Purpose of boarding card 'check' at aircraft door
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Mark in CA
Don't be surprised.
A lot of posters are UK based and form their view of the world from their location.
They are unaware that things work differently in other places.
Don't be surprised.
A lot of posters are UK based and form their view of the world from their location.
They are unaware that things work differently in other places.
Last edited by Final 3 Greens; 31st Aug 2009 at 09:44. Reason: removed 'blissfully' from the last sentence
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Mark in CA
Don't be surprised.
A lot of posters are UK based and form their view of the world from their location.
They are bllissfully unaware that things work differently in other places.
Don't be surprised.
A lot of posters are UK based and form their view of the world from their location.
They are bllissfully unaware that things work differently in other places.
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L'aviatur
I wasn't trying to be arrogant, just explaining to Mark from CA why he saw the posts he saw. I'll edit my response and remove the word 'blissfully', as this probably gave the wrong impression.
What I was trying to say is that UK airlines must check the BP at the door, the regulations impose this.
These quotes appear to be from UK based posters, some of whom seem to be unaware that other countries operate in different ways - e.g. check the comment about 'every flight' below. Some make emphatic statements which are just wrong. Others state the regulatory reason for the check.
This is a view from outside the UK, where the regulations are different
I wasn't trying to be arrogant, just explaining to Mark from CA why he saw the posts he saw. I'll edit my response and remove the word 'blissfully', as this probably gave the wrong impression.
What I was trying to say is that UK airlines must check the BP at the door, the regulations impose this.
These quotes appear to be from UK based posters, some of whom seem to be unaware that other countries operate in different ways - e.g. check the comment about 'every flight' below. Some make emphatic statements which are just wrong. Others state the regulatory reason for the check.
I've never understood why people feel the need to question this: it's the procedure on every flight, has been for years.
I never understand why people think they should only have to show it once.
At the airline I work for, if you don't have a boarding card for the flight you are trying to board, you will not be allowed on the plane.
The final check is to ensure that PAX are onboard the correct aircraft.
It is a security procedure, all we are checking is the flight number and the date to ensure that you are supposed to be on this aircraft.
If it annoys people so much, then stick to flying with Lufty or Swiss where you only have to show it the once at the gate.
Last edited by Final 3 Greens; 31st Aug 2009 at 09:59.
It isn't exactly one of life's biggest inconveniences is it. Sometimes I get on a flt and they check the card and point which way to go - I know which way to go but they are familiar with people who have no clue and think that 61F is a left turn at the door and into the comfy seat with the pillows by the window at the front. Sometimes I get on and the cabin crew aren't bothered. I'm not mithered either way - as long as I get a big glass of wine I'll be a happy camper either way.
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I'd like to butt in for a minute, if you don't mind..
Most incidents/accidents etc happen due to a chain of events. As far as I'm concerned, checking the boardin pass several times before you get on board might be inconvenient, but the more people check it, the less chance of being part of the chain of events. Humans make errors, therefore we double check things, not just boarding passes. Arming doors, check lists are a couple of things that springs to mind.
Gg
Ps. It is of course true about checking the boarding pass to make sure the right people are on board - as a security check. (Just to clarify)
Most incidents/accidents etc happen due to a chain of events. As far as I'm concerned, checking the boardin pass several times before you get on board might be inconvenient, but the more people check it, the less chance of being part of the chain of events. Humans make errors, therefore we double check things, not just boarding passes. Arming doors, check lists are a couple of things that springs to mind.
Gg
Ps. It is of course true about checking the boarding pass to make sure the right people are on board - as a security check. (Just to clarify)
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Put it this way, i would still check boarding passes even if the company wouldn't ask us to.
The number of times i had to send pax back to the gate, it's unbelievable. And to the dispatcher posting saying "it wasn't gate staff's fault" well... i know it was their fault, you know it was their fault so save it pal... for someone who actually TRUSTS the gate staff.
We all know that majority of pax pack their brains with their check in bags... Hell, i do it, and i work in the industry!
Jeez, the number of times i was just walking through the terminal having returned from Boots happily holding my "Boots Meal Deal" bag, and been "approached" by BmiBaby pax demanding to know why their flight has been cancelled... I'm sorry sir, i really am, but i don't work for Bmi... You lot are all the same, 'effing this and 'effing that...
It doesn't work that way. In my base we have 7 company a/c. The "earlies" and "lates" go off at about the same time. Boarding through gates next to eachother.
I usually have 2 or 3 pax or couples going through say the Malaga gate when they're supposed to fly to Murcia. Hence why we check the boarding passes. And we heard it all before: "Oh i just put it away", "Oh she never gave me a boarding pass","Oh she took it away", "Oh for
sake, why do you need it again?", "Oh you people are just ridiculous", "Oh i don't need a boarding pass, i'm So and So..."
