Nail Clippers are BACK!
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Nail Clippers are BACK!
Just seen on the BBC news that small blades (under 3cm), scissors, metal cutlery and of course that deadliest weapon of all - your nail clippers are going to be allowed back on aircraft.
What are security folk going to do now to make themselves feel important?
What are security folk going to do now to make themselves feel important?
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I think you will find it depends on what airport and airline you fly from/with.
As for security i think you will find 99% of Security officers are sick and tired of taking such items of people because of all the grief and abuse they get off pasengers and staff.They are only following the orders of the DFT and the Airlines.
Maybe one day the the Security staff alot of people slag off on pprune might save a few hundred lives including yours by doing a job you think is a waste of time.
As for security i think you will find 99% of Security officers are sick and tired of taking such items of people because of all the grief and abuse they get off pasengers and staff.They are only following the orders of the DFT and the Airlines.
Maybe one day the the Security staff alot of people slag off on pprune might save a few hundred lives including yours by doing a job you think is a waste of time.
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Maybe one day the the Security staff alot of people slag off on pprune might save a few hundred lives including yours by doing a job you think is a waste of time.
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Once again it is the inconsistency of a policy that infuriates the pax, not to metion the crew.
Recently I flew inter-continental with a european flag carrier of high repute. The pilots walked amongst the S.L.Cargo. and we were provided with metal cuttlery.
The home base security search was the usual, and a second passport check at boarding was, as now, the norm.
Speaking to other European long-haul operating colleagues, they also use common sense and stretch their legs over the oceans.
Can we please have a total return to a common sense approach to the aspect of avaiation security. Is it true that nail clippers, or any of the other restricted articles, can do more damage than that demonstatred by passengers wielding un-opended, or perhaps half comsumed, bottle of hooch.
The sooner arrival duty free- is introduced the better.
The policy, as is, is half baked; like the people who introduced it.
Recently I flew inter-continental with a european flag carrier of high repute. The pilots walked amongst the S.L.Cargo. and we were provided with metal cuttlery.
The home base security search was the usual, and a second passport check at boarding was, as now, the norm.
Speaking to other European long-haul operating colleagues, they also use common sense and stretch their legs over the oceans.
Can we please have a total return to a common sense approach to the aspect of avaiation security. Is it true that nail clippers, or any of the other restricted articles, can do more damage than that demonstatred by passengers wielding un-opended, or perhaps half comsumed, bottle of hooch.
The sooner arrival duty free- is introduced the better.
The policy, as is, is half baked; like the people who introduced it.
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I can't wait, I really just can't wait to take a corkscrew through BHX security. Or will this simple pleasure be denied me by their paranoid leader issuing a local rule reaffirming the corkscrew as a lethal threat to aviation? If she does I guess I'll just have to take two pairs of nail clippers through!
What a magnificent opportunity to flaunt a physical manifestation of common sense in the face of those goons!! Deep joy!
What a magnificent opportunity to flaunt a physical manifestation of common sense in the face of those goons!! Deep joy!
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I still can't understand why they bother confiscating bladed items when you can walk into any Boots store once through security and proceed to buy razor blades, nail clippers, etc. just before boarding the aircraft.
Best thing I've seen at BAA Heathrow was a pilot having a the knife from a set of cutlery in his flight bag removed at security - he was allowed to keep the fork. Don't really think the Captain would need cutlery should he want to bring down the aircraft he was in command of...
Best thing I've seen at BAA Heathrow was a pilot having a the knife from a set of cutlery in his flight bag removed at security - he was allowed to keep the fork. Don't really think the Captain would need cutlery should he want to bring down the aircraft he was in command of...
Paxing All Over The World
OK, let me say it one more time for those that have not travelled much ... dear old Brit gov say that airlines not allowed to give pax metal cutlery.
Airlines very pleased as plastic cutlery does not have to get washed for reuse and it does not matter if it gets stolen.
Potential hijackers very pleased as plastic fork is sharper than metal. It has to be to compensate for being brittle.
Lastly, the airline will sell us the weapons we need when they sell a litre bottle of whiskey. Or, they will encourage us to bring a laptop on board by providing power and (some) web access for it when we are airborne. A laptop weighing 2.5kg is a significant weapon.
A pair of nail clippers is not. Yes, I know they are just doing their job and it is not their fault that they are trying to earn a living implementing stupid rules! But, they should try to implement them [pun intended] in a less than stupid fashion.
