Air Ngukurr chief pilot in court
sweethart .... are you honke ? seeing that you only signed in to pprune for the sake of bagging CASA ... that sounds like a typical honke thing to do .... especially when he is on the back foot.
- gotta lurrrve the pprune!
- gotta lurrrve the pprune!
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Poor, poor HE. All these people picking on him!
Maybe the silence has been broken coz those of us who have been around Darwin for more than 6 months are ASTOUNDED at the outrage and bleating of the 'HE supporters.'
A haze of unreality surrounds this reaction. Not unlike reading about a burglar being upset at copping a beating from the person living in the house he broke into!
Someone asked for more stories. OK, try these..
A long time ago at an aerodrome far far away...
"All stations Nooker, Chieftain ABC taxiing for Brute Island, runway 11 copied NMQ"
"ABC, gidday, NMQ crosswind runway 11"
"Ah, mate, can I taxi out?"
"If you're quick"
"OK, thanks"
A minute or three later
"NMQ final"
no response
"Mate, NMQ final, you planning to roll or what?"
"Just finished my mag check, won't be a sec"
[#$%##$%! What!!]
"NMQ going around!"
a moment later...
"You should have extended downwind, mate"
"You shouldn't have entered the runway if you weren't ready to go, MATE!"
"Good bushpilots don't do their runups over a loose surface."
Outstanding! What airmanship! I really learned a lesson that day!
Or can our man remember that other splendid example of pilotage....how not to do an instrument approach...
"Didya see me?"
"Didya see me that time?
"Hey boys, how much fuel do I have left?"
And did I mention the mornings entertainment you gave the Kendell boys when they visited to conduct interviews late 2000?
Or playing to the greed of those Ngukurr council members that owed Gulf Air up to $2000 each by getting Mario, the most inoffensive man you could ever meet, kicked out of the community for being a disruptive influence!
Or seeing all those sunburned and freckled anglo-celtic pilot faces collecting CDEP as wages?
If it wasn't real life, it would make a great movie!
=======================================
Hiball asks: For goodness sakes is that how we want the regulator to act?
If i am not up to the job, i might not like it, but i would EXPECT the regulator to take my licence away. End of Story.
The rules are there to protect the poor uninformed sods who pay for airplanes to take them somewhere.
Right from the beginnings of commercial aviation in the 1920's men like Hudson Fysh and Norman Brearley understood implicitly that for aviation to be accepted as an industry, it must be as safe as it can possibly be. From them and from some talented original aviation administrators, there evolved an exceptionally safe and disciplined australian aviation system that used to show the world how it should and could be done.
People like HE are not part of that tradition. They are NOT good pilots. They may have some basic technical skill, but they show NO respect for the system they work in, are ignorant of many aspects of airmanship and the regulations, and are motivated by self interest and move through the day with a bullishness that gives scant regard to their responsibilities to their pax and their community. When under pressure, they don't stand by principles -- they cheat, lie, pressure others, scam and dodge to get through the day. NOT good pilots. Hardly even qualifies as 'persons of good character."
So how should the regulator act? Keep the good guys on their toes. Protect the fare paying public. Knock the shonks, the also-rans and the incompetent on the head, quickly.
If that is an unsurmountable obstacle for you, maybe you shouldn't be in this industry.
Maybe the silence has been broken coz those of us who have been around Darwin for more than 6 months are ASTOUNDED at the outrage and bleating of the 'HE supporters.'
A haze of unreality surrounds this reaction. Not unlike reading about a burglar being upset at copping a beating from the person living in the house he broke into!
Someone asked for more stories. OK, try these..
A long time ago at an aerodrome far far away...
"All stations Nooker, Chieftain ABC taxiing for Brute Island, runway 11 copied NMQ"
"ABC, gidday, NMQ crosswind runway 11"
"Ah, mate, can I taxi out?"
"If you're quick"
"OK, thanks"
A minute or three later
"NMQ final"
no response
"Mate, NMQ final, you planning to roll or what?"
"Just finished my mag check, won't be a sec"
[#$%##$%! What!!]
"NMQ going around!"
a moment later...
"You should have extended downwind, mate"
"You shouldn't have entered the runway if you weren't ready to go, MATE!"
"Good bushpilots don't do their runups over a loose surface."
Outstanding! What airmanship! I really learned a lesson that day!
Or can our man remember that other splendid example of pilotage....how not to do an instrument approach...
"Didya see me?"
"Didya see me that time?
"Hey boys, how much fuel do I have left?"
And did I mention the mornings entertainment you gave the Kendell boys when they visited to conduct interviews late 2000?
