Atpl-agk Woes
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Atpl-agk Woes
This post is not designed to start a slugging match with the powers to be however I think alot of people may be able to relate to the problem that I am having.
I have now failed ATPL AGK 3 times, today missing out by 1 mark. I have used numerous study material and franky worked my butt off to pass it. With many phone calls to my theory provider and discussions with others who have sat the exam it appears that questions are becoming either to ambiguous, incomplete or too type specific ie B767.
Without marking myself I feel I have good knowledge of the subject and could hold up well with any tech questions that may be thrown in an interview.
It would probably make me and others, feel a bit better if others with the same concerns about the questioning could relate their own horror exam stories. Also if anyone has successfully challenged a question...and won let me know the process.
For everyone out there who are still battling their way through, keep up the hards yards, hopefully good thing will be just around the corner.
I have now failed ATPL AGK 3 times, today missing out by 1 mark. I have used numerous study material and franky worked my butt off to pass it. With many phone calls to my theory provider and discussions with others who have sat the exam it appears that questions are becoming either to ambiguous, incomplete or too type specific ie B767.
Without marking myself I feel I have good knowledge of the subject and could hold up well with any tech questions that may be thrown in an interview.
It would probably make me and others, feel a bit better if others with the same concerns about the questioning could relate their own horror exam stories. Also if anyone has successfully challenged a question...and won let me know the process.
For everyone out there who are still battling their way through, keep up the hards yards, hopefully good thing will be just around the corner.
Before any one of you who know me ask....
No, he is not me..... 
Relax Heals, we share something in common, but it's not the exam. 
I wish yer well mate, I can't imagine you'd be alone in that boat.
Regards,
OpsN.
Relax Heals, we share something in common, but it's not the exam. I wish yer well mate, I can't imagine you'd be alone in that boat.
Regards,
OpsN.
Join Date: Oct 2002
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Healy don't lose faith mate, it is not an easy subject cos they draw from such a large number of subjects in the exam.
I agree that there are a number of ambiguous and poorly written questions. Having said that CASA do get a number of complaints about this exam, and yes they do listen and have recently rewritten a number of the questions to remove some of the ambiguity.
Best of luck
PT
I agree that there are a number of ambiguous and poorly written questions. Having said that CASA do get a number of complaints about this exam, and yes they do listen and have recently rewritten a number of the questions to remove some of the ambiguity.
Best of luck
PT
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Yeah I agree entirely!! And no you aren't the only one who had trouble with that exam!! The most common answer I received when asking for help with some of that stuff was 'What the hell do you want to know that for??!!' which suffice to say added to my frustration at the time.
Some of the questions I encountered had at least 2 or more correct answers depending of which aeroplance you wanted to use as an example.
Some of the questions I encountered had at least 2 or more correct answers depending of which aeroplance you wanted to use as an example.
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1st go, worked my ar*e off (with a lot of help from sir len), and failed by one... 
2nd go, worked my ar*e off, and failed by two...
3RD go, worked my ar*e off, and failed by three...
4th go, f*** this!, looked over my notes the night before, passed by 5!.. ..... no more exams!!!... called for lots of bundy!
Hang in there mate.
cheers
giddy
2nd go, worked my ar*e off, and failed by two...
3RD go, worked my ar*e off, and failed by three...
4th go, f*** this!, looked over my notes the night before, passed by 5!..
..... no more exams!!!... called for lots of bundy! Hang in there mate.
cheers
giddy
!
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Healy,
Piston Twin is quite correct, CASA actually can, and do listen. At least in my case, anyway.
A couple of years ago I missed out on an exam by 1.
Looking through the topic areas that they give you on the areas I got incorrect, I thought that I had a case to answer for. I rang up and got them to remark the exam, which doesn't really do anything. All that is, is to make sure that the computer didn't miss any of the answers that you put on the sheet.
I then asked the person in the exam department if I could speak to the person who actually wrote the question that I was disputing. To my surprise they put the bloke on, and he said the answer that I thought was correct, and then he hung up.
A couple of weeks later, I got a letter changing my fail to a pass.
I think that you just have to be careful exactly what questions you ask them when you ring up (due to privacy laws and whatever other laws CASA think up of at the time)
Probably require a certain amount of luck as well!
Anyhow, good luck with it all.