--------------------
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you any different." Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
Airlines very pleased as plastic cutlery does not have to get washed for reuse and it does not matter if it gets stolen.
Potential hijackers very pleased as plastic fork is sharper than metal. It has to be to compensate for being brittle.
Lastly, the airline will sell us the weapons we need when they sell a litre bottle of whiskey. Or, they will encourage us to bring a laptop on board by providing power and (some) web access for it when we are airborne. A laptop weighing 2.5kg is a significant weapon.
A pair of nail clippers is not. Yes, I know they are just doing their job and it is not their fault that they are trying to earn a living implementing stupid rules! But, they should try to implement them [pun intended] in a less than stupid fashion.
--------------------
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you any different." Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
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BBC News article
Does this mean I can now carry the Kensington lock for my laptop without fear that I might use it to garrotte someone?
Does this mean I can now carry the Kensington lock for my laptop without fear that I might use it to garrotte someone?
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Accompany wife on holiday via EGBB. Security man points out her metal hair clip is a lethal weapon and must be confiscated. With much reluctance she removes clip for confiscation and her neatly tied up hair falls over her shoulders and thus has to be combed out (in security of course). A few metres further on another identical hair clip is purchased from Boots and installed in wife's hair restoring its original appearance. Cost of original hairclip £4, cost of replacement £8. Are the airport rip-off shops working in league with these security nerds? (Needless to say no problem on return flight from Lanzagrotty.)
Of course this problem will continue as hair clip is longer than 3 cms.
P.P.
Of course this problem will continue as hair clip is longer than 3 cms.
P.P.
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So now we need to get some lawyers onto re-instating all the nail clippers confiscated from passengers in UK airports.
At the last count, there were about six tons of them.
Then there should be a supplemental penalty for hardship and stress - yep, could be a killing to be made there!
At the last count, there were about six tons of them.
Then there should be a supplemental penalty for hardship and stress - yep, could be a killing to be made there!
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"Best thing I've seen at BAA Heathrow was a pilot having a the knife from a set of cutlery in his flight bag removed at security - he was allowed to keep the fork. Don't really think the Captain would need cutlery should he want to bring down the aircraft he was in command of..."
While some of the items confiscated do seem daft, the arguments often presented that pilots can harm their plane anyway don't work.
If pilots weren't searched they could be used to carry weapons or bombs through security. These could then be given to passengers on other flights. So if passengers can't have an item for security reasons, pilots can't have it either.
It may sound implausible, but it is incidents at the 1 in 10 million level that people are trying to prevent.
While some of the items confiscated do seem daft, the arguments often presented that pilots can harm their plane anyway don't work.
If pilots weren't searched they could be used to carry weapons or bombs through security. These could then be given to passengers on other flights. So if passengers can't have an item for security reasons, pilots can't have it either.
It may sound implausible, but it is incidents at the 1 in 10 million level that people are trying to prevent.
OK, here's the definitive TSA "Can I take it, can't I take it" list.
http://www.tsa.gov/interweb/assetlib...-1-2005_v2.pdf
(Corkscrews, nail clippers, nail files, plastic cutlery all get an unequivocal "Yes".)
The common sense evidenced by the list is diametrically opposed to virtually all my experiences with TSA and similar organisations (and I have to say that UK airports are top of the list for small-mindedness and sheer pettiness. Not to mention officiousness)
http://www.tsa.gov/interweb/assetlib...-1-2005_v2.pdf
(Corkscrews, nail clippers, nail files, plastic cutlery all get an unequivocal "Yes".)
The common sense evidenced by the list is diametrically opposed to virtually all my experiences with TSA and similar organisations (and I have to say that UK airports are top of the list for small-mindedness and sheer pettiness. Not to mention officiousness)
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Beausoleil
You just don't get it, do you? Pilots can 'harm their plane' anytime, anyplace - fact - and their is nothing you or your mindless 'I only follow orders' colleagues can possibly do about it. Get it into the grey mass between your ears that a pilot does not need a bomb to bring a plane down. He/she needs nothing except the will to do so. That is why you are wasting your time with physical security checks of flight crew.
You just don't get it, do you? Pilots can 'harm their plane' anytime, anyplace - fact - and their is nothing you or your mindless 'I only follow orders' colleagues can possibly do about it. Get it into the grey mass between your ears that a pilot does not need a bomb to bring a plane down. He/she needs nothing except the will to do so. That is why you are wasting your time with physical security checks of flight crew.
