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Norfolk Island Ditching ATSB Report - ?

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Norfolk Island Ditching ATSB Report - ?

Old 19th Feb 2015, 00:15
  #761 (permalink)  
 
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Minister is out of touch with the Aviation Industry and so was mccormick

Good post Frank.

Just noticed an article about mccomicks proposed montreal sojourn proposed by the Minister:

https://www.businessspectator.com.au...lead-un-agency
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Old 19th Feb 2015, 00:32
  #762 (permalink)  
 
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It's my opinion the Minister is captive to the un-elected Mike MrDak who, also in my opinion, holds the reigns of aviation direction in Australia. It's not only Peta Credlin who should be subject to public scrutiny by the media.
I acknowledge the Minister has some health problems, but he should step aside if he is incapable of functioning as a responsible, competent, and assertive elected member of the government.
Any candidate would appear to be a better choice than the Australian entry.
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Old 19th Feb 2015, 18:33
  #763 (permalink)  
 
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I hear Dominic Strauss-Kahn is also in the running for the ICAO job.
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Old 19th Feb 2015, 20:28
  #764 (permalink)  
 
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He certainly would fit in well with the gang at Canberra.
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Old 20th Feb 2015, 06:52
  #765 (permalink)  
 
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Really!! Good rumour Sunny!!

pprune alve and well??

  1. Dominique Strauss-Kahn
    Former French Minister of the Economy, Finance and Industry
  2. Dominique Gaston André Strauss-Kahn, often referred to in the media, and by himself, as DSK, is a French economist, lawyer, politician, and member of the French Socialist Party. Wikipedia
  3. Born: April 25, 1949 (age 65), Neuilly-sur-Seine, Nanterre, France
  4. Partner: Myriam L'Aouffir (2012–)
  5. Previous office: French Minister of the Economy, Finance and Industry (1997–1999)
  6. Children: Camille Strauss-Kahn, Vanessa Strauss-Kahn, Navy Strauss-Kahn, Laurin Strauss-Kahn
  7. Education: Paris West University Nanterre La Défense (1977), More
  8. Parents: Gilbert Strauss-Kahn, Jacqueline Fellus
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Old 20th Feb 2015, 10:29
  #766 (permalink)  
 
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Now for the good news...

From todays Oz p28 re Aviation. By S Creedy, PR handout re-writer.

McCormick's hopes dim as Lui leads the ICAO race

The frontrunner Ms Lui, is a veteran Chinese air safety official..etc etc...

Go Ms Lui !! I say.

Miniscule Truss said 'Mr McCormick was the most experienced and qualified person for the ICAO position..' And judging by Truss's robust interest in Aviation,and collosal knowledge of, he should know.

I do hope other folk here on PPRuNe took the trouble to apprise ICAO HQ otherwise.

The word from ICAO..Norfolk Island?. Pelair?... never heard of it !!
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Old 20th Feb 2015, 11:45
  #767 (permalink)  
 
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Re-opened ATSB investigation

If the ATSB investigation is to be "clean" and independent of previous line of management, this independence must go all the way to the top.

Remember this
Alarming air safety failures revealed in Senate Inquiry | Nick Xenophon - Independent Senator for South Australia

"The quality of evidence provided to the committee by the ATSB's Chief Commissioner Martin Dolan called into question his credibility as a witness;"

and this
ATSB chief's testimony lacked credibility: Senate | Plane Talking

“Mr Dolan’s evidence in this regard is questionable and has seriously eroded his standing as a witness before the committee.”


If the Senate Inquiry lost confidence in the Chief Commissioner, then how can we be expected to have confidence.

If Mr Dolan is to remain as chief, there must be a mechanism of keeping him out of the loop this time. Perhaps the report should only go as far as Chris Manning (the new Aviation Commissioner) and then direct to the Minister (far from perfect, but what else can we ask).
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Old 21st Feb 2015, 00:19
  #768 (permalink)  
 
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Miniscule Truss said 'Mr McCormick was the most experienced and qualified person for the ICAO position..'
Based on that statement the Farmer has more than just bad skin and poor bowels to contend with. It seems all those farm chemicals have taken their toll on his Miniscule brain. There are many better Australian aviators out there other than Captain Angry. But then again, ICAO is also rapidly becoming an outdated conglomerate of washed out has-beens and bureaucratic spin doctors so maybe big chief flying Skull would be well suited there? Either way the industry is rooted and is only getting worse.

"Deteriorating skies for all"

Last edited by Soteria; 21st Feb 2015 at 00:51.
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Old 21st Feb 2015, 00:43
  #769 (permalink)  
 
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An Australian identity once said here that things will have to get a lot worse before they can start to get better. To look at the positive, I think we are there, and things should now start to improve.
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Old 21st Feb 2015, 02:26
  #770 (permalink)  
 
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That's a big call Frank! If Australian Aviation had hit rock bottom there'd be a Royal Commission right now into the bullsh!t that emanates from the ATSB & CASA. Only then will it be on the upslope.
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Old 24th Feb 2015, 19:37
  #771 (permalink)  
 
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The recorders will be recovered from NGX to be used in the new investigation into the crash. Not a Royal Commission but a start if they are serious.
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Old 25th Feb 2015, 01:39
  #772 (permalink)  
 
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Provided of course they are still there......What an A grade F.... up this is!!!!
Stiky
👀
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Old 25th Feb 2015, 04:33
  #773 (permalink)  
 
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Hopefully the CVR might reveal why he tried to 'ditch' with the gear down....


