Advice for anyone who cares. . . .
It is certainly true that it is only for the money that I fly a jet. If someone offered me 75% of what I am on now to go back to a lightie (or ideally a twotter) I would be there in a heartbeat.
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40 Deg STH
The Duck days were excellent even though we did not have your luxury of short take-off and landing in the Otter. In the 402's I still recall, on the approach, coming towards the road, a bus or truck appearing in your path from either left or right, "jacking yourself up some feet for a moment or two then down to re-establish on the approach and still land on the first part of the runway. It was well worthwhile.
The grapes were good this year.
Tmb
The grapes were good this year.
Tmb
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Yes another cadet wanna-be
In relation to the cadet scheme and alot of people commenting on the 500 hr multi command.
I have recently checked with Qantas link and a recent virgin blue expression of interest which stated:
- 250 hours Command or Co-Pilot of multi-engined, fixed wing aircraft (excluding ICUS). Would this now seem like the REX cadet scheme to be more lucrative??
Just a point to clarify personal circumstances, i know GA people love their backgrounds and Cadet scheme is not for them. My current job requires alot of attention to standing instructions and routine checks which has similar aspects to SOP's. I believe i would enjoy the environment of starting with SOP's, high pressure and steep parabolic learning, of course this is my personal opinion.
My question to REX employees with concern to the cadet scheme in particular Krusty and go_soaring. Why would REX utilize a cadet scheme if it were not to graduate their first officers to Captain within six years? Surely the high end management would have plans on how to successfully promote a cadet F.O to Captain. ICUS maybe is the next generation of Captains, hypothetically speaking and i mean no disrespect.
Another question to add to this thread, would it be that difficult to source the 500 hours multi command during the REX six year period, as in on days off or annual leave??
Any advice would be appreciated, thanks and happy flying
I have recently checked with Qantas link and a recent virgin blue expression of interest which stated:
- 250 hours Command or Co-Pilot of multi-engined, fixed wing aircraft (excluding ICUS). Would this now seem like the REX cadet scheme to be more lucrative??
Just a point to clarify personal circumstances, i know GA people love their backgrounds and Cadet scheme is not for them. My current job requires alot of attention to standing instructions and routine checks which has similar aspects to SOP's. I believe i would enjoy the environment of starting with SOP's, high pressure and steep parabolic learning, of course this is my personal opinion.
My question to REX employees with concern to the cadet scheme in particular Krusty and go_soaring. Why would REX utilize a cadet scheme if it were not to graduate their first officers to Captain within six years? Surely the high end management would have plans on how to successfully promote a cadet F.O to Captain. ICUS maybe is the next generation of Captains, hypothetically speaking and i mean no disrespect.
Another question to add to this thread, would it be that difficult to source the 500 hours multi command during the REX six year period, as in on days off or annual leave??
Any advice would be appreciated, thanks and happy flying
Another question to add to this thread, would it be that difficult to source the 500 hours multi command during the REX six year period, as in on days off or annual leave??
They also own your duty and work you very hard, sometimes flying you six sectors in a day. I highly doubt they will be happy with you burning your duty with another operator on your days off! In fact I would be pretty positive it will be in your contract that any employment outside rex must be approved by management. It is in my employment contract!
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The Green Goblin
The six sectors per day workload depends a lot on the length of the sectors. In days gone by in the early days of Commuter runs on the Eastern coast of Australia, six sectors were often on. It made your ILS standards pretty good.
Tmb
Tmb
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JetX....mate you brought a tear to my eye, I thought the passion had died.
I look back now over the past 40 years or so in GA and would I change anything at all???.... and the answer is there are a squillion things I wish hadnt happened, and a squillion things I would have done differently if I had my time over again...but at the end of the day I look back at the memories, the adventure.... bugger all to show for it.... but would I have changed it???...Na!!!..Its been a privilege, my only regret is I sometimes feel... where was that special person to share those adventures with, those magic sights, those magic moments, those characters I met? Ga is such a solo event sometimes darn it!!
