Of course there was no direct threat, but your bizarre statement about executing John Kerry could be interpreted as an implied threat to his person.

No one, including me, is suggesting Jane Fonda's visit to North Vietnam was not foolish, but it was a long time ago, she has since apologized (several times) and even the POWs who met with her have repudiated the more ridiculous accounts (e.g. note passing) of her visit. Read the link I posted.

As for the photo of John Kerry, it was taken while he was part of a congressional delegation, at a time when the US government was taking steps towards establishing formal diplomatic relations with the Communist government of Vietnam (a move that was also supported by John McCain).

Very pleased indeed that you poor sods are not being launched off into

someone elses sh*t. Again.

Voted for Maggie since `79 and feel at a loss with "call me Dave".

l was shocked at the "Sun" today, with it`s warmongering. Never mind

the obituary notice of the special relationship and the dates listed of joint

operations, there was one year missing. 1982, the Falklands War.

They gave Jack S**t.

10Watt,

Don't blame all of us for how this special relationship has been going......there are far more of us who like the way it generally has been. I guess every relationship has its ups and downs and this "special one" is no different.


Broad,

I guess I will have to find a photo of him in Paris in '71 to keep you happy.

You skipped the part that said "if convicted of Treason.."....so no....no way to imply a threat....as I said....your poor grasp of English and American Law seems to be by design.

She has apologized for looking lame.....and recently said Vietnam Veterans who choose to boycott the film "Should get a life!", which doesn't strike me as being apologetic or seeking to find common ground.

Yes, the POW's did say the accusation that other POW's were beaten to death after she passed notes was untrue and that the incident did not happen. She did participate in Propaganda films and make statements in suppport of the North Vietnamese and by doing so gave aid and comfort to them during time of war.....while Americans were being mistreated by the North Vietnamese.

Spin it all you want to.....your views change nothing......and we both know the truth.....neither Kerry or Fonda are honorable people. She and Kerry went beyond the limit of correctness in their opposition to the War. They could have protested the War in an honorable way, told the truth, persuaded the American People and Politicians to end the war but done so in a manner that would have brought respect to them on their conduct. They failed grossly in that.

"They gave Jack S**t."

In public, but that is what counts.

I think from what I have read that support behind the scenes
was more forthcoming.

Enhanced Side Winders, Stinger Manpads, Intelligence, and Fuel....but as usual....a bit slow to make the decision but when it was made....some of the items arrived within Six Hours and far more within Twenty Four Hours.

Your Fleet was out of fuel upon arriving at Ascension.....until we diverted a Supertanker with fuel to top off the Fleet and on-shore tankage.

Some interesting reading here......

Significant and Surprising: American Assistance to Great Britain in the Falklands War | Graham Jenkins - Academia.edu

l wouldn`t know.

But l have read the memoirs of the Vulcan crew and seen the footage

of the burns casualties and that chappy yomping with a flag on his back.

That was for good reason.

An Arab spring ?

With one bunch of cut-throats ousted for another bunch of cut-throats ?

And why?

Oil. Money makes the world go around.

The ancient Greeks had it right, give the word for war by all means but

first kill your own first born.

That `ll settle the feckers down a bit.

10Watt, US support for the Task Force during the South Atlantic conflict was considerable, but not widely publicised.

The SAS had received 6 Stingers. The only soldier trained to use thm was killed in an aircraft accident; however, his colleagues worked out for themselves how to use the missiles and shot down a Pucara and a Super Puma before the conflict ended.

Then there was that excellent AAM, the AIM-9L...... A vast improvement on the AIM-9G (even with SEAM), the all-aspect '9 Lima' was a game-changer for the Sea Harrier and achieved exceptionally high kill:launch ratios. Most 9 Limas were supplied direct from US war stocks.

Margaret Thatcher said in her memoirs that without the Sidewinder "supplied to us by US Defence Minister Caspar Weinberger, we could never have got back the Falklands."

With regard to Jane Fonda; she was very stupid to be duped into those propaganda photos. She has since apologised, but the lunatic redneck right refuses to accept that....

....whereas mass murderers such as the despicable Lt. William Calley, of My Lai infamy, escaped censure virtually scot-free.....

CENTO was dissolved in 1979.

I was at 280SU in Cyprus when the decision to dissolve CENTO was made and a signal sent out o handle all CENTO documents at one grade above their current classification. We had several at SECRET and no means to handle or destroy TS. After an exchange of telephone calls I was told to destroy them... and date the certificate 24 hours ago.....