Last edited by Hempy; 25th Feb 2015 at 09:01. Reason: both wheels??
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Old 25th Feb 2015, 05:09
  #774 (permalink)  
 
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The wreckage came to rest on a sandy seabed. Video footage showed that the two parts of the fuselage remained connected by the strong underfloor cables that normally controlled the aircraft’s control surfaces. The landing gear was extended, likely in consequence of the impact forces and the weight of the landing gear.
Thats the official version anyway.
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Old 25th Feb 2015, 06:40
  #775 (permalink)  
 
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Yeah, the 'official version'. That's all seemed very credible so far, hasn't it?

Oh...wait on...
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Old 25th Feb 2015, 06:57
  #776 (permalink)  
 
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Dark night ...

and shitty wx... would not the pilot and co person be busy trying to fly all those approaches have slowed the thing down and have the gear down and locked, all ready for finding solid ground ?.

Would a water impact actually bust the gear out to what looks like a fully down and locked position ? Bust it out maybe .....but all the way???
Because on impact the gear is then subjected to the water forces, which would imo, not favour a full extension.

Any other thoughts and opinions from that under water pic.?
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Old 25th Feb 2015, 07:18
  #777 (permalink)  
 
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'Gee this base is low, let's go over water and see if we can get visual'...

Said no pilot ever..
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Old 25th Feb 2015, 10:18
  #778 (permalink)  
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let's go over water and see if we can get visual'...
Ummm.. 'Twas SOP in a certain part of the world a long time ago...
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Old 25th Feb 2015, 21:38
  #779 (permalink)  
 
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An evening with the Senators

Senate Estimates 24th February 2015. A very pleasant evening with the Senators. I just caught up with the recordings - well worth a look. If you thought PelAir and CASA and ATSB was dead, think again. There is blood in the water, and plenty of curly questions were taken on notice.

The recordings are available at aph.gov.au
Watch Parliament ? Parliament of Australia

Also available on youtube

The order was re-scheduled for some reason.

CASA
CASA appeared in the afternoon session (i.e. part 2). CASA was the final department in the afternoon session - CASA starts at 4h16m into the recording (4:16 of part 2).
Nick X asked if the PelAir chief pilot had taken up a regulatory compliance position with CASA during the ATSB investigation. Skidmore didn’t know - plausible I guess given he is new. Farq helped him out to confirm He had indeed held such a position, but indicated he may have now left. CASA undertook to advise relevant dates if he has now left CASA. .

Nick X also asked what due diligence CASA undertook to ensure the PelAir regulatory deficits uncovered by the CASA special audit were not the responsibility of the then CP. NX continued on to suggest that if the CP had any responsibility for the PelAir regulatory deficits, then this could suggest he was not suitable for a regulatory compliance position at CASA. Long long pause. Skidmore then took this question on notice! We are all looking forward to that particular answer.


ATSB
ATSB appeared last, and Nick X led the charge. NX had been unavailable when ATSB was first called so ATSB was rescheduled. I had the feeling NX was doing a bit of last minute research before facing ATSB, and this may have been reason for rescheduling.

Dolan said ATSB had changed its view that the issues raised in CASA special audit had been addressed. ATSB was no longer of that view. "Will the Special audit and Chambers report be considered in new investigation?" Yes Senator.

Expect new investigation to be finished by Christmas 2015

Will get recorders ASAP, and believe data will still be recoverable

Investigation will be independent of initial investigation, with very minimal cross-over of staff. Other than ATSB reviewing ATSB of course.

Senate committee will get regular updates on progress during new investigation.

Joke of the night came from Heff, who innocently asked if the CP of PelAir at time of crash was working for CASA at time of ATSB investigation. Dolan stumbled and stuttered “I genuinely can’t recall Senator.” Someone at the back of the room apparently nodded his head in answer to Heff’s question, and Heff seemed happy with that. For now.


Plenty of warnings there would be additional QON for both CASA and ATSB. We didn’t get to hear what these were, and may have nothing to do with PelAir.
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Old 25th Feb 2015, 23:29
  #780 (permalink)  
 
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The senate, the DAS and a pumpkin

ATSB appeared last, and Nick X led the charge. NX had been unavailable when ATSB was first called so ATSB was rescheduled. I had the feeling NX was doing a bit of last minute research before facing ATSB, and this may have been reason for rescheduling.
That could well be the case. The very delightful and astute Hannah used to do much of Nicks work, and to be honest she would make a better investigator than Sangston and Co and she would be a better Commissioner than me me me Beaker, however Hannah is no longer in that role and a new girl is assisting Nick, she has big shoes to fill.

Anyway I think that CASA has an opportunity here to redeem itself somewhat if Skates is transparent and doesn't BS the senators. However the issue of having 3/4 of the ATSB Commissioners who are muppets remains, as well as the issue of the GWM who will not want to work with Skates, and then their is Pumpkin Head puppet mastering this three ring circus so it really beggars belief that anything other than an A380 smoking hole or an FAA downgrade will change things?

"Safe circus acts for all"
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