Royal New Zealand Navy
Of course they can, they have 5 hardpoints in the internal bomb bay and 6 wing hardpoints. The orions they have and are retiring before the end of the year have MK46's torpedos, maveric's and harpoons for the P-3 so assume the a P-8 will be getting them
(edit apparently NZ uses penguins and not harpoons)
(edit apparently NZ uses penguins and not harpoons)
“…diversity and inclusion are critical to our success as an organisation, as are the unique traditions and characteristics of the RNZN…”
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-z...20to%20do%20so.
I was referring to Jim Jennings firing a 20mm warning shot or two across the bows of a Taiwanese squid boat that was fishing illegally in 1976.
https://theaviationgeekclub.com/roya...rs-of-service/
Zero Six is now at MOTAT in Auckland.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/5875...iconic-Skyhawk
The RNZN are on their 3rd (and last) set of Seasprites - the photo is of a pair of the 2nd set of airframes.
Rumour is Wildcat is favorite to replace them - assuming they still have ships to put helicopters on!
This discussion reminds me of "The Mouse That Roared".
To be fair they do sterling work around the smaller island nations of the Pacific
Guess the kiwis are serious about fisheries protection if they’re planning on torpedoing an over quota fishing boat.
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Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Thread Starter
https://www.defensenews.com/naval/20...ip-shortfalls/
How the New Zealand Navy plans to fix its sailor and ship shortfalls
How the New Zealand Navy plans to fix its sailor and ship shortfalls
With regard to recruitment and retention problems I feel New Zealand as a whole has been hoisted by its own petard.
Prior to the COVID fiasco NZ operated a punitive immigration system biased towards Oz, the pacific islands and China. I have members of my family who have lived and worked in NZ for over 20 years, about 5 years ago I attempted the move myself. At the time I held qualifications in marine engineering and was employed as a senior engineering superintendent, I was offered a post working with the Auckland Harbour authorities and another as a marine diesel trouble shooter/travelling spanner. Both employers asked that I first confirm my status with NZ immigration vis a vis qualifications, family status, criminal record, and age; this latter point proved to be my downfall. Having turned 50 I was told I would never be eligible for any form of residency and the posts would only be offered on a rolling two year work permit basis with me having to prove my suitability and progression at each renewal point. If I resigned or moved to another post I would be required to leave the country and apply anew. This was the first time I had experienced discrimination and it left a sour taste.
Perhaps I'm being churlish but I feel, certainly in my case, that NZ's age related discriminatory policies have led to their current shortage of suitably qualified people across their whole workforce.
I may be coaxed out of retirement, but it will be on my terms now, NZ missed their chance and I feel little pity for their plight.
Prior to the COVID fiasco NZ operated a punitive immigration system biased towards Oz, the pacific islands and China. I have members of my family who have lived and worked in NZ for over 20 years, about 5 years ago I attempted the move myself. At the time I held qualifications in marine engineering and was employed as a senior engineering superintendent, I was offered a post working with the Auckland Harbour authorities and another as a marine diesel trouble shooter/travelling spanner. Both employers asked that I first confirm my status with NZ immigration vis a vis qualifications, family status, criminal record, and age; this latter point proved to be my downfall. Having turned 50 I was told I would never be eligible for any form of residency and the posts would only be offered on a rolling two year work permit basis with me having to prove my suitability and progression at each renewal point. If I resigned or moved to another post I would be required to leave the country and apply anew. This was the first time I had experienced discrimination and it left a sour taste.
Perhaps I'm being churlish but I feel, certainly in my case, that NZ's age related discriminatory policies have led to their current shortage of suitably qualified people across their whole workforce.
I may be coaxed out of retirement, but it will be on my terms now, NZ missed their chance and I feel little pity for their plight.
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Possibly, I'm well-placed to comment on some of NZ's strategic interests and challenges. I trained with the current NZ CDF and CAF; was on 5 Sqn (P3s); served in a research capacity with the RNZN; and then spent over two decades with the RAF, but mainly in MOD and with other departments. Over these years I also had many professional encounters with NZ, and travelled out there on to work trips, as well. I was also back in NZ recently and met with colleagues who are still serving in both uniformed and civilian capacities.