K.I.S.S.
Piston Twin is quite correct, CASA actually can, and do listen. At least in my case, anyway.
A couple of years ago I missed out on an exam by 1.
Looking through the topic areas that they give you on the areas I got incorrect, I thought that I had a case to answer for. I rang up and got them to remark the exam, which doesn't really do anything. All that is, is to make sure that the computer didn't miss any of the answers that you put on the sheet.
I then asked the person in the exam department if I could speak to the person who actually wrote the question that I was disputing. To my surprise they put the bloke on, and he said the answer that I thought was correct, and then he hung up.
A couple of weeks later, I got a letter changing my fail to a pass.
I think that you just have to be careful exactly what questions you ask them when you ring up (due to privacy laws and whatever other laws CASA think up of at the time)
Probably require a certain amount of luck as well!
Anyhow, good luck with it all.
K.I.S.S.
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ATPL AGK/AERO
Just a short note for guys attempting this subject from QF's perspective. We do understand that CASA's question bank is somewhat large, creating an extensive cross section of possible questions and therefore making it quite difficult to pass the exam.
My main point: please don't be too discouraged if you do fail (even three or four times) - plenty of pilots have made it into QF with numerous fails not only in this subject, but also Flight Planning. We do understand that the practicality behind some topics is not a major concern in everyday jet airline operations.
Another point of interest is that the new cyber exam system does make mistakes in it's marking procedure. Although this does not occur regularly, there have been cases where the system has incorrectly marked exams for the worse (pass converted to a fail), so pay close attention to the KDR and the answers you selected. CASA does listen to post exam comments and will change a mark if you make a valid argument.
My main point: please don't be too discouraged if you do fail (even three or four times) - plenty of pilots have made it into QF with numerous fails not only in this subject, but also Flight Planning. We do understand that the practicality behind some topics is not a major concern in everyday jet airline operations.
Another point of interest is that the new cyber exam system does make mistakes in it's marking procedure. Although this does not occur regularly, there have been cases where the system has incorrectly marked exams for the worse (pass converted to a fail), so pay close attention to the KDR and the answers you selected. CASA does listen to post exam comments and will change a mark if you make a valid argument.
QF.man - Perhaps you may know. If you apply to QF and receive a letter stating your application is not 'competitive' but update in 6 months what does this mean in reality? I had to have several cracks at FPL to get it and wonder if this is a factor? Or is it more to do with hours etc. Any insight you can provide would be helpful.
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cyberexams
I don't understand that with what we pay for each exam the system can still make mistakes and we have to ask CASA to check the exam for us to get a pass that we deserved in the first place. Seems unfair to me.
I hope the pass comes with an apology letter. It would be interesting to know what qualifications the people have who write these questions. In such exams, they should be professionally trained as not to provide answers that can be ambiguous. Or are they just pen pushers?
I hope the pass comes with an apology letter. It would be interesting to know what qualifications the people have who write these questions. In such exams, they should be professionally trained as not to provide answers that can be ambiguous. Or are they just pen pushers?
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I have had the same problem with AGK,
Failed by 1, then by 2, then work as hard as ever and failed by 4!
Not looking good with the 3 year period closing in fast!
I sat and failed AGK(3rd time) and was not allowed to sit any exam for 2 months(fair enough), 2 months later I sat air law and missed out by 2, so now I cant sit ANY exam for another 2 months! with only AGK and air law to go, so its going to be 4 months since I sat AGK
Before computer exams you could sit any or all exams over a 3 day period regardless of passing or failing subjects every 3 months this could happen , why did this have to change?.
One day someone's going to lose it and go up to Canberra, just hope its not me!
Failed by 1, then by 2, then work as hard as ever and failed by 4!
Not looking good with the 3 year period closing in fast!
I sat and failed AGK(3rd time) and was not allowed to sit any exam for 2 months(fair enough), 2 months later I sat air law and missed out by 2, so now I cant sit ANY exam for another 2 months! with only AGK and air law to go, so its going to be 4 months since I sat AGK
Before computer exams you could sit any or all exams over a 3 day period regardless of passing or failing subjects every 3 months this could happen , why did this have to change?.
One day someone's going to lose it and go up to Canberra, just hope its not me!