Yes i did see the swift boat adverts during the w re-election campaign... Yes i know there are some doubts. Just giving him a little credit for serving in a war zone.

Whatever he has allegidly done pails into insignificance compared to Assad.

Not sure economic arguement bears much fruit hear implosion of most of the semi stable middle east... Egypt, libya and syria will not do much for driving the propsects of oil based economies as the price of oil increases due to threats to suez and wider regional instability.

Well said Beagle. 10W comments about US support to us during Falklands is out of order. Clearly he did not read every chapter of Roland Whites book. He also needs to read Hutchings.

We should also be grateful for the assistance afforded by the French and others.

Back to Syria:- I am pleased Obama has decided to wait for Congress. That buys time to fully consider what to do. Also for Putin to weigh the evidence from the UN. Hopefully he will fall in line and apply pressure to Assad.

SASless (why do I read that as 'senseless'?)

I'm not going to lecture you on the post-WWII history of Viet Nam. An idiot with a history book can learn everything they need to know about American principles in the region.

Suffice to say, Ms Fonda was an intelligent young woman who supported a people and a cause entirely deserving of her support. Had the American public been similarly brave, they would have saved their country from ridicule, embarrassment. loss, shame and defeat.

As a nation you still haven't recovered from the American War. An entire generation will have to die before you do. Yet you continue to marginalise and denigrate a woman who had the sense to point out what you were doing was wrong, both from the perspective of the Vietnamese and, ultimately, from the perspective of your own country.

For that one action, Jane Fonda will be remembered far longer and with far more affection in SE Asia than anything you or your country has done since. Yes, you can park your C17's up in Noi Bai and wander around the Rex in HCMC in your uniforms, and pretend all is forgiven. And it is. But as nation or as individuals you don't have one one-hundredth of the respect accorded to an aging 75 year old actress from New York City.

ORAC, thank you. I wonder if the French read that as a cessation in their rights to use Akrotiri?

10Watt

I will add to what has already been posted by saying that the support we received went a great deal further down the line than is generally acknowledged. United States officers at all levels sometimes went out on a limb to help us and we greatly appreciated it.

You are totally wrong.

YS

Just to brighten up SASless and others' Sunday - the delectable Jane Fonda, voice of reason during the dreadful Viet Nam conflict:


Thankfully, Harold Wislon refused to agree to LBJ's call to commit the UK's armed forces.....probably because of the 1954 Geneva Conference. About the one good thing he ever did for Britain. Unlike the slimy geedubya-poodle Bliar, Wislon was at least prepared to stand up to pressure from a US president.

hanoijane - Do please make it clear that you are speaking for yourself and your very small following only, you are in no way representative any majority.

Having identified yourself as a communist sympathiser, if not a full blooded communist, you must realise that you have virtually no credibility?

I see you were born around the time the American involvement started in Vietnam, for your information the USA won the military war, it was the South Vietnamese who then threw that away.

Unfortunate that he couldn't exercise the same fortitude with Russia then BEagle, yes?

Which would you prefer?
 

An idiot with a history book, or a "useful idiot" sat upon an enemy anti-aircraft gun?

If both idiots were of the female persuasion, then I guess it would have to depend on which one has the bigger tits, but that's just a vulgar pilot taking a wild guess. Well, my wild guess, and one underpinned by Hanoi Jane's later choice of cosmetic chestal embellishment, an obvious move to curry favor with we stupid Viet Nam vets. Did we take up the offered olive branch, though? No, sadly not... it's all this yadda-yadda about "treason" and "stupidity" and "being played like a cheap violin."

"Loss, shame and defeat"? I cannot speak for SASless, but I for myself I can say that when I left, we were winning! Someone must have screwed up there, but I do not blame myself.

Parabellum, not sure what you meant there. I seem to recall that aside from the TSR2/F111 debacle he did buy F4s, Buccaneers for the RAF, C130s in pleasingly large numbers. I think he also ordered the Jaguar and the Nimrod. And maybe even the Harrier. Certainly the period 1965-1970 saw a mass of new orders for the RAF.

While he did not initiate the SSBN programme he continued with the re-equipment and deployment notwithstanding pressure from CND and within his own party.

Maybe not for nothing was Healey the self-professed Forces friend.

One could argue dispassionately the Labour, pre-1997, was better for the Services than the Tories. Even post 1997, who ordered the C17s?

HH, true, initially as a stop-gap until the A400 but they did order them (whether contract-hire or purchase). I believe that buying them was less expensive than paying the excess mileage charge that accrued :)

Remember they also bought the C130J for the same reasons.

well the C-17's were rented to start with IIRC