The major issue with your suggestion Keg is deployability and the airline's willingness to let their pilots who are "on loan" to the military do 6 months in a place ending in stan in a war zone. If the airlines would allow it, would the personnel even commit to going?

Hi Keg,

Plenty of guys in the PAF would stay in flying the B737-BBJ or similar and find it a seriously hard choice to leave if they thought for a second there was any permanency to the posting.

Different equation entirely for those spending most of their lives in the sim or the desert on P3s/Hercs.

Just a guess, but I reckon if you conducted a poll, morale at 34SQN would run rings around most Squadrons in the RAAF right now. Best leave 34SQN as a carrot for those interested in a PAF career. Despite popular belief, 34SQN isn't the 'departure lounge' for the airlines.

Best use the reservists in the Squadrons they departed from...


Ali,

I know of one fella who had several months leave of absence from QF around 2004 to go to the desert as a RAAF reservist. I believe obtaining the leave wasn't an easy task. He had his own reasons but I can't imagine too many guys being interested.

VI

Fair enough lads.

I recently happened to fly with the former QF CP who over the years had a number of discussions with various CAFs and senior RAAF members about possible structures for RAAF BBJ and other flying and how that integrated with QF demands. Obviously the tight strength of QF drivers compared to what should be our establishment prevented the discussion from progressing too far but I do know of QF drivers who in the past have been able to get enough time off to stay current on the F/A18, upgrade to the Hawk, current on the Herc, etc. Given that we have lots of guys current on the 737 and A330 I still reckon that the deal can be done to suit both sides.

Surely if Qantas pilots have enough free time to remain current on RAAF aircraft, they could alternatively apply this effort towards... flying for Qantas :}

With the possible exception of the SO position at QF, ex-RAAF drivers would not be interested in giving up too many days off to fly in the Reserve. With 8-10 days off giving the RAAF a few is of no benifit to the individual or the SQN.

Last time it was "we'll train our way out of it".

Can't say that this time, coz the training system has been left to rot, requiring a sizeable investment to get it up to speed in order to handle the projected demand. Because it isn't fast jets, Shep doesn't really care.

Now it appears to be "the reserves will save us". The RAAF need to be very careful here. Reserves are used to supplement the regular force, not replace them. Relying on reserves leaves potential to get bitten.

How about pulling some SQNLDR/WGCDR types recently posted out of FLTCDR/CO positions into ground jobs back to flying jobs to help stand up new units and help out existing units?

A bit too "outside the box" for some of our airships to comprehend, methinks!

'Big wheel keeps on turning.......' - Creedence CW

and turning , and turning, and turning....(yawn)

Only after QF had their arm twisted by the brass in Canberra. Same goes for war deployment, Qantas were asked nicely and responded with a no. Suffice to say those who needed to go went...... :} Patriotism only extends so far when you run a company!!

HoIt' happening right now Captain Sand Dune. Where I work we have pulled in a WGCDR and a SQNLDR to fill 2 FLTLT QFI positions. The WGCDR is like a pig in the proverbial and will stay forever if they let him.

Hi all
First time, long time.....

Air Force operates on an average funded strength. ('Average' being the key word.) Provided you're not making a habit of it, it all washes out. Not ideal, but it is a drop in the bucket. (And remember there are always CE positions that have not been filled but are funded.)

But somewhere out there is a WGCDR job not being filled....or someone on HDA...:)

Spacebar old son,

you should write in english and use only aviation jargon (not military jargon) if you want other folks to understand you.

Also heard that all squadron leader P3 pilots have left or in process of leaving from the P3 units. There are also rumours of a bonus as used in previous years.

RM

RM: Good point, well presented. Apologies to all - some habits die hard.

CE= Constrained Establishment. In essence: the number of positions the RAAF has to work with.

HDA = Higher Duty Allowance. You don't have the rank but they want you to do the job of the higher rank? No problem. HDA means you're paid at the equivalent rank level of the job description. (some conditions do apply - see instore for details):)

How many are we talking here? 3? There have never been too many SQNLDR pilots at 92WG. Plenty of NAV's and AE's to fill those positions.

There are a few maritime SQNLDR pilots in project/staff positions. Well, I know of one....:rolleyes:

ruprecht.

PAF - all I can say on this forum that a bonus for some pilots is likely (if a new government should agree...)

RM

Apparently not true. The bonus, which had some momentum for a few months, is dead in the water; stopped 'at the highest level'. Read into that what you want. Pilot pay will now be reviewed during the 08 pay review body sitting - if that's not too late. Shep genuinely believes there's no problem......

Army pay it
Navy do it
RAAF has done it for ATC
But is is already to late, it would have been cheap and effective to do it a year ago but those that are going have gone/going.
The difference between now and in the past is those that are left will have people with 1000hrs on type as the grown ups instead of the 4-5000hrs they have in the past.
It must be great to hear for those in ground jobs that higher ranks are taking FLTLT slots in flying jobs, that will help!

In the past I saw exodus cycles within the RAAF, mid to late 80's, mid to late 90's. Worthless retention schemes were implemented. (Interest free loans)

Right now there are more airline jobs available or becoming available in our region, or commute from Aus positions, than has ever existed in history. Failing an economic bust (on the cards as always) the RAAF will lose every guy that is able to leave and wants to do so.

CAF pull your head out of the sand or the period 2010 to 2015 will reflect the safety record of 1989 to 1994.

Very interesting times indeed...

Anyone like to speculate on what the future holds?

I dont think any more money is coming our way. And if they changed their stance on this front wouldn't it be a source of embarrasment for them?

Margy,
interesting that you suggest a bonus was halted at the highest level. I am aware that in Sept 07 some high level paperwork was being actioned!
We shall see...