There is a dichotomy in NZ. Pre-pandemic, Kiwis were inveterate travellers - there were very few corners in the world where you wouldn't see - and hear - Kiwis. Indeed, the OE ('Overseas Experience') is still regarded s a Rite of Passage for middle-class New Zealanders. However, and in spite of this Globe-Trotting, New Zealanders can be surprisingly naďve about the wider world, especially threats and challenges.
New Zealand is in a benign part of the world - with no immediate, existential threats. Accordingly, the immediate need for large, well-equipped and expensive armed forces is difficult to justify. Kiwi social media is full of "why are we getting involved in Ukraine/China/Middle East etc?" as if the country lives in some self-supporting, self-perpetuating haven of peace and plenty.
However, NZ's trading interests are global and are increasingly focussed on the Middle East and Far East. Not only are these markets sometimes challenging and unstable, goods and services have to pass through these areas of instability. The vulnerability of NZ's lines of communication is nothing new: a cursory read of the impact of commerce raiders, submarine warfare and mining (in domestic waters) in both World Wars demonstrates this and strategically and technologically, nothing has changed. Geography doesn't change, but ignorance does.
Recognising this, repeatedly over the last 120 years the New Zealand Government has committed forces to be part of a much larger coalition, initially as part of an Imperial commitments then increasingly in coalition with the US and supporting NATO or peacekeeping with the UN. This keeps the skill sets alive and enhances interoperability and shows NZ has 'skin in the game'. Increasingly, however, NZ is tip-toeing around China's strategic ambitions (because of economic consequences) and domestically, politics is driven by culture wars and identity politics. There seems little capacity to engage - and want to engage - on international issues with the exception of Climate Change. And before someone goes 'Full Gammon', NZ's AOI encompasses a number of nations already being affected by changing sea levels, and the instability that this can cause.
Whilst the causes for personnel shortages in the RNZN are varied and many, NZG should consider lessons from the past and stress that NZDF, including the RNZN, has a global remit as part of like-minded coalitions - which might include warfighting. The government should not only publicise this, but also be prepared to fund it on a long-term basis and celebrate this (eg the P-8 and C130 acquisitions). NZ personnel have an enviable record of superb performance on every battlefield - in every theatre they have fought. Equally they have a reputation for speedy humanitarian disaster response across the Indo-Pacific basin, The Government should not shy away from embracing these capabilities.
As an aside, I was shocked to read that during 2022, in Term 2, only 40% of school children regularly attended school. At the same time, levels of children's literacy continues to fall. Out of 41 OECD countries, NZ is 35th in terms of child well-being: amongst other social indices NZ has the second highest obesity rate in the OECD. More than 1 in 3 children are obese or overweight. Meanwhile only 64.6% of 15 year olds in New Zealand have basic proficiency in reading and maths. This will inevitably impact on students taking up STEM subjects and therefore recruitment into STEM industries, including within the forces. Whichever government is in power, it needs to focus on the quality and content of education to tertiary level (and not on alternative reality fairy stories and mythologies).
There is no excuse for NZ being a third world country, given the bountiful natural and human resources.
There is a dichotomy in NZ. Pre-pandemic, Kiwis were inveterate travellers - there were very few corners in the world where you wouldn't see - and hear - Kiwis. Indeed, the OE ('Overseas Experience') is still regarded s a Rite of Passage for middle-class New Zealanders. However, and in spite of this Globe-Trotting, New Zealanders can be surprisingly naďve about the wider world, especially threats and challenges.
New Zealand is in a benign part of the world - with no immediate, existential threats. Accordingly, the immediate need for large, well-equipped and expensive armed forces is difficult to justify. Kiwi social media is full of "why are we getting involved in Ukraine/China/Middle East etc?" as if the country lives in some self-supporting, self-perpetuating haven of peace and plenty.