Or playing to the greed of those Ngukurr council members that owed Gulf Air up to $2000 each by getting Mario, the most inoffensive man you could ever meet, kicked out of the community for being a disruptive influence!
Or seeing all those sunburned and freckled anglo-celtic pilot faces collecting CDEP as wages?
If it wasn't real life, it would make a great movie!
=======================================
Hiball asks: For goodness sakes is that how we want the regulator to act?
If i am not up to the job, i might not like it, but i would EXPECT the regulator to take my licence away. End of Story.
The rules are there to protect the poor uninformed sods who pay for airplanes to take them somewhere.
Right from the beginnings of commercial aviation in the 1920's men like Hudson Fysh and Norman Brearley understood implicitly that for aviation to be accepted as an industry, it must be as safe as it can possibly be. From them and from some talented original aviation administrators, there evolved an exceptionally safe and disciplined australian aviation system that used to show the world how it should and could be done.
People like HE are not part of that tradition. They are NOT good pilots. They may have some basic technical skill, but they show NO respect for the system they work in, are ignorant of many aspects of airmanship and the regulations, and are motivated by self interest and move through the day with a bullishness that gives scant regard to their responsibilities to their pax and their community. When under pressure, they don't stand by principles -- they cheat, lie, pressure others, scam and dodge to get through the day. NOT good pilots. Hardly even qualifies as 'persons of good character."
So how should the regulator act? Keep the good guys on their toes. Protect the fare paying public. Knock the shonks, the also-rans and the incompetent on the head, quickly.
If that is an unsurmountable obstacle for you, maybe you shouldn't be in this industry.
Last edited by ITCZ; 23rd Sep 2003 at 10:21.
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Well Said ITCZ.
I cant understand why people would support such a person, either they dont really know him or it is him.
The things we had to put up with, he took full advantage of us. But thats ok because the x ngukurr pilots are better guys from.
Here is a question for everyone.
As pilots in the industry, who do we really trust?
I cant understand why people would support such a person, either they dont really know him or it is him.
The things we had to put up with, he took full advantage of us. But thats ok because the x ngukurr pilots are better guys from.
Here is a question for everyone.
As pilots in the industry, who do we really trust?
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That reminds me of another incident or two. We’ll call the company Crazy Clown Airlines.
The parallels are absolutely amazing as their CP also hails from the shaky isles. The mongrel mobster is that good that HE doesn’t need to do any verbal pre-flight checks, just in his head.
The co-pilot asked for the checklist but he replied “done em” or so he thought until the turbine a/c had commenced its takeoff roll & the co-pilot noticed the torque gauges on zero. Oops somebody left the inverters off DOH!
Another time on finals to DN the PIC said to Capt Krusty “quarter flap thanks” to which Krusty replied “you’re not ready yet”.
Funny, I always thought that the term pilot in command meant just that!
The parallels are absolutely amazing as their CP also hails from the shaky isles. The mongrel mobster is that good that HE doesn’t need to do any verbal pre-flight checks, just in his head.
The co-pilot asked for the checklist but he replied “done em” or so he thought until the turbine a/c had commenced its takeoff roll & the co-pilot noticed the torque gauges on zero. Oops somebody left the inverters off DOH!
Another time on finals to DN the PIC said to Capt Krusty “quarter flap thanks” to which Krusty replied “you’re not ready yet”.
Funny, I always thought that the term pilot in command meant just that!
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more yarns
Once....at an aerodrome far far away. You know the big military one, with lots of fast jets.
The weather was bad...oooooh. Fog. Thick and scary...well for this new pilot getting a checkride. ' Yeeh I'll show you how to get in. Just fly a 10nm gps arc with a Garmin100, line up on the VOR and go down through the fog' Now it got dark. And ol' man honks got scared. 'Yeeh, nah I'm going around' And the new pilot was even more scared "Ah chief pilot sir your still on decsent at full power now' 'Yeeh I see the runway, you take over' Then a voice on the radio warned 'your gears not down' ' yeeh, nah lucky we thought of that.
Oh there are so many more to tell. Stay tuned for the next bedtime story. "Ol' man Ziggy the car mecanic tinkers with planes as well"
The weather was bad...oooooh. Fog. Thick and scary...well for this new pilot getting a checkride. ' Yeeh I'll show you how to get in. Just fly a 10nm gps arc with a Garmin100, line up on the VOR and go down through the fog' Now it got dark. And ol' man honks got scared. 'Yeeh, nah I'm going around' And the new pilot was even more scared "Ah chief pilot sir your still on decsent at full power now' 'Yeeh I see the runway, you take over' Then a voice on the radio warned 'your gears not down' ' yeeh, nah lucky we thought of that.
