Il Frecce Tricolore-Ejection at Turin 16 Sept 2023
SO much utter nonsense posted on this thread!
Aircraft suffered a loss of thrust at a critical time; pilot ejected. Sadly the aircraft subsequently struck a car with fatal consequences.
Aircraft suffered a loss of thrust at a critical time; pilot ejected. Sadly the aircraft subsequently struck a car with fatal consequences.
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A few years back the Blue Angels lost an aircraft in Smyrna, Tennessee while practicing for the upcoming airshow. Smyrna airport is pretty much surrounded by built up areas.
The difference is that the pilot of that aircraft chose to stay in the jet so he could point it where it would do the least damage. Just sayin'.....
RIP Capt Kuss
The difference is that the pilot of that aircraft chose to stay in the jet so he could point it where it would do the least damage. Just sayin'.....
RIP Capt Kuss
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A Snowbird aircraft had a birdstrike, Western Tanager, departing Kamloops towards a residential area. The passenger did not survive ejection and the pilot was seriously injured. I believe the ejection seats were replaced.
Globe and Mail
Globe and Mail
aircraft involved do need to be suitable for the likely conditions - and that must include possible bird strikes
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Temporarily operating from Torino/Caselle because the nearby Torino/Agnelli was to be the venue for today's display to mark the 100th anniversary of the Italian AF (which will not now happen).
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A quick look at Google Maps confirms this as being the north end of the runway at Turin airport (TRN-LIMF).As seen in the photo, the aircraft after having impacted the car, came to rest at the edge of the field, stopping only 450 feet (roughly 140 metres) short of a group of houses.Tragic as this is, makes one wonder how very different the outcome could have been.
Aplologies as I cannot post urls/images yet.
Turin airport will remain closed until 24.00 of September 17.
Aplologies as I cannot post urls/images yet.
Turin airport will remain closed until 24.00 of September 17.
Staying with an aircraft is all very commendable but I suggest maybe just a fanciful idea. Once you get to the point it's time to eject most likely the aircraft is coming down in that spot whether you are in it or not.
Once you go below minimum control you are not going to influence that outcome. Best to pull the handle and hope for the best.
It's clear in this instance that the pilot lost the engine at the worst possible time. Low and slow. He had just few seconds to react and save himself. He could not predict the aircraft would hit the car even if he could see it. Most likely when he pulled the handle the road was clear.
Just one of those things.
Once you go below minimum control you are not going to influence that outcome. Best to pull the handle and hope for the best.
It's clear in this instance that the pilot lost the engine at the worst possible time. Low and slow. He had just few seconds to react and save himself. He could not predict the aircraft would hit the car even if he could see it. Most likely when he pulled the handle the road was clear.
Just one of those things.
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The only potential relevance of this being a display team is that it MAY have involved a formation take off. If so then they MAY have lined up further down the runway and potentially used less than full power for take off, thus moving the crash site position. To my eye the aircraft looked way too low energy to have got airbourne then joined up to fly through. Had that been the case then a zoom climb to force landing attempt or at least a higher ejection would probably have ensued.
RWY 36 TODA is 3750 m. In this case, I wouldn‘t during normal operations expect a light jet to crash through the fence at the far end. In other words, I wonder whether one could/should put a question mark on an airshow-style take-off (all of the aircraft seem to very low) from an airport during normal operations, where corresponding precautions have not been taken (such as stopping traffic on the crossing road).
Double standards
Is it because the aircraft in question is Italian that we are allowing more latitude for people to spout absolute horsesh1t?!
Every single engine jet in history has had a ‘dead zone’ on every take off it has ever done (unless taking off from a ludicrously long runway). There will be a period where an engine failure will leave ejection as the only option. Not enough runway to land back on, and not enough energy to make it back to an alternate landing surface.
If, as the video suggests, this was an engine failure at low altitude (bird strike seems a very likely reason) there was absolutely nothing the pilot could do. If he’d stayed with the aircraft he would be another fatality. He couldn’t have steered it anywhere.
If we are looking to blame the age and type of aircraft then you probably need to scrap every Hawk and F16 (and most training aircraft) in the world as well.
This accident is simply a case of desperately bad luck and timing with a tragic outcome.