I think back and some of the things we did back then to get the job done, would see you locked up today, and its funny how the Sh....ty events, over time change into a humorous story to tell your grandkids. " There I was...nothing on the clock but the makers name....."..embellished of course with the passage of time..
I agree with you, there are a few pontificating buffoons out there, but there are also some old greybeards who are able and willing to pass on their wealth of experience, so seek them out. My Dad who taught me to fly said right at the beginning...
" when you think you know it all...give it up and find something else to do" There are some about the industry who perhaps this applies to..ego is a terrible disease in a pilot.
Congratulations mate...thank god there is actually someone else out there who actually loves what their doing, keep the passion alive!!
Safe Flying
I look back now over the past 40 years or so in GA and would I change anything at all???.... and the answer is there are a squillion things I wish hadnt happened, and a squillion things I would have done differently if I had my time over again...but at the end of the day I look back at the memories, the adventure.... bugger all to show for it.... but would I have changed it???...Na!!!..Its been a privilege, my only regret is I sometimes feel... where was that special person to share those adventures with, those magic sights, those magic moments, those characters I met? Ga is such a solo event sometimes darn it!!
I think back and some of the things we did back then to get the job done, would see you locked up today, and its funny how the Sh....ty events, over time change into a humorous story to tell your grandkids. " There I was...nothing on the clock but the makers name....."..embellished of course with the passage of time..
I agree with you, there are a few pontificating buffoons out there, but there are also some old greybeards who are able and willing to pass on their wealth of experience, so seek them out. My Dad who taught me to fly said right at the beginning...
" when you think you know it all...give it up and find something else to do" There are some about the industry who perhaps this applies to..ego is a terrible disease in a pilot.
Congratulations mate...thank god there is actually someone else out there who actually loves what their doing, keep the passion alive!!
Safe Flying
I'm over it. I'm sick of VNAV and LNAV and GA HDG ALTSEL. I'm sick of SOPS, MOAs, LSALTs, and TLAs. I'm sick of keeping the blue up and the green down. I want engines that rumble and wear the oil on the outside. I want impulse magnetos that require a wack with a hammer on a hot day. I want a wheel at the back and two at the front. But I have mouths to feed and bills to pay, so I'll keep pushing the buttons, but don't anyone try and tell me it's fun, because it isn't, except for when it is.
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Jet X
I agree with you fully. Im still in GA, struggling to get my multi time up, but when I get home some time tired and cranky after an 8 hr mail run. I stop and think, Im lucky cuz I would pay to do this, and people do, and cant for various reasons. Then I smile and think Im one of the lucky ones. And I know the multi or what ever will come.
I just love planes, flying.
Cosmo
I agree with you fully. Im still in GA, struggling to get my multi time up, but when I get home some time tired and cranky after an 8 hr mail run. I stop and think, Im lucky cuz I would pay to do this, and people do, and cant for various reasons. Then I smile and think Im one of the lucky ones. And I know the multi or what ever will come.
I just love planes, flying.
Cosmo
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Thanks for the revival Jetx! I'm one of those uni students who dreamt of the airlines and cadetships....
Now I'm out bush and couldn't be happier! I feel so sorry for those people who will never have the fun (or tension!) of VFR during the wet season up North, or landing on gravel roads or mustering low level! I've never had so much fun flying at 50ft scaring a few snotty old cows!
I wish I had read this thread four years ago...could have saved me all the money of applying for those pesky cadetships!
Now I'm out bush and couldn't be happier! I feel so sorry for those people who will never have the fun (or tension!) of VFR during the wet season up North, or landing on gravel roads or mustering low level! I've never had so much fun flying at 50ft scaring a few snotty old cows!
I wish I had read this thread four years ago...could have saved me all the money of applying for those pesky cadetships!
Last edited by airwolf117; 1st May 2013 at 08:47.
This has been a great thread, glad to read some positive stuff on pprune for once.
