Trislanders
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Trislanders
It would appear as though I am about to get the opportunity to fly a trislander. I currently fly an Islander (amongst others) and was wondering what the big differences were between the two by way of handling and aircraft systems.
Is it a fun aircraft to fly???
Cheers in advance.
Is it a fun aircraft to fly???
Cheers in advance.
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BN3
If it's the long nose version, then correct balast is vital. Been a while since I flew a BN3, but I think they all have extended tip tanks. The transfer pumps were known to fail, so know the transfer rate! I recall too that the brakes were the same as the BN2, but you're carrying around a lot more weight. Accidently landing with a minor tailwind will burn out the pads fast. Been there, smelt that! We once had a drama with the X-feed system. With all 3 engines (260's) running, fuel was somehow being transfered into the other main tanks. Correspondence between self and the manufactuer never resolved that problem. It didn't occur on the BN2's I once flew. Overall, I'd have to say that correct ballast assuming the version described above, is critical. Never let the baggage folk pull bags from the forward locker before emptying the rear first. Makes for a good photo if this occurs, particularly if the tail-stand isn't in place! 
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Thanks. It is a short nose model.
Is it possible to run the engines on the wing from the main tanks and the centre engine from the tips?
On an empty positioning flight might you consider shutting down the centre engine to conserve gas or would this make the prospect of an engine failure a bit too hairy?
This may seem like a stupid question but how hard is it to check the oil on the centre engine? just a big ladder required?
Is it possible to run the engines on the wing from the main tanks and the centre engine from the tips?
On an empty positioning flight might you consider shutting down the centre engine to conserve gas or would this make the prospect of an engine failure a bit too hairy?
This may seem like a stupid question but how hard is it to check the oil on the centre engine? just a big ladder required?
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BN3
From memory, the transfer pumps pumped fuel directly into the appropriate main, so I'd have to say "no", you can't transfer directly into the centre engine. This was why it was important to know the transfer rate, particularly since the gauges (typical) were not reliable.
As for assy centre engine ops: The BN3 is no Orion! With the centre engine inop, expect high CHT's, redline temps & pressures on the other two. I experienced this once before, and with only 1 pax aboard, OAT ISA+15 we managed only 3000'.
As for checking the #2 oil level, no real drama. Standard climb onto the wing, then a walk down towards the tail. An empty aircraft shouldn't create any problems here.
There should be some fellows out there who flew the BN3 from PNG Douglas times. Maybe they could offer some comments too?
As for being an enjoyable aircraft to fly, that's a hard one to comment on!
As for assy centre engine ops: The BN3 is no Orion! With the centre engine inop, expect high CHT's, redline temps & pressures on the other two. I experienced this once before, and with only 1 pax aboard, OAT ISA+15 we managed only 3000'.
As for checking the #2 oil level, no real drama. Standard climb onto the wing, then a walk down towards the tail. An empty aircraft shouldn't create any problems here.
There should be some fellows out there who flew the BN3 from PNG Douglas times. Maybe they could offer some comments too?
As for being an enjoyable aircraft to fly, that's a hard one to comment on!
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Just re read last comment. Can't be assy with a centre engine inop.
Weight & Balance: Several yrs ago, a CP I know spent the time to calculate all combinations of W&B. The booklet was a gem. You'll need to consider balance ahead of weight with a BN3 although the short nose variant may be more forgiving...
Weight & Balance: Several yrs ago, a CP I know spent the time to calculate all combinations of W&B. The booklet was a gem. You'll need to consider balance ahead of weight with a BN3 although the short nose variant may be more forgiving...
Man Bilong Balus long PNG
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GAMAN; Send an e-mail to Bpu re this subject. He was the Deputy Chief Pilot of Douglas Airways in PNG when I was with them. I only logged three hours ICUS in the BN3 with him and that was over 11 years ago.
Hope this helps.
Hope this helps.
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The fuel system is quite similar to the BN2. The tips can only be transferred into the mains. The wing engines can feed from either main, the rear engine can be selected to feed from either main or "both". I only had 1 fuel Tx pump go U/s, but from memory they are supposed to be inspected/cleaned every 100 hours, so try to ensure this is done.
