly a personal tax liability, BA chooses to pick up the tax bill on behalf of both employees and pensioners and settles this with Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs every year."
I worked for the best part of 50 years, without any "perks". I have read all the cc posts elsewhere and know enough that there are many very good people working for BA.
That said, reading these posts it is difficult not to conclude that BA has become an airline run for the benefit of its employees. Cheap/free flights and tax liability paid by the company.
Should I and my family continue to patronise these people? I think not.
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Diplome - The DS interview can be found on the BBC iPlayer at the following link starting at 07:45 into the programme:
BBC iPlayer - The Andrew Marr Show: 30/05/2010
BBC iPlayer - The Andrew Marr Show: 30/05/2010