I'm just interested to know Jetx, how many years did you spend in ga and regionals before getting a jet job? And how many hours did it take you to get a jet job. I'm just interested to know as my son is considering going down the ga route one day. I have been a lame for 35 years but I know what I would be doing if I was in my 20's.
I remember when I was doing my apprenticeship in the late 70's and early 80's there were people who were leaving a very good paid apprenticeship to go and fly bashed out cessna's up in the Northern Territory. I thought they were nuts at first. 35 years later several of them are a380 captains at qantas, 1 made it to an a380 check and training captain, another made it to an a330 check and training captain, several are a330 captains at Cathay, I bumped into a mate who is flying the 747-800 freighter for Cathay all earning double what I earn as a lame, I'm even jealous of those second officers who are earning more than me having more days off per month having an absolute awesome lifestyle. I know pprune is very bias and negative but there is definitely light at the end of the tunnel. I have been to some university open days with my son lately and it is pretty depressing to see how stuffed some industry's are. Like a lot of people studying at university these days will be doing some boring office job and will be lucky to earn more than a dash 8 captain at the peak of there careers.
I'm just interested to know Jetx, how many years did you spend in ga and regionals before getting a jet job? And how many hours did it take you to get a jet job. I'm just interested to know as my son is considering going down the ga route one day. I have been a lame for 35 years but I know what I would be doing if I was in my 20's.
I remember when I was doing my apprenticeship in the late 70's and early 80's there were people who were leaving a very good paid apprenticeship to go and fly bashed out cessna's up in the Northern Territory. I thought they were nuts at first. 35 years later several of them are a380 captains at qantas, 1 made it to an a380 check and training captain, another made it to an a330 check and training captain, several are a330 captains at Cathay, I bumped into a mate who is flying the 747-800 freighter for Cathay all earning double what I earn as a lame, I'm even jealous of those second officers who are earning more than me having more days off per month having an absolute awesome lifestyle. I know pprune is very bias and negative but there is definitely light at the end of the tunnel. I have been to some university open days with my son lately and it is pretty depressing to see how stuffed some industry's are. Like a lot of people studying at university these days will be doing some boring office job and will be lucky to earn more than a dash 8 captain at the peak of there careers.
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Thank you very much JetX.
A truly inspirational thread. Wish I had read this 4 years ago, it certainly would've changed the way I approached my aviation career.
But life is full of changes and turns and you just have to adjust.
Bravo
T&G.
A truly inspirational thread. Wish I had read this 4 years ago, it certainly would've changed the way I approached my aviation career.
But life is full of changes and turns and you just have to adjust.
Bravo
T&G.
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When we were young
Amazing to think I started this thread 8 years ago!
What a journey it has been.
A few airlines & a few different types later, I'm left with a logbook that's covered a lot of airports I dreamt about and I've been fortunate enough to cover almost every continent... but I also feel I haven't even scratched the surface! A humble learning curve to say the least.
What's changed ?
Life... It gets away from you so damn quick.
Some of the single biggest transitions you will make in your "airline" career involve, getting married & your command. Both of which involve making decisions that affect other people... Welcome to adult hood.
What advice would I pass onto my younger self ?
I can do my best to split it into two categories, although I could list more… but no body really wants to read it all anyway!
Personal & Career.
Career: Be ambitious, be dedicated, be diligent and put the effort into actually knowing your stuff, for your moment of judgement will come from your professional management of a "situation" or lack there of and there is nothing worse than the feeling of not being prepared and knowing it. Yes, I've been there and I learnt.
"Respect all people and grovel to none" - One of my all time favourite quotes. Command and earn respect as a human being, leader, colleague, friend and professional. Be diplomatic, honest and in a multi-crew environment speak up with respect when you don't know something, you are not comfortable or you disagree with your colleague. Communication is a vital tool, make every attempt to master it as no two people are the same. Although many would agree that there is no room for sensitivity in the flight deck (and General Aviation) it does exists, we make mistakes. Own it, fix it, move on, have a beer or the way things are going join the boss for a soy gluten free chai latte and harassment case.