BN3 is probably even slower in roll than the BN2 and a bit heavier in pitch. It is a bit faster 135-140 TAS, I found 100kg of GW made around 1 knot difference of TAS. It will get up and boogie at light GW and a cold day. Main trick I found was the pilot's eye height on landing, you are still really high when the mains touch down. Also on landing, I found (when heavy) reducing power on the outboard engines but leaving a smidgeon on the centre produced nice smooth landings. Seemed a bit easier to land than the BN2 once the height thing is mastered.
Ground handling pretty easy with the nose wheel able to unlock and castor- but watch the wing tips. They stick out even further than on the BN2 and you can't see them.
Very cold aircraft to fly in winter, you will probably find it doesn't have a heater. rear engine seems to be more susceptible to plug fouling. Also stuggles to climb when full on a hot day, but runway performance is still pretty good.
Just my rambling thoughts. Feel free to email for more info.
BN3 is probably even slower in roll than the BN2 and a bit heavier in pitch. It is a bit faster 135-140 TAS, I found 100kg of GW made around 1 knot difference of TAS. It will get up and boogie at light GW and a cold day. Main trick I found was the pilot's eye height on landing, you are still really high when the mains touch down. Also on landing, I found (when heavy) reducing power on the outboard engines but leaving a smidgeon on the centre produced nice smooth landings. Seemed a bit easier to land than the BN2 once the height thing is mastered.
Ground handling pretty easy with the nose wheel able to unlock and castor- but watch the wing tips. They stick out even further than on the BN2 and you can't see them.
Very cold aircraft to fly in winter, you will probably find it doesn't have a heater. rear engine seems to be more susceptible to plug fouling. Also stuggles to climb when full on a hot day, but runway performance is still pretty good.
Just my rambling thoughts. Feel free to email for more info.
The Islander and Trislander used to be a common type endorsement. About as similar as a Bell Huey and a Caribou (both green!)
From memory, the correct model for the two (?) in Australia is BN2A-MkIII, not BN3 and both have short noses. They are both ex Bush Pilots Airways, Douglas Airways and Cape York Air. I'm surprised they aren't out of wing cycles?
GAMAN, do you really want to go there?
From memory, the correct model for the two (?) in Australia is BN2A-MkIII, not BN3 and both have short noses. They are both ex Bush Pilots Airways, Douglas Airways and Cape York Air. I'm surprised they aren't out of wing cycles?
GAMAN, do you really want to go there?
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TORRES They say curiosity killed the cat but I am very keen to try my hand at the three engined beast.
Thanks everyone for replying. Something I haven't been able to find out is an approximate empty weight for the short nose Trislander. I know they can vary by the specs but an example would help me with the sums I am doing to find out how much you can stuff into the things.
Cheers.
Thanks everyone for replying. Something I haven't been able to find out is an approximate empty weight for the short nose Trislander. I know they can vary by the specs but an example would help me with the sums I am doing to find out how much you can stuff into the things.
Cheers.
GAMAN. Can't remember the weights but I'm sure those two in Australia will legally carry up to approx 1,400 kg payload.
God be with the pilot that does, especially if one of the donks quits!
Life gets interesting if the pilots exit the aircraft before the tail end passengers..... And expensive!
Some years ago noted aviation journalist, renown aviation publication editor, devoted patron of the Cairns Aero Club, aviator extrordinaire and legend in his own lunch time, Paul Phelan, managed to "acquire" secret technical details on the Bongo and Tri Bongo, I think from some railway foundry in the UK. The paper discussed very interesting and detailed technical theories on how Bongos converts high frequency vibrations to levitation and convert noise to thrust.
Anyone still got a copy of the document? I think it may be of assistance to Gaman.
It is rumoured there is another twelve brand new Trislanders somewhere in Australia. Some guy wanted to install V8 engines.
And the world's only long nose Islander is (or was) in Australia. It had been the original test bed for the Turbine Islander. Don't remember the registration.
GAMAN, contact nasa. He loves them!
God be with the pilot that does, especially if one of the donks quits!
Life gets interesting if the pilots exit the aircraft before the tail end passengers..... And expensive!
Some years ago noted aviation journalist, renown aviation publication editor, devoted patron of the Cairns Aero Club, aviator extrordinaire and legend in his own lunch time, Paul Phelan, managed to "acquire" secret technical details on the Bongo and Tri Bongo, I think from some railway foundry in the UK. The paper discussed very interesting and detailed technical theories on how Bongos converts high frequency vibrations to levitation and convert noise to thrust.
Anyone still got a copy of the document? I think it may be of assistance to Gaman.
