Cessna missing off Byron
What can a concerned individual do if he or she wants badly to be
involved in services to those who are in need of help?
Join Lifeline? Or Beyond Blue? Letterbox drop brochures and fridge magnets?
involved in services to those who are in need of help?
Join Lifeline? Or Beyond Blue? Letterbox drop brochures and fridge magnets?
PPRuNe Handmaiden
Fantome as in to be a counsellor? Have a look if your company has a procedure whereby someone can seek guidance/advice if they're feeling low. If not, find out how one can be implemented.
There's Stiftung Mayday which I am a part of through NetJets Europe. Whilst it isn't specifically for someone going through divorce as such, it is a very good resource and may be of some use. There are other set ups similar.
Other than that, there's the organisations you've mentioned. A few colleagues and friends have volunteered for the Samaritans (crisis support organisation in the UK)
The main thing is to care. Keep in touch with folks who might be feeling low, make appointments to see them or call. In other words, throw out a lifeline and let them know someone is around who won't judge, won't take sides and won't tell them to snap out of it.
Good luck.
There's Stiftung Mayday which I am a part of through NetJets Europe. Whilst it isn't specifically for someone going through divorce as such, it is a very good resource and may be of some use. There are other set ups similar.
Other than that, there's the organisations you've mentioned. A few colleagues and friends have volunteered for the Samaritans (crisis support organisation in the UK)
The main thing is to care. Keep in touch with folks who might be feeling low, make appointments to see them or call. In other words, throw out a lifeline and let them know someone is around who won't judge, won't take sides and won't tell them to snap out of it.
Good luck.
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Ken Borough, in post 68, makes a lot of sense. It is so true that a commercial pilot very seldom has a support group of his peers. Isolation is the name of the profession.
If more professional pilots were members of a local club, whether a fishing, golf, or even a gliding club, you've got friends! If this poor guy was dumped by his woman, where could he go? In my gliding club numbering about 80, probably 50 are single divorced men. We do support each other, I know that for a fact.
If more professional pilots were members of a local club, whether a fishing, golf, or even a gliding club, you've got friends! If this poor guy was dumped by his woman, where could he go? In my gliding club numbering about 80, probably 50 are single divorced men. We do support each other, I know that for a fact.
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I can't understand why some are questioning why this is been treated as a tragic suicide.
"Police say he sent one final text message to his family as he plunged his Cessna 172 into a death-spiral into the waters off northern NSW." I don't expect that message said, "this aircraft is fubar, send help."
"Mr Whyte’s Cessna 172 left Lismore at 4.20pm and AirServices Australia lost contact with it at 4:50pm....
“What we’ve been told by experts is the plane was travelling at a very high speed when it impacted the water,” he said. Guess who told the police this, and how those people got that info.
You don't have to even read between the lines here. This story is about as blunt as I've ever seen regarding a suicide.
Awful situation. And please if you are not right, speak to someone, anyone about it. You aren't alone. Most guys understand the code, just say to someone "I'm struggling" they'll usually get the message. If you can't do that ring beyondblue, lifeline etc you don't have to give them your name.
Quotes from. No Cookies | Herald Sun
"Police say he sent one final text message to his family as he plunged his Cessna 172 into a death-spiral into the waters off northern NSW." I don't expect that message said, "this aircraft is fubar, send help."
"Mr Whyte’s Cessna 172 left Lismore at 4.20pm and AirServices Australia lost contact with it at 4:50pm....
“What we’ve been told by experts is the plane was travelling at a very high speed when it impacted the water,” he said. Guess who told the police this, and how those people got that info.
You don't have to even read between the lines here. This story is about as blunt as I've ever seen regarding a suicide.
Awful situation. And please if you are not right, speak to someone, anyone about it. You aren't alone. Most guys understand the code, just say to someone "I'm struggling" they'll usually get the message. If you can't do that ring beyondblue, lifeline etc you don't have to give them your name.
Quotes from. No Cookies | Herald Sun
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According to some statistics the highest suicide rate amongst the eighteen listed professional groups is physicians. Stated as 1.87 times more likely to commit suicide than the average. Pilots are not amongst the eighteen listed.
Perhaps this is the message in the title song to MASH "suicide is painless". Clinically the doc knows best, but what about the pain and suffering to those left behind.
Link to the stats at
Highest Suicide Rate by Profession | New Health Guide
Perhaps this is the message in the title song to MASH "suicide is painless". Clinically the doc knows best, but what about the pain and suffering to those left behind.
Link to the stats at
Highest Suicide Rate by Profession | New Health Guide
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As always angry conservatives on the internet show why mental health has a stigma in almost every society. First the talk about blaming gun control advocates to moving on to special flowers that don't like vaccinations then the biased media and the ridiculous talk gets worse and worse. Yet the people who reported on the police statements showing suicide as the likely cause are getting insulted for making political statements and not having evidence!
A group of wannabe alpha males have to play macho conservatives online and in the real world, and are shocked when the idea of mental health has a stigma comes up.
You people are part of the problem, you put on such a fake, arrogant and angry face and those suffering from illness who need help are scared back into their shells because they have no fellow people to talk about it with and know they will never be able to escape the "you are weak if you suffer depression" talk. RIP to the family that now has to grow up without a father.