Never stop learning. We all have good and bad days so stay humble! This also applies to those of us who think we are better than we are.. left or right seat. Ignorance and arrogance are killers, not just in the air but also at the bar.... Just ask Maverick.
Q: How do you know there is a Pilot in the room ?
A: They'll tell you... Then they'll start talking about how Ansett was the greatest airline in the world. (Relax, it's a joke.. they'll actually tell you they’re an international pilot, Bali doesn’t count… Stop writing it as a country on your customs form!!)
Personal: I'll keep this simple. For those looking to leave the realm of bachelor or bachelorette-hood.... For what it’s worth… choose wisely, it takes a special kind of person to accept, support and deal with our careers. Through personal experience and spending countless hours listening to colleagues in a confined space (Hotel closet, crazy room parties ? Sadly no.. ) this part of your personal life can affect you more than you will appreciate. We've all made good & bad choices because of a significant other. For those of you experiencing any personal difficulties, please reach out to someone for a chat. We're all human and another Pilot is highly likely to understand or relate to your situation. Look out for each other. Not being on your A-game is a threat, so help me to help you.
What’s one of my biggest gripes about the industry ? The bullsh*t, the lack of integrity, morale, respect and the individual personal gain thought process. I have no reference to what the industry was like “back in the old days”, but if history is anything to go by there were some of the same issues back then as we are experiencing now and as an ex-girlfriend once told me…. maybe the problem is you. This applies to management, pilots, crew and everyone in the company… I sadly feel that we haven’t learnt from past mistakes.
So for those of you joining the industry “Be the change you wish to see”, there is hope… but we just happen to be transiting a time in human existence where we are very self centred, just look at the disgraceful state the traveling public leave the aircraft in expecting others to clean it up and ask your self when was the last time you did something or witnessed someone do something for someone else ? Start by opening a door for the cleaner or CEO, it will get you a long way.
Irrespective of who you do or don’t work for, PPL, CPL or ATPL… we are one industry.
For those of you in General Aviation, there is still no rush to join the airlines if that is what you wish to do. While those of us ahead of you are doing our best to shape the industry for the better, I'd also recommend taking more noble roads like the RFDS and enjoying contributing to the community or helping shape GA for the better. One day you'll end up like the rest of us, sitting there looking down and pointing out the places you "use" to fly. Oddly enough a lot of layover stories are GA related, as oppose to "One time I disconnected at 1'500 feet......" - Trust me, the jets aren't going anywhere and the industry needs passionate people.
Respect and look out for each other….. It’s been a great career to date and it’s been nice to pay back some debts to those who helped me along the way. I hope this thread is of value to someone and people keep contributing.
P.S,
Also please refrain from being that “Industry expert” who talks to the media after an incident or accident and actually has no idea what you’re talking about.
AKA: Jack Hoff, Airbus 172 Pilot. Industry expert, live up next on CNN……… We get it, you’re a pilot, but you’re not doing the rest of us any favours!!
(Butt-hurt DISCLAIMER: Please don’t take any of the jokes too seriously… I’m not a comedian… As I’ve been told by many girls, contrary to my own account of the situation)
What a journey it has been.
A few airlines & a few different types later, I'm left with a logbook that's covered a lot of airports I dreamt about and I've been fortunate enough to cover almost every continent... but I also feel I haven't even scratched the surface! A humble learning curve to say the least.
What's changed ?
Life... It gets away from you so damn quick.
Some of the single biggest transitions you will make in your "airline" career involve, getting married & your command. Both of which involve making decisions that affect other people... Welcome to adult hood.
What advice would I pass onto my younger self ?
I can do my best to split it into two categories, although I could list more… but no body really wants to read it all anyway!
Personal & Career.