It is rumoured there is another twelve brand new Trislanders somewhere in Australia. Some guy wanted to install V8 engines.
And the world's only long nose Islander is (or was) in Australia. It had been the original test bed for the Turbine Islander. Don't remember the registration.
GAMAN, contact nasa. He loves them!
Last edited by Torres; 13th Nov 2002 at 01:55.
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Yeah torres I have the very article. Bloody funny at that. I am sure it is equally aplicable to the trislander as the islander.
Another thought, I know it is all relative but is it any quieter up the front of a trislander than an islander. At the moment I have to use ear plugs and my trusty D.C.'s to keep my brain from rattling around up there.
Another thought, I know it is all relative but is it any quieter up the front of a trislander than an islander. At the moment I have to use ear plugs and my trusty D.C.'s to keep my brain from rattling around up there.
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The Tri flys hows it looks, not the most responsive but a stable platform for instrument flying. Have about five hundred hours in the long nose (BN2 Mk 3 series2). Will need ballast for single pilot ops with no payload. An awful aeroplane in a strong crosswind, need to use assymetric power until you have enough rudder authority on the take off roll. Only flew an Islander a couple of times but it appears to be a much better performer. Saying that quite often carried 17 pax and bags on short hops in the Tri, but forget it on a hot and high day. Watch the tips very easy to misjudge your distances taxing.
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Not So
Torres.....You have obviously mistaken me for someone else.....Never had the pleasure (yeah rite) of a Trislander, although did spend considerable time trying to talk a chap in WA from buying one, but to no avail 
Wasn't the attempt to do the V8 thingy being done in Port Macquarie?????
Wasn't the attempt to do the V8 thingy being done in Port Macquarie?????
nasa. Obviously you didn't talk hard enough - he still bought the Trislander from me! Must be a record - sold two Trislanders in one year!
I heard the new Trislanders were stored at Port Macquarie. Talk was an aluminium V8 - can't remember whether two or three engines. Thank goodness it didn't happen - quite enough Trislanders in the world already. In fact, I think there was around 140 built, and that's 150 too many!
You didn't make Longreach, nasa?
I heard the new Trislanders were stored at Port Macquarie. Talk was an aluminium V8 - can't remember whether two or three engines. Thank goodness it didn't happen - quite enough Trislanders in the world already. In fact, I think there was around 140 built, and that's 150 too many!
You didn't make Longreach, nasa?
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Oh Ye Of Few Scruples
Torres.....I recall now. How do you sleep at night
Had thought about Longreach, but the prospect of consuming alcohol was most concerning, plus I had a plethora of kids throughout the weekend (only 4 of them mine) so was constrained to crowd control.
Mr Insurance (Tait) was trying to contact you prior to the weekend. Did he get you??
I notice you appear to have acquired a somewhat larger physique since we last met
Had thought about Longreach, but the prospect of consuming alcohol was most concerning, plus I had a plethora of kids throughout the weekend (only 4 of them mine) so was constrained to crowd control.
Mr Insurance (Tait) was trying to contact you prior to the weekend. Did he get you??
I notice you appear to have acquired a somewhat larger physique since we last met
Not only did I sell two Trislanders, nasa, but also sold two Aztecs, all in the same 12 month period! I would think that's a record that even your most scurrilous purveying of used aircraft can't match!
No doubt its one of those two beauties GAMAN intends to attempt to defy gravity in! Of, dear......... Those daring young men in their flying machines!
A quick check of the Aussie Register shows only VH-BSP and VH-MRJ in Australia. GAMAN - post the Trislander rego here - you may hear some interesting anectodates! And check http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/~ito-nori/trisla10.html for Trislander specs, but don't take the 157 kts cruise too seriously!
As Scud used to say of the Trislander "What a beautiful thing!" (Anyone know where Scud is these days?)
Mr Insurance has been in touch.
Yes, I guess the physique is a result of leaving the aviation industry after 30 years. I can now afford three meals per day!
Another "Beautiful Thing":
The box new Trislanders came in!!
(A 1960's futuristic art creation by Short Bros, Belfast, railway foundry and ship builders! Who said a brick won't fly!)
I would think that's a record that even your most scurrilous purveying of used aircraft can't match!No doubt its one of those two beauties GAMAN intends to attempt to defy gravity in! Of, dear......... Those daring young men in their flying machines!