Oh there are so many more to tell. Stay tuned for the next bedtime story. "Ol' man Ziggy the car mecanic tinkers with planes as well"
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
Sounds as though helldog hit a soft spot there sweethart 
So YOU are the one who processes pilot applications for ALL Oz jobs! You must be one powerful dude.
Funny, but I've never heard of you!
Betcha sweetie is losing sleep, wondering who's going to "spill their guts" next.
So YOU are the one who processes pilot applications for ALL Oz jobs! You must be one powerful dude.
Funny, but I've never heard of you!
Betcha sweetie is losing sleep, wondering who's going to "spill their guts" next.
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Sweetheart; no such luck, I'm not CASA and I'm not here to help you. Why use the same nickname as a dead croc, and where do You intend to work next ? Africa ?
ITCZ; the quote:"air of unreality" extends as well to how long this saga has been dragging on, consuming all of the time, tears, effort and money that it has.
To quote you again:"Knock the shonks, the also-rans and the incompetent on the head, quickly."
The problem underlying both of your quotes is the lack of regulation of who can get into the industry in the first place; the current answer - anyone ! There may be some implications in this for the "Darwin/NT" thread elsewhere. For example, the simple but very true conversation that you mentioned on that thread.
Somewhere, sometime, Honk featured in such a conversation.
While you acknowledge the relevance of such a conversation to any pilot's consequent first job, consider too the limitations of conversations like these in being unable to sort out that percentage of people who will a year later become the shonks, Honks, and also-rans that we all have to pay for.
ITCZ; the quote:"air of unreality" extends as well to how long this saga has been dragging on, consuming all of the time, tears, effort and money that it has.
To quote you again:"Knock the shonks, the also-rans and the incompetent on the head, quickly."
The problem underlying both of your quotes is the lack of regulation of who can get into the industry in the first place; the current answer - anyone ! There may be some implications in this for the "Darwin/NT" thread elsewhere. For example, the simple but very true conversation that you mentioned on that thread.
Somewhere, sometime, Honk featured in such a conversation.
While you acknowledge the relevance of such a conversation to any pilot's consequent first job, consider too the limitations of conversations like these in being unable to sort out that percentage of people who will a year later become the shonks, Honks, and also-rans that we all have to pay for.
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You are dead right ITCZ. When someones down they all pick on him. Good Aussie way in the NT. Just look at the crap that has been posted. Hard to understand except when you dig deeper and find that the whining African pilots did not get what they wanted.
Pretty lucky you are Helldog. What about the arvo when you thought it was only one little drink and no one would know? You lucky the word didn't get out then or you would be the one in the gun! But then you would have copped it sweet? Hell yea!
You seem to know just how to fly an approach in fog. Must have had plenty of practice! The Feds have just about shot their bolt now. Can't find anyone to sign up. They all know they will be in the gun. I am sure they would be happy to talk to you. CVome on home and see what fun it would be. Just remember to bring you wallet!!
You are right Rorksmate- standard of proof is lower in the AAT but then so is the oportunity to attack the witness and the statements will be handy if someone wants to recover some losses. Lies and cheating never won the battle and certainly not the war. Thats what it will be.
Could even see CASA having to pay some money here if the briefs by Langmead are anything to go by! He and that Wollerman turkey have put a bit of a cat amongst the pigeons methinks.
Don't know why we can't all just get on about the busness of flying like we all love and forget the crap. Go Ngukurr you are doing a great job.
Pretty lucky you are Helldog. What about the arvo when you thought it was only one little drink and no one would know? You lucky the word didn't get out then or you would be the one in the gun! But then you would have copped it sweet? Hell yea!
You seem to know just how to fly an approach in fog. Must have had plenty of practice! The Feds have just about shot their bolt now. Can't find anyone to sign up. They all know they will be in the gun. I am sure they would be happy to talk to you. CVome on home and see what fun it would be. Just remember to bring you wallet!!
You are right Rorksmate- standard of proof is lower in the AAT but then so is the oportunity to attack the witness and the statements will be handy if someone wants to recover some losses. Lies and cheating never won the battle and certainly not the war. Thats what it will be.
Could even see CASA having to pay some money here if the briefs by Langmead are anything to go by! He and that Wollerman turkey have put a bit of a cat amongst the pigeons methinks.
Don't know why we can't all just get on about the busness of flying like we all love and forget the crap. Go Ngukurr you are doing a great job.