Career: Be ambitious, be dedicated, be diligent and put the effort into actually knowing your stuff, for your moment of judgement will come from your professional management of a "situation" or lack there of and there is nothing worse than the feeling of not being prepared and knowing it. Yes, I've been there and I learnt.
"Respect all people and grovel to none" - One of my all time favourite quotes. Command and earn respect as a human being, leader, colleague, friend and professional. Be diplomatic, honest and in a multi-crew environment speak up with respect when you don't know something, you are not comfortable or you disagree with your colleague. Communication is a vital tool, make every attempt to master it as no two people are the same. Although many would agree that there is no room for sensitivity in the flight deck (and General Aviation) it does exists, we make mistakes. Own it, fix it, move on, have a beer or the way things are going join the boss for a soy gluten free chai latte and harassment case.
Never stop learning. We all have good and bad days so stay humble! This also applies to those of us who think we are better than we are.. left or right seat. Ignorance and arrogance are killers, not just in the air but also at the bar.... Just ask Maverick.
Q: How do you know there is a Pilot in the room ?
A: They'll tell you... Then they'll start talking about how Ansett was the greatest airline in the world. (Relax, it's a joke.. they'll actually tell you they’re an international pilot, Bali doesn’t count… Stop writing it as a country on your customs form!!)
Personal: I'll keep this simple. For those looking to leave the realm of bachelor or bachelorette-hood.... For what it’s worth… choose wisely, it takes a special kind of person to accept, support and deal with our careers. Through personal experience and spending countless hours listening to colleagues in a confined space (Hotel closet, crazy room parties ? Sadly no.. ) this part of your personal life can affect you more than you will appreciate. We've all made good & bad choices because of a significant other. For those of you experiencing any personal difficulties, please reach out to someone for a chat. We're all human and another Pilot is highly likely to understand or relate to your situation. Look out for each other. Not being on your A-game is a threat, so help me to help you.
What’s one of my biggest gripes about the industry ? The bullsh*t, the lack of integrity, morale, respect and the individual personal gain thought process. I have no reference to what the industry was like “back in the old days”, but if history is anything to go by there were some of the same issues back then as we are experiencing now and as an ex-girlfriend once told me…. maybe the problem is you. This applies to management, pilots, crew and everyone in the company… I sadly feel that we haven’t learnt from past mistakes.
So for those of you joining the industry “Be the change you wish to see”, there is hope… but we just happen to be transiting a time in human existence where we are very self centred, just look at the disgraceful state the traveling public leave the aircraft in expecting others to clean it up and ask your self when was the last time you did something or witnessed someone do something for someone else ? Start by opening a door for the cleaner or CEO, it will get you a long way.
Irrespective of who you do or don’t work for, PPL, CPL or ATPL… we are one industry.
For those of you in General Aviation, there is still no rush to join the airlines if that is what you wish to do. While those of us ahead of you are doing our best to shape the industry for the better, I'd also recommend taking more noble roads like the RFDS and enjoying contributing to the community or helping shape GA for the better. One day you'll end up like the rest of us, sitting there looking down and pointing out the places you "use" to fly. Oddly enough a lot of layover stories are GA related, as oppose to "One time I disconnected at 1'500 feet......" - Trust me, the jets aren't going anywhere and the industry needs passionate people.
Respect and look out for each other….. It’s been a great career to date and it’s been nice to pay back some debts to those who helped me along the way. I hope this thread is of value to someone and people keep contributing.
P.S,
Also please refrain from being that “Industry expert” who talks to the media after an incident or accident and actually has no idea what you’re talking about.
AKA: Jack Hoff, Airbus 172 Pilot. Industry expert, live up next on CNN……… We get it, you’re a pilot, but you’re not doing the rest of us any favours!!
(Butt-hurt DISCLAIMER: Please don’t take any of the jokes too seriously… I’m not a comedian… As I’ve been told by many girls, contrary to my own account of the situation)
Last edited by JetX; 9th May 2016 at 21:44.