A quick check of the Aussie Register shows only VH-BSP and VH-MRJ in Australia. GAMAN - post the Trislander rego here - you may hear some interesting anectodates! And check http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/~ito-nori/trisla10.html for Trislander specs, but don't take the 157 kts cruise too seriously!
As Scud used to say of the Trislander "What a beautiful thing!" (Anyone know where Scud is these days?)
Mr Insurance has been in touch.
Yes, I guess the physique is a result of leaving the aviation industry after 30 years. I can now afford three meals per day!
Another "Beautiful Thing":
The box new Trislanders came in!!
(A 1960's futuristic art creation by Short Bros, Belfast, railway foundry and ship builders! Who said a brick won't fly!)
Last edited by Torres; 22nd Nov 2002 at 21:29.
Torres............ it was remiss of you not to remind your diligent readers of the importance of accurate weight and balance calculations in the Tristar......surely you recall the demise of the Provincial Air Services machine at Annenberg? It is now keeping company with a 402 at the bottom of the Ramu river.
I was on the same team as you Torres, and despite being the world's largest operator of Islanders, RDB knew a lemon when he saw one and was never tempted by the BN3.
I do recall PAS and Douglas pilots telling me that the Tristar carried less than an Islander in the highlands. I think there are one or two BN3's in Fiji and Kiribati these days.....good place for them.
And I almost forgot....regarding the "box the Trislander came in"....you no doubt recall the SC-7 of Bougair............they sent a beancounter to the US to buy a DHC-6 and he made two crucial errors. Firstly, he came back, and secondly he had bought a "sort of" Twin Otter!
And I almost forgot....regarding the "box the Trislander came in"....you no doubt recall the SC-7 of Bougair............they sent a beancounter to the US to buy a DHC-6 and he made two crucial errors. Firstly, he came back, and secondly he had bought a "sort of" Twin Otter!
I was on the same team as you Torres, and despite being the world's largest operator of Islanders, RDB knew a lemon when he saw one and was never tempted by the BN3.
I do recall PAS and Douglas pilots telling me that the Tristar carried less than an Islander in the highlands. I think there are one or two BN3's in Fiji and Kiribati these days.....good place for them.
And I almost forgot....regarding the "box the Trislander came in"....you no doubt recall the SC-7 of Bougair............they sent a beancounter to the US to buy a DHC-6 and he made two crucial errors. Firstly, he came back, and secondly he had bought a "sort of" Twin Otter!
And I almost forgot....regarding the "box the Trislander came in"....you no doubt recall the SC-7 of Bougair............they sent a beancounter to the US to buy a DHC-6 and he made two crucial errors. Firstly, he came back, and secondly he had bought a "sort of" Twin Otter!
G'Day Chuck. Wet the bed this morning?
I didn't think Provincial ever operated Tristars? Thought they only had three Gomads in the rego series VH/P2-IA_? I'm sure only Bikkies had Trislanders in PNG?
The C402 amphibian was P2-SAB - which should have been P2-SUB! You may recall Capt Mike didn't even get wet!
Well I remember the flying brick at Bougair. Your story is almost correct - they sent a "Consultant" overseas to buy a Twotter but forgot to give him a picture. True story - I remember the guy well. I don't think the Bougair Skyvan ever had two engines and two U/C legs installed all at the same time. I recall seeing it being painted with house paint and a brush. Waste of good house paint!
Sorry to hijack your thread GAMAN.
I didn't think Provincial ever operated Tristars? Thought they only had three Gomads in the rego series VH/P2-IA_? I'm sure only Bikkies had Trislanders in PNG?
The C402 amphibian was P2-SAB - which should have been P2-SUB! You may recall Capt Mike didn't even get wet!
Well I remember the flying brick at Bougair. Your story is almost correct - they sent a "Consultant" overseas to buy a Twotter but forgot to give him a picture. True story - I remember the guy well. I don't think the Bougair Skyvan ever had two engines and two U/C legs installed all at the same time. I recall seeing it being painted with house paint and a brush. Waste of good house paint!
Sorry to hijack your thread GAMAN.
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Yeah BSP is one of them and the other I think is de-registered.
We are only operating from sea level and 25c or less so I am hoping the performance will be okay with the last row of seats out for bags.
It will take some convincing for me to believe that the Shorts in that picture actually flies, ie seeing it for myself.
We are only operating from sea level and 25c or less so I am hoping the performance will be okay with the last row of seats out for bags.
It will take some convincing for me to believe that the Shorts in that picture actually flies, ie seeing it for myself.