BV
Every single engine jet in history has had a ‘dead zone’ on every take off it has ever done (unless taking off from a ludicrously long runway). There will be a period where an engine failure will leave ejection as the only option. Not enough runway to land back on, and not enough energy to make it back to an alternate landing surface.
If, as the video suggests, this was an engine failure at low altitude (bird strike seems a very likely reason) there was absolutely nothing the pilot could do. If he’d stayed with the aircraft he would be another fatality. He couldn’t have steered it anywhere.
If we are looking to blame the age and type of aircraft then you probably need to scrap every Hawk and F16 (and most training aircraft) in the world as well.
This accident is simply a case of desperately bad luck and timing with a tragic outcome.
BV
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RWY 36 TODA is 3750 m. In this case, I wouldn‘t during normal operations expect a light jet to crash through the fence at the far end. In other words, I wonder whether one could/should put a question mark on an airshow-style take-off (all of the aircraft seem to very low) from an airport during normal operations, where corresponding precautions have not been taken (such as stopping traffic on the crossing road).
Staying with an aircraft is all very commendable but I suggest maybe just a fanciful idea. Once you get to the point it's time to eject most likely the aircraft is coming down in that spot whether you are in it or not.
Once you go below minimum control you are not going to influence that outcome. Best to pull the handle and hope for the best.
It's clear in this instance that the pilot lost the engine at the worst possible time. Low and slow. He had just few seconds to react and save himself. He could not predict the aircraft would hit the car even if he could see it. Most likely when he pulled the handle the road was clear.
Just one of those things.
Once you go below minimum control you are not going to influence that outcome. Best to pull the handle and hope for the best.
It's clear in this instance that the pilot lost the engine at the worst possible time. Low and slow. He had just few seconds to react and save himself. He could not predict the aircraft would hit the car even if he could see it. Most likely when he pulled the handle the road was clear.
Just one of those things.
Sadly, it was just one of those things.
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Terribly tragic accident - heartfelt condolences to the parents and family of the poor child who was killed in the ensuing accident...and my thoughts go to the team as well...they must be feeling absolutely terrible...nobody's fault..."fate is the hunter"...
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Be interesting to understand what sort of bird caused the failure. You would think a jet engine could withstand say a Pidgeon impact. Are the engines really that frail?
A few years back the Blue Angels lost an aircraft in Smyrna, Tennessee while practicing for the upcoming airshow. Smyrna airport is pretty much surrounded by built up areas.
The difference is that the pilot of that aircraft chose to stay in the jet so he could point it where it would do the least damage. Just sayin'.....
RIP Capt Kuss
The difference is that the pilot of that aircraft chose to stay in the jet so he could point it where it would do the least damage. Just sayin'.....
RIP Capt Kuss
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RWY 36 TODA is 3750 m. In this case, I wouldn‘t during normal operations expect a light jet to crash through the fence at the far end. In other words, I wonder whether one could/should put a question mark on an airshow-style take-off (all of the aircraft seem to very low) from an airport during normal operations, where corresponding precautions have not been taken (such as stopping traffic on the crossing road).
Pretty sure that birds are more likely to get out of the way of a flock of jets than just one, if anything, but they still get strikes. Birds forget to give way to jumbo jets, so just not sure that there is much to debate about added birdstrike risk from a formation takeoff. These guys had a fair amount of energy already, but not sufficient to allow a turn back, and there was no great choices remaining. The decision speed for an turn back is dependent on the runway geometry (the minimum height loss/energy loss to reposition to a runway). A 180, would have a decision speed somewhere near 180 kts with a low drag index. It can be possible to do the turn below that, but not much less for a straight winged jet like a 326, 339, SMR, SOKO, L-28, IS-2, S-211 etc. The L-39 will need a bit higher speed, a Fouga, a little less. Even with routine practice, it is a high risk event.
Traffic stoplights might be a response, but there can be a fair spread laterally on the trajectory of an abandoned aircraft or an aircraft that needs to be abandoned. Consider the Red Arrows ATB practice out of Valley, where it didn't work out but the wreckage missed all 3rd parties. Being near any airport comes with a slightly elevated risk.
If a bird is a problem on a fan blade or compressor and is considered to be "frail.... ", try catching a piece of 80gm plain paper with a tail rotor blade of a Robbie.
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The video linked in the very first post was shot from the road running along the eastern and then northern edge of the airfield (the same road the victims were driving along).