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ah thats funny
Hello sweet-e,
All this crap about not working in Oz again. What bull, I will work there again if and when I choose. For now I am fine here in Africa, yes I do enjoy it. That crap about if you talk to CASA you will never work again is so old. It only works on green pilots that are sent out to risk their lives for shonks like honks. Once you are established in the industry you know it is a pile of garbage.
Hiball, your such a honky. Mate say all you want. I will not even answer any allegations from a honky puppet like you. As this is a place where I encorage open speech...give it your best and let me have it.
I would love to meet the wombats that are sticking up for honks here. No violence or anything...I have no anger to those that are ignorant. Just so I can laugh at you.
Night all I am off to watch the sunset over Lake Vic with a cold Tusker.
All this crap about not working in Oz again. What bull, I will work there again if and when I choose. For now I am fine here in Africa, yes I do enjoy it. That crap about if you talk to CASA you will never work again is so old. It only works on green pilots that are sent out to risk their lives for shonks like honks. Once you are established in the industry you know it is a pile of garbage.
Hiball, your such a honky. Mate say all you want. I will not even answer any allegations from a honky puppet like you. As this is a place where I encorage open speech...give it your best and let me have it.
I would love to meet the wombats that are sticking up for honks here. No violence or anything...I have no anger to those that are ignorant. Just so I can laugh at you.
Night all I am off to watch the sunset over Lake Vic with a cold Tusker.
Some time ago there was a thread about reference checking with regards to QF but I guess the technique could apply to any organization. A poster stated that if someone got a bad serve from a past employer, the prospective employer would then ask the referee to put their concerns in writing. If the referee then backed out you could be fairly certain that the referee was not being particularly objective.
I think a certain Operator in East Arnhem land has now become so infamous across the land, that putting them down for a Reference would not be such a great idea.
statue Honke?
I think a certain Operator in East Arnhem land has now become so infamous across the land, that putting them down for a Reference would not be such a great idea.
statue Honke?
Last edited by slice; 5th Oct 2003 at 23:58.
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.
As Kaptin M said. Looks like there are a few people out there that are in charge of all applications of ALL jobs in Oz.
I have to aggree that if I wanted a job in Darwin, yes I would find it hard....hmmmm, no I would say almost impossible to get one. But hey I dont want a job in Darwin. We all have to admit that the sittuation is bad in Australia fo pilot jobs. I was there a few weeks ago and was bombarded with questions from pilots that are out of luck there and want too come over here. Aviation is a worldwide game, do you honky puppets think that it worries me in the slightest that my job options are restricted in one small part of the world?
Trust me I have many job prospects in Oz. And chief pilots have asked me for the name of shonks so they can scrap HIS resume if he should apply with them yes I have told them the story. Trust me there ARE many professional operators in Oz, and I would not be at any dissadvantage if applying to them.
One small point on a comment from Hiball. You say that my actions were as a result of not getting what I wanted. Mate thats bull. So was it the same for other pilot s that gave statements? Even the ones that were at the time working for other operators? Lets say it was true, and trust me its not. The motivation does not alter thhe FACTS. So tell me hiball how do we know you are not bagging me because you were adversly affected by honks being exposed, whats your motivation?
Oh by the way, chill the beer and buy the party hats. I will have my day in court in Darwin. Not soon but soonish. All you honky puppets can just ask him the date. You can also tell him that I recieved his threat to me and some other pilots...five by five. Oh and hiball tell him I will say I forgot everything at the hearing...if I can have my old job back. On the 210 of course, but only if CDEP tops up my massive pay!
I have to aggree that if I wanted a job in Darwin, yes I would find it hard....hmmmm, no I would say almost impossible to get one. But hey I dont want a job in Darwin. We all have to admit that the sittuation is bad in Australia fo pilot jobs. I was there a few weeks ago and was bombarded with questions from pilots that are out of luck there and want too come over here. Aviation is a worldwide game, do you honky puppets think that it worries me in the slightest that my job options are restricted in one small part of the world?
Trust me I have many job prospects in Oz. And chief pilots have asked me for the name of shonks so they can scrap HIS resume if he should apply with them yes I have told them the story. Trust me there ARE many professional operators in Oz, and I would not be at any dissadvantage if applying to them.
One small point on a comment from Hiball. You say that my actions were as a result of not getting what I wanted. Mate thats bull. So was it the same for other pilot s that gave statements? Even the ones that were at the time working for other operators? Lets say it was true, and trust me its not. The motivation does not alter thhe FACTS. So tell me hiball how do we know you are not bagging me because you were adversly affected by honks being exposed, whats your motivation?