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[Donning fire suit]
One thing that really gets me is the number of complaints that trainee pilots make about the CASA exam process.
I am one of these really weird people that did a course, studied my R's off, and passed all the exams on the first go, with scores ranging from 85% to 96%.
I am not trying to tell you how good I am, but I am one of the guys who you never hear about.
It seems really cheap that frequently the candidate who passes or fails by a minute amount gets into a wild frenzy about how unfair it all is.
I think it cheapens the achievements of those people who studied hard and effectively and as a result KNEW THEIR STUFF! and got through with no problems.
Particularly when there were course colleagues that went into AGK exam and were out of there within 60minutes, with over two hours remaining to check and recheck their answers, and then started bitching when they missed out!!!
Passing any check or exam in aviation by the bare minimum should be an indicator to a conscientious pilot that there is still more work to be done, son!
Tell me, if the Aussie one-day team missed out on beating the Poms by one run, what would the rest of the world think if the ACB bitched about the conditions and umpiring on the day and argued for a rematch.
One thing that really gets me is the number of complaints that trainee pilots make about the CASA exam process.
I am one of these really weird people that did a course, studied my R's off, and passed all the exams on the first go, with scores ranging from 85% to 96%.
I am not trying to tell you how good I am, but I am one of the guys who you never hear about.
It seems really cheap that frequently the candidate who passes or fails by a minute amount gets into a wild frenzy about how unfair it all is.
I think it cheapens the achievements of those people who studied hard and effectively and as a result KNEW THEIR STUFF! and got through with no problems.
Particularly when there were course colleagues that went into AGK exam and were out of there within 60minutes, with over two hours remaining to check and recheck their answers, and then started bitching when they missed out!!!
Passing any check or exam in aviation by the bare minimum should be an indicator to a conscientious pilot that there is still more work to be done, son!
Tell me, if the Aussie one-day team missed out on beating the Poms by one run, what would the rest of the world think if the ACB bitched about the conditions and umpiring on the day and argued for a rematch.
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Not a truer word spoken ITCZ. Someone either knows there stuff or they don't . Well sone on passing first go. I have seen some pilots not study enough for exams and know they are going to fail but do the exam anyway in a hope of getting and easier exam. Crazy if you ask me.
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Those who know me will know I’m not one to apologise for CASA. However.
Life IS ambiguous, Flying IS ambiguous. I have NEVER had an Exam or Flight test that stressed me as much as some real situations. It might not be in the syllabus, but it matters how you manage yourself. If one of my test candidates gets nervous, and we all do, I ask them “what is the worst that can happen to you today?” Answer “I fail”. “What is the worst that can happen to you tomorrow when you have mum and the kids on board?” Answer “we die” Therefore the worst outcome today is not really that bad. Another Question. “If you get 71% in the exam what happens?” “I pass”. If you get 99% on a flight?” Answer “we might die”. Which would you prefer? In an exam the office is not moving at a great rate of knots, the weather is fine, the passengers are quite, ATC is not pestering you about your position, you have a lot of time. If you can’t cope with ambiguity and manage yourself in that situation what hope have you got in the aircraft with all the reverse happening? You can fail an exam as many times as you like. How many times can you fail a flight? Once. As recent events show. Even the best and most experienced pilots can get caught out. I take it as a warning to pull my socks up.
Life IS ambiguous, Flying IS ambiguous. I have NEVER had an Exam or Flight test that stressed me as much as some real situations. It might not be in the syllabus, but it matters how you manage yourself. If one of my test candidates gets nervous, and we all do, I ask them “what is the worst that can happen to you today?” Answer “I fail”. “What is the worst that can happen to you tomorrow when you have mum and the kids on board?” Answer “we die” Therefore the worst outcome today is not really that bad. Another Question. “If you get 71% in the exam what happens?” “I pass”. If you get 99% on a flight?” Answer “we might die”. Which would you prefer? In an exam the office is not moving at a great rate of knots, the weather is fine, the passengers are quite, ATC is not pestering you about your position, you have a lot of time. If you can’t cope with ambiguity and manage yourself in that situation what hope have you got in the aircraft with all the reverse happening? You can fail an exam as many times as you like. How many times can you fail a flight? Once. As recent events show. Even the best and most experienced pilots can get caught out. I take it as a warning to pull my socks up.
