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King Air down at Essendon?

Old 10th Sep 2018, 14:19
  #881 (permalink)  
 
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I'm hearing rumours suggesting that diligently checking the trims before takeoff would be a very good idea.
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Old 10th Sep 2018, 14:20
  #882 (permalink)  
 
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I have heard that the rudder trim was found set hard left, FWIW.
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Old 10th Sep 2018, 15:04
  #883 (permalink)  
 
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I’ve heard the Giant Flying Spaghetti Monster’s Noodly Appendage was responsible for causing a loss of power in one engine. (Which kinda shows why a timely report by an expert investigatory body can be useful.)
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Old 10th Sep 2018, 15:19
  #884 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by bolthead View Post
I'm hearing rumours suggesting that diligently checking the trims before takeoff would be a very good idea.
You mean like how it say's in the Before Takeoff Checklist?

It would explain why the aircraft ended up taking out runway lights before even making it airborne. Doesn't explain why there wasn't an abort.
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Old 11th Sep 2018, 01:25
  #885 (permalink)  
 
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Some pilots are want to wind in a lot of rudder trim in the event of an asymmetric event..so what if the trim was fully applied?
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Old 11th Sep 2018, 01:28
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Originally Posted by mattyj View Post
Some pilots are want to wind in a lot of rudder trim in the event of an asymmetric event..so what if the trim was fully applied?
" That examination found that the cores of both engines were rotating and that there was no evidence of pre-impact failure of either engine’s internal components."
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Old 11th Sep 2018, 02:07
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" That examination found that the cores of both engines were rotating and that there was no evidence of pre-impact failure of either engine’s internal components."
Junior. Rotating and producing power are 2 different things.
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Old 11th Sep 2018, 03:31
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It be easy to see if if the wife’s were making pwr just by the b to c flange position. From what I have heard they were making pwr.
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Old 13th Sep 2018, 05:23
  #889 (permalink)  
 
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I have heard that the rudder trim was found set hard left, FWIW.
There was a 310 out of Tamworth in 2005 that got airborne and rolled over on its back with an obvious outcome. It took the ATSB a while to work that out but eventually they come to the conclusion that it had come out of the hangar with the rudder trim set full left. The pilot was to ferry it to Scone and was in a rush so missed the trim part of the checklist. If the trim on the Kingair was full left then it would go a long way to explain the flight path. If the pilot thought he had suffered an engine failure but the engines were producing power then there is too little time available to do any trouble shooting.
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Old 13th Sep 2018, 05:44
  #890 (permalink)  
 
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It took the ATSB a while to work that out.
Date of accident: 7 March 2005.

Date of Report: 21 June 2007.

Over 2 years seems about par for the ATSB course.
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Old 13th Sep 2018, 09:15
  #891 (permalink)  
 
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The problem for an investigation, if it is an incorrect trim setting, is that often the evidence can be destroyed in the crash.
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Old 14th Sep 2018, 06:18
  #892 (permalink)  
 
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Lookleft, the Tamworth accident has stayed with me. I knew the pilot and was one of the witnesses interviewed by the ATSB in that report.

While it is a great report I have always had lingering doubts about the findings which have not always sat well with me. There is an element to accidents where we may not always conclusively know everything after the event.

For example: "During the on-site examination of the wreckage, investigators located a number of tools including a damaged hand tool (Figure 6) that would not normally be expected to be carried on the aircraft."

...and: "The location of the bent hand tool in the wreckage raised the possibility that it may have contributed to the flight control difficulty. Despite the tool being found in the wreckage, it was not possible to establish whether it was in an internal section of the aircraft that contained part of a primary flight control system or when it had been introduced.
The bending damage to the tool was found to be consistent with severe impact and breakup forces and there was no evidence that the tool had interfered pre-impact with a control system. Such evidence, however, may not have been detectable post-accident."

The report investigates a number of possible probable causes, control interference, trim runaway, autopilot problem, and trim settings. In this case they concluded the report with what they believed to be a 'most probable' cause although other factors certainly cannot be ruled out:

"The limited evidence did not allow the investigation to be certain about the existence of abnormal rudder and/or aileron trim settings during the flight. However, in the absence of any other likely factor and with supporting evidence, the investigation considered that the pilot probably took off with abnormal rudder and/or aileron trim settings and with increasing airspeed, was unable to maintain control."

Flying over the smoking hole in the ground, attending the funeral of a talented young man with his devastated young bride dressed in black, grieving with the family over a life cut all too short (he wasn't even supposed to have been flying that day) stays in ones memory... RIP Jason C.

Be ever vigilant out there folks...
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Old 14th Sep 2018, 06:32
  #893 (permalink)  
 
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I know what you felt and continue to feel about losing a colleague and friend CN. My first attendance at a pilot's funeral was at age 24 and that is a long time ago. There were quite a few after that. Never gets easy. No report is easy to read when it involves someone you know.
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Old 14th Sep 2018, 13:47
  #894 (permalink)  
 
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... I have always had lingering doubts about the findings which have not always sat well with me.
We have probably met, Nomad. I too knew the young bloke and there are still whispers around Tamworth about the 'real' cause.
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Old 22nd Sep 2018, 07:00
  #895 (permalink)  
 
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ATSB website lists the report release date as 24 Sep 2018 (this coming Monday)?
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Old 22nd Sep 2018, 07:51
  #896 (permalink)  
 
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I have also heard the rumours that the rudder trim was found fully hard over to the left. It may have been but who knows if it was that way prior to impact. I very much doubt the rudder trim theory. From my experience I would suspect that the aircraft is almost impossible to keep straight and would very quickly veer off the runway resulting in an abort. I have experienced the friction nut scenario in the aircraft during an early morning take off and it definitely gets your attention. I have run the Essendon loose friction nut scenario in the Sim and ended up very close to the same spot as old mate.

Groggy
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Old 24th Sep 2018, 01:09
  #897 (permalink)  
 
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ATSB is handing down its report...not good for pic. Rudder trim and takeoff weight.

Last edited by OZBUSDRIVER; 24th Sep 2018 at 01:22.
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Old 24th Sep 2018, 01:58
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Exceeded MTOW??

With 5 POB on a day trip (so I would suspect limited luggage)....it begs the question - what the hell else was on board??
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Old 24th Sep 2018, 02:10
  #899 (permalink)  
 
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I owe ATSB an apology. They brought this one in before the two year mark.
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Old 24th Sep 2018, 02:19
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Originally Posted by OZBUSDRIVER View Post
ATSB is handing down its report...not good for pic. Rudder trim and takeoff weight.
Oh dear. No doubt the regulator will emerge spotless and the people blamed will all be unable to answer for themselves.
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