Oh by the way, chill the beer and buy the party hats. I will have my day in court in Darwin. Not soon but soonish. All you honky puppets can just ask him the date. You can also tell him that I recieved his threat to me and some other pilots...five by five. Oh and hiball tell him I will say I forgot everything at the hearing...if I can have my old job back. On the 210 of course, but only if CDEP tops up my massive pay!
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Just curious, but which one of you squeeky clean, legal at all time pilots took a C 210 up into the flight levels for kicks to see how high you could get?
I guess someone held a gun to your head.
Now theres still talk about people coming back for court cases, H.E did this, H.E did that, but who was personally screwed over?
I guess someone held a gun to your head.
Now theres still talk about people coming back for court cases, H.E did this, H.E did that, but who was personally screwed over?
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Rorksmate:
You are right, the 'standard conversation' that gets a newbie hired in the NT was put forward as an insight for the wannabees as to how things work up here. I certainly do not endorse it as a personnel selection procedure!
Hiball:
"When someones down they all pick on him"
You are fooling yourself, sweetie.
There are any number of examples to show that you are talking rubbish. Wheels ups at south goulbourn, fuel exhaustion and landing on highways, all sorts of major stuff ups by NT pilots that blotted otherwise clean report cards.
All of the pilots in these instances copped a few comments, but were not the subject of a discussion like this. The difference being that most of these guys owned up to their stuffups, copped the embarrassment and didn't try to bullsh!t their way out of the whole thing. They might have let it be known that there were contributing factors, but hey, they knew they did it. Hell, it was a ticket to an Ansett interview!
The reason that 'poor HE' is getting such a kicking, is not simply because he is down. In fact, it looks like he is legally almost out of danger.
HE is getting a kicking because there are a few people from the mid to late 90's around that won't let him 're-invent the past.' He and his mates are starting to believe their own bullsh!t.
If he had just sat down and kept his mouth shut, and told his mates to belt up, he would most probably have been left alone. But bleating and crying like a TV evangelist caught in a whorehouse has the long-term Darwinites shaking their heads and saying, predictably -- what a load of sh!t, coming from HE of all people.
You are right, the 'standard conversation' that gets a newbie hired in the NT was put forward as an insight for the wannabees as to how things work up here. I certainly do not endorse it as a personnel selection procedure!
Hiball:
"When someones down they all pick on him"
You are fooling yourself, sweetie.
There are any number of examples to show that you are talking rubbish. Wheels ups at south goulbourn, fuel exhaustion and landing on highways, all sorts of major stuff ups by NT pilots that blotted otherwise clean report cards.
All of the pilots in these instances copped a few comments, but were not the subject of a discussion like this. The difference being that most of these guys owned up to their stuffups, copped the embarrassment and didn't try to bullsh!t their way out of the whole thing. They might have let it be known that there were contributing factors, but hey, they knew they did it. Hell, it was a ticket to an Ansett interview!
The reason that 'poor HE' is getting such a kicking, is not simply because he is down. In fact, it looks like he is legally almost out of danger.
HE is getting a kicking because there are a few people from the mid to late 90's around that won't let him 're-invent the past.' He and his mates are starting to believe their own bullsh!t.
If he had just sat down and kept his mouth shut, and told his mates to belt up, he would most probably have been left alone. But bleating and crying like a TV evangelist caught in a whorehouse has the long-term Darwinites shaking their heads and saying, predictably -- what a load of sh!t, coming from HE of all people.
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More yarns
Since we're all posting scary stories, The Boat once recited me a great one... but I lose track of the who's who.
Helldog was it youself, or one of the other perfect children of the time, that would ... Story deleted as a needless publication of stupid(s') behaviour ... as it went past?
Not accusing... Just asking...
Helldog was it youself, or one of the other perfect children of the time, that would ... Story deleted as a needless publication of stupid(s') behaviour ... as it went past?
Not accusing... Just asking...
Last edited by jon.pierre; 6th Oct 2003 at 08:08.
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hmmmmm
Jon,
That would be rather reckless. Not to mention dangerous. Just like climbing way up into the flight levels. However I have been accused of being both reckless and dangerous, still I dont condone that type of behaviour Just ask Boat to tell you the story again
That would be rather reckless. Not to mention dangerous. Just like climbing way up into the flight levels. However I have been accused of being both reckless and dangerous, still I dont condone that type of behaviour
Just ask Boat to tell you the story again
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No matter.
No matter just glad to see that sort attitude got shown the door, and the company has grown for the better... but then... they were only being dangerous if the Honks MADE them do it.