However, NZ's trading interests are global and are increasingly focussed on the Middle East and Far East. Not only are these markets sometimes challenging and unstable, goods and services have to pass through these areas of instability. The vulnerability of NZ's lines of communication is nothing new: a cursory read of the impact of commerce raiders, submarine warfare and mining (in domestic waters) in both World Wars demonstrates this and strategically and technologically, nothing has changed. Geography doesn't change, but ignorance does.
Recognising this, repeatedly over the last 120 years the New Zealand Government has committed forces to be part of a much larger coalition, initially as part of an Imperial commitments then increasingly in coalition with the US and supporting NATO or peacekeeping with the UN. This keeps the skill sets alive and enhances interoperability and shows NZ has 'skin in the game'. Increasingly, however, NZ is tip-toeing around China's strategic ambitions (because of economic consequences) and domestically, politics is driven by culture wars and identity politics. There seems little capacity to engage - and want to engage - on international issues with the exception of Climate Change. And before someone goes 'Full Gammon', NZ's AOI encompasses a number of nations already being affected by changing sea levels, and the instability that this can cause.
Whilst the causes for personnel shortages in the RNZN are varied and many, NZG should consider lessons from the past and stress that NZDF, including the RNZN, has a global remit as part of like-minded coalitions - which might include warfighting. The government should not only publicise this, but also be prepared to fund it on a long-term basis and celebrate this (eg the P-8 and C130 acquisitions). NZ personnel have an enviable record of superb performance on every battlefield - in every theatre they have fought. Equally they have a reputation for speedy humanitarian disaster response across the Indo-Pacific basin, The Government should not shy away from embracing these capabilities.
As an aside, I was shocked to read that during 2022, in Term 2, only 40% of school children regularly attended school. At the same time, levels of children's literacy continues to fall. Out of 41 OECD countries, NZ is 35th in terms of child well-being: amongst other social indices NZ has the second highest obesity rate in the OECD. More than 1 in 3 children are obese or overweight. Meanwhile only 64.6% of 15 year olds in New Zealand have basic proficiency in reading and maths. This will inevitably impact on students taking up STEM subjects and therefore recruitment into STEM industries, including within the forces. Whichever government is in power, it needs to focus on the quality and content of education to tertiary level (and not on alternative reality fairy stories and mythologies).
There is no excuse for NZ being a third world country, given the bountiful natural and human resources.
Last edited by Whenurhappy; 6th Jan 2023 at 10:33.
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". Having a third of the fleet alongside is certainly less than ideal."
Isn't that common in the RN and USN?
Isn't that common in the RN and USN?
" I was shocked to read that during 2022, in Term 2, only 40% of school children regularly attended school."
having spent some time in '22 in Auckland it doesn't surprise me - they were still very much in lockdown mode as late as September with relatively few people out and about. About a year behind W Europe I'd say. The University campus was very sparely inhabited for example
having spent some time in '22 in Auckland it doesn't surprise me - they were still very much in lockdown mode as late as September with relatively few people out and about. About a year behind W Europe I'd say. The University campus was very sparely inhabited for example
After fruitlessly searching for a USN Squadron with an albatross badge, I eventually discovered this was an RNZAF 5 Squadron aircraft, a long way from home and presumably operating from Singapore, Malaysia or the Philippines.
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" I was shocked to read that during 2022, in Term 2, only 40% of school children regularly attended school."
having spent some time in '22 in Auckland it doesn't surprise me - they were still very much in lockdown mode as late as September with relatively few people out and about. About a year behind W Europe I'd say. The University campus was very sparely inhabited for example
having spent some time in '22 in Auckland it doesn't surprise me - they were still very much in lockdown mode as late as September with relatively few people out and about. About a year behind W Europe I'd say. The University campus was very sparely inhabited for example
Attendance remains low and there is no compulsion on parents to send kids to school, and for those kids to stay there, sadly. One thing that struck me particularly in NZ is the growth of the 'Anti-science' lobby, fuelled by the Anti-vaxx movement, and this conflates with the requirement for educational institutions to teach 'Maori science' and myth as fact and as an adjunct to evidence-based science.
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Austrailia first might come back and bite them on the bum.
Far from standing with them I think NZ is now reluctant to even hold Australia's hat and coat when Aussie might go off and fight.