So please, we kindly ask you to keep your boarding pass with you and show it when entering the aircraft. It's not exactly rocket science, is it?
The number of times i had to send pax back to the gate, it's unbelievable. And to the dispatcher posting saying "it wasn't gate staff's fault" well... i know it was their fault, you know it was their fault so save it pal... for someone who actually TRUSTS the gate staff.
We all know that majority of pax pack their brains with their check in bags... Hell, i do it, and i work in the industry!
Jeez, the number of times i was just walking through the terminal having returned from Boots happily holding my "Boots Meal Deal" bag, and been "approached" by BmiBaby pax demanding to know why their flight has been cancelled... I'm sorry sir, i really am, but i don't work for Bmi... You lot are all the same, 'effing this and 'effing that...
It doesn't work that way. In my base we have 7 company a/c. The "earlies" and "lates" go off at about the same time. Boarding through gates next to eachother.
I usually have 2 or 3 pax or couples going through say the Malaga gate when they're supposed to fly to Murcia. Hence why we check the boarding passes. And we heard it all before: "Oh i just put it away", "Oh she never gave me a boarding pass","Oh she took it away", "Oh for
sake, why do you need it again?", "Oh you people are just ridiculous", "Oh i don't need a boarding pass, i'm So and So..."So please, we kindly ask you to keep your boarding pass with you and show it when entering the aircraft. It's not exactly rocket science, is it?
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ATS
Not wishing to be controversial, but I live in a country where there is no requirement to check BPs at the door and with an active airport - very active in summer.
Yet, talking to my friends at the airport and in the airline ground support business, there are very few instances of pax boarding the wrong aircraft and these are identified by careful headcounts, which are SOP on the local airline.
I wonder why this happens so much in the UK?
Genuinely interested, not trying to provoke you.
At first glance, I'm wondering if the UK ground handling is less professional than the Maltese?
Not wishing to be controversial, but I live in a country where there is no requirement to check BPs at the door and with an active airport - very active in summer.
Yet, talking to my friends at the airport and in the airline ground support business, there are very few instances of pax boarding the wrong aircraft and these are identified by careful headcounts, which are SOP on the local airline.
I wonder why this happens so much in the UK?
Genuinely interested, not trying to provoke you.
At first glance, I'm wondering if the UK ground handling is less professional than the Maltese?
Am I not correct that it is a cabin crew SOP requirement of the UK CAA (and possiby others) but is not universal. Hence why you get asked for the card on Easyjet but not on Ryanair (and apparently, according to the above, not in the USA).
What pax find tedious is not the having to comply with rules, no real problem there, but it is the inconsistent (to them) approach, where on Flight 1 you don't have it ready at the door and are reprimanded for holding thngs up, then on Flight 2 you try to show it to the only crew member visible, working the galley by the door, and are reprimanded for interrupting them.
Could be mostly solved, where required, by a notice at the gate saying "You will need to show your boarding card again at the aircraft door". No, apparently such thinking is beyond airline management thinking.
What pax find tedious is not the having to comply with rules, no real problem there, but it is the inconsistent (to them) approach, where on Flight 1 you don't have it ready at the door and are reprimanded for holding thngs up, then on Flight 2 you try to show it to the only crew member visible, working the galley by the door, and are reprimanded for interrupting them.
Could be mostly solved, where required, by a notice at the gate saying "You will need to show your boarding card again at the aircraft door". No, apparently such thinking is beyond airline management thinking.
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WHBM
You are correct on both counts.
For frequent travellers, not such a big deal, as we tend to know who does and does not wish to see the BP and act accordingly.
The irritation for me (as FQTV) is the less frequent pax holding things up searching through coats and bags for the BP, although in many cases I can't really blame them because no one told them to keep the BP handy.
I note that Jetset lady commented, on another post, that she now reminds the gate staff to tell the pax to show the BP at the door - that is helpful.
You are correct on both counts.
For frequent travellers, not such a big deal, as we tend to know who does and does not wish to see the BP and act accordingly.
The irritation for me (as FQTV) is the less frequent pax holding things up searching through coats and bags for the BP, although in many cases I can't really blame them because no one told them to keep the BP handy.
I note that Jetset lady commented, on another post, that she now reminds the gate staff to tell the pax to show the BP at the door - that is helpful.
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"Notice at gate".
WHBM,
A good idea but with one major snag!
What are the chances of anyone actually reading and inwardly digesting such a notice? Very low I should think!!!