Paxing All Over The World
PV, "Does this mean I can now carry the Kensington lock for my laptop without fear that I might use it to garrotte someone?" that's a good one. I never thought about that!! Have they stopped you with this before? I have not used mine for a while so have not had it x-rayed recently.
Mind you, I did cause mild concern a few years ago, bringing a 1910 vintage telephone through from South Africa. That big double coil, the dome of the bells and a solid external casing looked VERY good on the x-ray!!
Mind you, I did cause mild concern a few years ago, bringing a 1910 vintage telephone through from South Africa. That big double coil, the dome of the bells and a solid external casing looked VERY good on the x-ray!!
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judge11 - For interest, the reason given to us by our employer for crew searches goes approximately as follows.
A member of the Flight Crew may have been placed under duress (e.g. family threatened/hostage) and thereby forced to bring an item through security for use in-flight by a third party.
I make no comment whatsoever as to the validity of this reason: I am simply making you aware of the reason we are given in order that you may reach your own decision as to its' merits.
A member of the Flight Crew may have been placed under duress (e.g. family threatened/hostage) and thereby forced to bring an item through security for use in-flight by a third party.
I make no comment whatsoever as to the validity of this reason: I am simply making you aware of the reason we are given in order that you may reach your own decision as to its' merits.
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If I was under duress, I'd get whatever I wanted past the Hitler Youth and YTS employees. However, I'm not, so I don't have to. But I'd love to have a "get out of Jail free card" just to test the system. Unfortunately, that won't be issued. I also bet that those who do test the system are the same type of people who normally do this sort of job and are just as obvious - some low grade civil servant with clipboard. Untill a proper method of security checking takes place (less obvious, more focussed and done by people have the ability to get a job in Burger King) I hope that I'm not the target. Unfortunately, the current system is merely "window dressing" taken for political reasons.
Untill I have to, I'll play the game and be Mr Grey.
Untill I have to, I'll play the game and be Mr Grey.
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As I've said before on this forum, shortly after the 11-9 debacle, I was discussing the heightened security with my F.O.:
"What I don't understand," he said, "Is why these civil servants insist on inventing their own stupid security procedures and it never occurrs to them to consult security experts about the problem which are freely available to them.
Unlike me, my F.O. was ex-RAF and was referring to our armed forces!
P.P.
"What I don't understand," he said, "Is why these civil servants insist on inventing their own stupid security procedures and it never occurrs to them to consult security experts about the problem which are freely available to them.
Unlike me, my F.O. was ex-RAF and was referring to our armed forces!
P.P.
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Further to the comments w.r.t. duress upon ones person:
One wouldn’t need to take anything through security, one could simply pass them the axe…. and / or maybe a (glass?) bottle of highly flammable booze (which one can buy onboard, forsooth !) + cigarette lighter, ..... and / or maybe one could simply let them into the flightdeck and show them how to lock themselves in as one leaves it ?!
Of course, if arguing that my family being under some supposed threat on the ground might cause me to act under duress in the air, is so strong, then surely the same argument is even stronger should my family happen to be travelling in the passenger cabin and would it not therefore be more sensible to allow them to travel in the flightdeck with me ?!
I’ve said it for years, i.e. the present security rules are illogical, ill-conceived, and are very difficult to defend due to all the inconsistencies, local variations and the general lack of joined-up thinking.
…. and another thing; Osama Bin Laden would pass the Disclosure Scotland security check, because he is not disqualified through having any UK criminal convictions – now there’s a thought !
One wouldn’t need to take anything through security, one could simply pass them the axe…. and / or maybe a (glass?) bottle of highly flammable booze (which one can buy onboard, forsooth !) + cigarette lighter, ..... and / or maybe one could simply let them into the flightdeck and show them how to lock themselves in as one leaves it ?!
Of course, if arguing that my family being under some supposed threat on the ground might cause me to act under duress in the air, is so strong, then surely the same argument is even stronger should my family happen to be travelling in the passenger cabin and would it not therefore be more sensible to allow them to travel in the flightdeck with me ?!
I’ve said it for years, i.e. the present security rules are illogical, ill-conceived, and are very difficult to defend due to all the inconsistencies, local variations and the general lack of joined-up thinking.
…. and another thing; Osama Bin Laden would pass the Disclosure Scotland security check, because he is not disqualified through having any UK criminal convictions – now there’s a thought !