RAAF pilots leaving
Quote:
Could only be one beast!
Magoo
785kts/2.35M? Any other hints on the equipment!
Magoo
Join Date: Nov 2003
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785kts/2.35M? Any other hints on the equipment!
Could only be one beast!
Magoo
Arrh! of course Magoo, you are so very right. I was qualified on that type as well for a short time, so I have no excuse except plead poor recall in my old age (was it 256 that was a magic number as well?).
Could only be one beast!
Magoo
Arrh! of course Magoo, you are so very right. I was qualified on that type as well for a short time, so I have no excuse except plead poor recall in my old age (was it 256 that was a magic number as well?).
Extract the maximum training, experience and enjoyment out of military aviation then POQ. Then you can make some serious money out of the airline business before you become too old.
Yep, some of my mates made a full career out of the military and now subsist on a military pension. All they have to wake up to each day is a hot cup of tea (that is, when they can afford a new teabag).
The very best advice I can give you is don't stay too long in the military.
Still sounds pretty good to me!
Sounds like you all need a hot cup of "wake up and realise how good you have it"
A hot steaming cup that is....
Sounds like you all need a hot cup of "wake up and realise how good you have it"
A hot steaming cup that is....
The very best advice I can give you is don't stay too long in the military.
Join Date: May 2002
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Right, now we are back on topic (leaving parades,DRN and steaming hot cups of something behind us)....
Any idea how many pilots are going and to which airlines?
Which SQNs are losing guys?
I'm currently somewhere hot and dusty and a bit out of the loop...
Cheers
COR
Any idea how many pilots are going and to which airlines?
Which SQNs are losing guys?
I'm currently somewhere hot and dusty and a bit out of the loop...
Cheers
COR
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Sydney Australia
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RAAF Pilots leaving
you bunch of whingers!! It ain't that bad! I am really happy! Flying heaps, pay is good, plenty of good times with my mates! yeah sure I have no idea where I am going to be next week let along next year but hey adds to the adventure. Ok, it really does depend on your circumstances. I have been in for 18 years and still enjoying my time however I can totally understand those that want to move on. I am single and have no real goals except finding another great place to go skiing!! Those who have family and want stability, totally understand wanting to leave. If its the bull**** you are leaving for to go to the airlines....you are in for a shock as all large organisations have that. This is the military and not a flying club so you have to put up with meaningless rubbish...part of the job in my opinion. Having said all that, I think you find myself leaving in a few years as it will simply time to move onto to something else.
I am really happy! Flying heaps, pay is good, plenty of good times with my mates! yeah sure I have no idea where I am going to be next week let along next year but hey adds to the adventure. Ok, it really does depend on your circumstances. I have been in for 18 years and still enjoying my time however I can totally understand those that want to move on. I am single and have no real goals except finding another great place to go skiing!! Those who have family and want stability, totally understand wanting to leave. If its the bull**** you are leaving for to go to the airlines....you are in for a shock as all large organisations have that. This is the military and not a flying club so you have to put up with meaningless rubbish...part of the job in my opinion. Having said all that, I think you find myself leaving in a few years as it will simply time to move onto to something else.
I am single and have no real goals except finding another great place to go skiing!!
Passed your C Exams yet?
Running out of options real soon. Watch your six, laddie!
Join Date: Aug 2004
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RAAF Pilots leaving
I actually have to agree with you FR. I really don't want to be one of those guys become bitter and that just turn up for work and complain. Staying in an organisaion (and job) for too long can cause that to the most positive of chaps! I think I will tick the twenty year box and by that stage it will be well and truely time to move on. I have completed ATPL exams, plenty of hours, so no probs leaving when ready.
Join Date: Jun 2001
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So the wheel turns again. Those that want to go will go, and those who want to stay will obviously stay.
Unfortunately the RAAF persists with it’s assumption that every pilot who joins wants to climb the greasy pole of promotion and be chief one day. The RAAF still just doesn’t get the point that there are some who are quite happy to forgo promotion (and all the cr*p that goes with it!) and stay flying.
I left in the mid 90’s when promotion loomed and got a job doing what I was trained to do and getting paid more than anyone in the military had even heard of. I continued to gain experience in the field and was snapped up by the RAAF several years later because now I was (wait for it) experienced! I have more hours in my logbook than most CO’s have. Actually that includes Shep, but that’s nothing to boast about! Somewhat ironic that the experience that made me attractive to the RAAF (well my looks wouldn’t cut it!) was gained outside the RAAF. Could’ve just left me flying but, no - must keep feeding the great promotion pyramid and man the plethora of desk jobs that somehow seem to be more important to keep manned than flying jobs.
Those of my era who stayed are well up the promotion ladder, but ceased full time flying duties some time ago. Meantime muggins here has more real flying than he can shake a stick, at with a nice fat bank account and no mortgage! I get to use my experience where it's best utilised - in an aircraft, not behind a desk!