A good idea but with one major snag!
What are the chances of anyone actually reading and inwardly digesting such a notice? Very low I should think!!!
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F3G, to answer your earlier question:
My experience, world wide, working for different airlines, is that pax boarding the wrong aircraft happens often enough for it to be a worthwhile check, regardless of the SOPs of the particular airline or the security culture of the airport, or where it's located geographically.
A good example is Antigua where there may be two BA flights returning to LGW within an hour or so of eachother. The amount of times I've had pax from the later flight try to board the earlier flight is worrying. If this is not picked up at the door, and the pax actually travel, it's the crew who get reprimanded, not the groundstaff - who are outsourced anyway.
I've flown under a number of authorities - Canadian, Icelandic, British, Irish, Australian and they have all required BPs at the door. I've never known any different. As suggested earlier, a clear request during the boarding call does help but there's usually one or two that don't seem to hear it.
My experience, world wide, working for different airlines, is that pax boarding the wrong aircraft happens often enough for it to be a worthwhile check, regardless of the SOPs of the particular airline or the security culture of the airport, or where it's located geographically.
A good example is Antigua where there may be two BA flights returning to LGW within an hour or so of eachother. The amount of times I've had pax from the later flight try to board the earlier flight is worrying. If this is not picked up at the door, and the pax actually travel, it's the crew who get reprimanded, not the groundstaff - who are outsourced anyway.
I've flown under a number of authorities - Canadian, Icelandic, British, Irish, Australian and they have all required BPs at the door. I've never known any different. As suggested earlier, a clear request during the boarding call does help but there's usually one or two that don't seem to hear it.
I would expect more than one or two. There's plenty of analysis available about the penetration of messages. If you start with "Flight 123 to London now ready for boarding at gate 45 ......" everyone is then getting up, assembling bags, marshalling their children, walking to the queue, etc - normal behaviour in this situation, and so the rest of any message will likely be lost. You have to put the messages one at a time, and when the pax are most likely to have their BC in their hand so they don't put it away again. Hence the prominent notice at the gate approach.
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At many of the domestic gates at LHR T1, bmi have put up signs in the jetty and also make annoucements in the gate reminding people to keep their boarding cards out to show the cabin crew, yet still we get many passengers who have shoved it back in their bags / jackets. Also we ask to see a boarding pass as many of the jetties have access to the ramp which isn't visible from the aircraft or the gate. How do I know that you're not a cleaner, caterer, baggage handler that fancies a quick trip somewhere exciting?
It's SOP on BA. But even there, I've seen a guy (non- native English speaker with very poor English) end up on a Nice flight when he thought he was going Copenhagen! Of course, the CC were able to help him before it got to be a problem - they even had someone who spoke his language.
I've seen it a few times in the US with people rushing off at the alst minute because they were on the wrong flight - so checking has a useful purpose. I suspect it helps the CC identify the frequent travellers early on, too.
I've seen it a few times in the US with people rushing off at the alst minute because they were on the wrong flight - so checking has a useful purpose. I suspect it helps the CC identify the frequent travellers early on, too.
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Suprised and amused
I am a little suprised at the attitude some of the FC have about us self loaders, I know most pax leave their brains at home and act like two year olds as soon as they enter the airport. However to shout at people who have asked what seemed like a reasonable question begs of bad manners and arrogance - if we are that bad then do not work with us.
But I am glad to see that there are some reasoned responses on here
In saying that even as a vff 100 + flights a year - even I cock up, trying to catch Virgin Nigeria in Lagos back to LGW the staff at the door managed to notice I was about to board the Jo Burg flight and sent me packing. So there is a good reason for the checks and they do work. Do not take it out on the staff they are just doing their job.
But I am glad to see that there are some reasoned responses on here
In saying that even as a vff 100 + flights a year - even I cock up, trying to catch Virgin Nigeria in Lagos back to LGW the staff at the door managed to notice I was about to board the Jo Burg flight and sent me packing. So there is a good reason for the checks and they do work. Do not take it out on the staff they are just doing their job.
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I'm not sure I fully understand the problem with having to show one's boarding pass.
Does it take a lot of brain power to do so? How many calories are expended whilst lifting one's arm up to show CC the pass? How many additional hours does it cost by doing so? (You're probably stalled at the cabin door anyway, waiting for someone to finally get their 95lb. "carry on" bag hoisted into an overhead.)
Does it take a lot of brain power to do so? How many calories are expended whilst lifting one's arm up to show CC the pass? How many additional hours does it cost by doing so? (You're probably stalled at the cabin door anyway, waiting for someone to finally get their 95lb. "carry on" bag hoisted into an overhead.)