A group of wannabe alpha males have to play macho conservatives online and in the real world, and are shocked when the idea of mental health has a stigma comes up.
You people are part of the problem, you put on such a fake, arrogant and angry face and those suffering from illness who need help are scared back into their shells because they have no fellow people to talk about it with and know they will never be able to escape the "you are weak if you suffer depression" talk. RIP to the family that now has to grow up without a father.
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Very brave, those of you who have told the rest on here of your depression struggle. You should be commended. To the others who understandably do not come out on pprune, all success in overcoming your illness for that is what it is. Not a stigma, an illness.
Thread Starter
No Cookies | Gold Coast Bulletin
Seems a bit odd to go to the trouble of finding the wreck and then not salvage it. Must have been able to clear up whatever was niggling, visually. I see they repeat that there are no suspicious circumstances.
Seems a bit odd to go to the trouble of finding the wreck and then not salvage it. Must have been able to clear up whatever was niggling, visually. I see they repeat that there are no suspicious circumstances.
Sorry to dig up an old'ish' thread but came across the below story again through random rummaging on the internet.
https://au.news.yahoo.com/a/31182796...o-ocean/#page1
It seems the aircraft that was intentionally crashed was just a Cessna that the guy hired for the day.
Does anyone know what the insurance implications of such an incident would be?
Under these circumstances, am I correct to assume that the insurance company would sue the estate of the deceased to recover the cost of the aircraft as it was a deliberate act?
https://au.news.yahoo.com/a/31182796...o-ocean/#page1
It seems the aircraft that was intentionally crashed was just a Cessna that the guy hired for the day.
Does anyone know what the insurance implications of such an incident would be?
Under these circumstances, am I correct to assume that the insurance company would sue the estate of the deceased to recover the cost of the aircraft as it was a deliberate act?
Not knowing for sure, but I would think they would simply pay the insured party and leave it at that. The publicity associated with going after the family or the estate of a recently deceased would probably preclude any sort of cost recovery. I would be disappointed to hear differently.
How's it work in car crashes where the at-fault driver was uninsured and fatally injured, anyone know?
How's it work in car crashes where the at-fault driver was uninsured and fatally injured, anyone know?
I am not a lawyer, however in the case of a car crash the deceased's estate is usually sued by the survivors requiring compensation in the event of an at-fault crash. It is my understanding that it is a requirement to sue the at-fault persons before the TAC will pay out their share.
Suicide is a very selfish thing as we all know, but to use someone else's aircraft or vehicle to complete the task is merely only putting unjustified financial pressure on those left behind. If the aircraft is owned by another private party or a club, commercial reality says that costs should be sought.
If one were to have a life insurance policy that was valid (as in held for 12 months prior or the mandatory waiting period), then there may be some financial assistance available for aforementioned circumstance.
Suicide is a very selfish thing as we all know, but to use someone else's aircraft or vehicle to complete the task is merely only putting unjustified financial pressure on those left behind. If the aircraft is owned by another private party or a club, commercial reality says that costs should be sought.
If one were to have a life insurance policy that was valid (as in held for 12 months prior or the mandatory waiting period), then there may be some financial assistance available for aforementioned circumstance.
I am not a lawyer, however in the case of a car crash the deceased's estate is usually sued by the survivors requiring compensation in the event of an at-fault crash. It is my understanding that it is a requirement to sue the at-fault persons before the TAC will pay out their share.
The owners would certainly be compensated by the insurance company and would only be out of pocket for the excess of their policy.
I am now sure however whether the insurance company then attempts to recover the entire cost of the aircraft from the deceased estate or whether it is classified as an accident which the insurance company covers on their own.
It would be interesting to hear from an insurance lawyer on this one.
Unfortunately I don't think this is a unique case and I would be willing to bet that quite a few fatal accidents in hired aircraft would be cases of suicide.
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KRviator is spot on.
Legally the insurer would be entitled to seek recovery and would normally have a watertight case - in circumstance where a suicide note is left as evidence of the pilot's intention. However there are other things to consider being (1) possible negative publicity and (2) uncertainty as to value of the estate. The amount to be recovered (hull value) is also a factor.
In a subrogation recovery action the proceedings would be issued in the insured's name (ie: the aeroclub for example) and so this would mask the insurer's identity somewhat. If the aircraft was of high value and the pilot's estate known to be substantial, the insurer may be tempted to seek recovery.
In this case I can advise that all things considered, no recovery was undertaken.
TB
Legally the insurer would be entitled to seek recovery and would normally have a watertight case - in circumstance where a suicide note is left as evidence of the pilot's intention. However there are other things to consider being (1) possible negative publicity and (2) uncertainty as to value of the estate. The amount to be recovered (hull value) is also a factor.
In a subrogation recovery action the proceedings would be issued in the insured's name (ie: the aeroclub for example) and so this would mask the insurer's identity somewhat. If the aircraft was of high value and the pilot's estate known to be substantial, the insurer may be tempted to seek recovery.
In this case I can advise that all things considered, no recovery was undertaken.
TB
Last edited by TunaBum; 8th Nov 2016 at 10:30.