For those that want to stay in and gain promotion – good on you! I hope you get to where you want to go. To those that want to get out – go for it! However don’t under value your hard earnt skills. Don’t let anyone else try and tell you differently – especially some of those here!
Unfortunately the RAAF persists with it’s assumption that every pilot who joins wants to climb the greasy pole of promotion and be chief one day. The RAAF still just doesn’t get the point that there are some who are quite happy to forgo promotion (and all the cr*p that goes with it!) and stay flying.
I left in the mid 90’s when promotion loomed and got a job doing what I was trained to do and getting paid more than anyone in the military had even heard of. I continued to gain experience in the field and was snapped up by the RAAF several years later because now I was (wait for it) experienced! I have more hours in my logbook than most CO’s have. Actually that includes Shep, but that’s nothing to boast about! Somewhat ironic that the experience that made me attractive to the RAAF (well my looks wouldn’t cut it!) was gained outside the RAAF. Could’ve just left me flying but, no - must keep feeding the great promotion pyramid and man the plethora of desk jobs that somehow seem to be more important to keep manned than flying jobs.
Those of my era who stayed are well up the promotion ladder, but ceased full time flying duties some time ago. Meantime muggins here has more real flying than he can shake a stick, at with a nice fat bank account and no mortgage! I get to use my experience where it's best utilised - in an aircraft, not behind a desk!
For those that want to stay in and gain promotion – good on you! I hope you get to where you want to go. To those that want to get out – go for it! However don’t under value your hard earnt skills. Don’t let anyone else try and tell you differently – especially some of those here!
Am aware that the boys in Canberra are looking at the looming pilot shortages carefully, especially with new RAAF platforms rolling - MMRT, C17, UAV, JSF, F18F, P3 replacement programs, New Helos around the corner. Would not be surprised if some incentives come forward over the next year for pilots out of ROSO. My contacts around the industry tell me they already seeing the shortages affecting their ops.
Join Date: Jun 2001
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When will they offer us a bonus? Plenty of surveys coming out of DP, but no doubt nothing will happen until late next year after the mass exodus!
As for the bonus.............another unimaginative solution by unimaginative people who refuse to look even a small distance outside the box.
In the vast majority of cases RAAF pilots do not leave because of the money. By the time their ROSO (a bit like the bonding system in the airline world) is up they are senior FLTLT's and therefore on pretty good money. They will take a significant pay drop for the first few years if they go to QF as an F/O.
The vast majority of RAAF pilots leave the service to keep flying. They would dearly like to stay in and fly the flash aircraft doing interesting and exciting things, however the system has probably earmarked them for promotion. In the RAAF, promotion above FLTLT = significantly reduced opportunities to stay flying.
The bonuses do not do a good job of swaying those whom are undecided. Invariably those whom are going to stay anyway will take them. The net result is a cost to Defence for very little gain.
The RAAF needs to think outside it's very constrained little box and squarely face the real reasons their pilot's leave.
There will always be a small proportion of pilots who will go to the airlines. Let them go, and thank them for their time rather then making them feel like rats deserting a ship.
I will guarantee if every squadron pilot was asked what they wanted to do ( i.e. given a say in their career), initially a significant proportion would elect to stay in their current flying jobs for the medium to long term. This will instantly preserve unit corporate experience. Very soon after that the demand for new pilots will reduce, significantly reducing the strain on an already under funded and understaffed training organisation.
Around the early 90's the demand for pilots reduced, but the RAAF training system was still producing a relatively high output. This was chiefly because the training system responded to the large numbers of pilots who left in the mid/late 80's, but was significantly out of phase. This resulted in lots of pilots in the RAAF whom weren't going anywhere. The answer was to establish lots of ground positions for pilots. To the best of my knowledge these positions are still established. The RAAF needs to have a good hard look at what ground positions are so important that they actually require trained, experienced pilots to man them. Do we really need experienced pilots as aides to senior officers and Governors, for example?
With our already high operational tempo and new types coming on line, why not pull some of these guys and gals out from behind desks and put their experience to good use?
The RAAF still persists with the outdated notion that every pilot who joins wants to be Chief one day. Granted, there are those that aspire to such heights, but I will wager that many do not. Those that do not want promotion should not have it foisted upon them. Let those that want the stripes and the associated BS have it.
As time goes on a proportion of those pilots who opted to stay in rank and stay flying may change their minds and elect to go for promotion. Should that be the case, these people should then be considered for promotion.
In conclusion, give more control of pilot's careers back to the individual pilots. Review all ground positions established for pilots with a view of releasing those pilots back into the flying work force. Watch the training work load and cost decrease. And no bonuses will be required!
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Capt SD,
Agree with all, however:
They will take a significant pay drop for the first few years if they go to QF as an F/O.
Have you seen the pay for Cathay DESO HK and DEFO (pax) Aust? Certainly not a pay cut.....
Agree with all, however:
They will take a significant pay drop for the first few years if they go to QF as an F/O.
Have you seen the pay for Cathay DESO HK and DEFO (pax) Aust? Certainly not a pay cut.....