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UK F-35B Lost

Old 17th Nov 2021, 20:06
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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How tolerant is the F35 to swallowing birds or other FOD ?
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Old 17th Nov 2021, 20:11
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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I hear itís a WAFU who is even more so now! At least the Mk 16 Martin Baker let down system worked as advertised
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Old 17th Nov 2021, 20:13
  #23 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by silverelise View Post
How tolerant is the F35 to swallowing birds or other FOD ?
Probably more tolerant than it is to swallowing sea water!
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Old 17th Nov 2021, 21:25
  #24 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by BEagle View Post
Good to know that the pilot has been safely rescued. But an accident shortly after take-off and a statement that flights are continuiung nevertheless is pretty significant?
No need to ground the other embarked types?
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Old 17th Nov 2021, 23:34
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by RAFEngO74to09 View Post
According to Defence Sec - ditched soon after take-off.

https://www.forces.net/news/hms-quee...-mediterranean
How very considerate and helpful of the Defence Secretary to announce roughly where the aircraft came down. That means if you were thinking about salvage, analysis and reverse engineering, you could start looking in the right place if you know where the QE was at the time (AIS plus radar x-section = Yorkshire should do it). I would like to applaud his contribution to the security of the F-35 capability. But I can't. Presumably he will follow the line he has taken with others who have inadvertently breached security and sack himself.
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Old 17th Nov 2021, 23:52
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Unless the time of the occurrence has been released, then knowing it was near the ship doesn't really help.

Moreover the ejection will have automatically activated the pilot's personal locator beacon, and as the Russians are part of COSPAS/SARSAT, they'll have a pretty good handle on the location as a result. One imagines there will be ships monitoring the site until a salvage capability arrives; they would also be a bit of a giveaway.
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 00:08
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by NutLoose View Post
Good to hear, I take a major recovery is in operation? As there will be more than one interested party in it.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-59323895
Award for the Understatement Of The Year NutLoose.
Under-surface traffic will be having a Ping Fest/ Safety's OFF until that bird is safely back onboard.
Anyone trying it on fully deserves to be imploded.



Last edited by Auxtank; 18th Nov 2021 at 00:25.
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 00:25
  #28 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Easy Street View Post
Unless the time of the occurrence has been released, then knowing it was near the ship doesn't really help.

Moreover the ejection will have automatically activated the pilot's personal locator beacon, and as the Russians are part of COSPAS/SARSAT, they'll have a pretty good handle on the location as a result. One imagines there will be ships monitoring the site until a salvage capability arrives; they would also be a bit of a giveaway.
Quite, but there is a big difference between an ejection at 30,000 ft and one at 30ft in where the aircraft impacts and how far it travels thereafter. COSPAS/SARSAT might have provided an indication of the point of seat separation, but that is all. As for the expected overwatch, some of that may be sub-surface (we won't know) and surface vessels are unlikely to be directly over the site. The point is that Wallace - or whoever briefed on his behalf - has removed much of the ambiguity that would have been helpful in delaying the efforts of other 'interested parties' to locate the wreckage.
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 06:34
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Easy Street View Post
Unless the time of the occurrence has been released, then knowing it was near the ship doesn't really help.

Moreover the ejection will have automatically activated the pilot's personal locator beacon, and as the Russians are part of COSPAS/SARSAT, they'll have a pretty good handle on the location as a result. One imagines there will be ships monitoring the site until a salvage capability arrives; they would also be a bit of a giveaway.
10am, doesn't say the time zone, but UK would be a good guess. I would think the ship will be transponding its position and be a visible track and time. Shown on the internet sites, that do this. They have divers securing the site.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-new...sians-25485673
It is believed the pilot is recovering and back on the ship following the crash which happened at 10am on Wednesday.
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 06:36
  #30 (permalink)  
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
 
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I think the Russians will have been monitoring the TF location closely and will be more than aware of where the ejection occurred without having to delve into the minister’s statement.

I would imagine the Kildin was still trailing along……

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/202...rare-sighting/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vishny...elligence_ship


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Old 18th Nov 2021, 09:51
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by silverelise View Post
How tolerant is the F35 to swallowing birds or other FOD ?
A 2009 LM presentation Birdstrike Certification Tests of F-35 Canopy and Airframe Structure 'Approved for Public Release' can be found here https://www.f-16.net/forum/download/file.php?id=13106 how much you wish to rely on its accuracy is up to you.

Israel said damage to an F-35I in September 2017 was caused by a birdstrike, storks according to some sources. This was the same day Syrian and pro-Russian claimed an F-35I was hit by an S-200 aka SA-5 Gammon which Israel denies.

A 'Class A' ( $2 million+ damage cost) incident involving a VMFA-121 F-35B attempting to take off from MCAS Iwakuni on 07 may 2019 was caused by a birdstrike, the 1st MAW spokesman (male) said '... The aircraft never went airborne,..' and was able to taxy 'off the runway'.
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 10:19
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Some comedy speculations on the chat I see, systems are not likely to be running with 50M+ of sea water on them! So bar some passive surveillance and pinging off structure they would not be getting anything very exciting back that had not been previously visible from a view from an airshow or embarkation. An ECM blanket I suspect would be in place and therefore I do not think any Bond movies are going to be re enacted anytime soon irrelevant of giving away location of aircraft, which will be recovered pretty smartish (pending depth) and have overwatch on site anyway.
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 12:12
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by verticalflyer View Post
Some comedy speculations on the chat I see, systems are not likely to be running with 50M+ of sea water on them! So bar some passive surveillance and pinging off structure they would not be getting anything very exciting back that had not been previously visible from a view from an airshow or embarkation.
I'm not sure what comedy speculations you are referring to, as nobody has been suggesting any transmissions other than from the pilot's PLB and surface traffic (the QE and other large SVs will be transmitting AIS info, as it is required). Airshows/embarkation etc tend to show the aircraft external surfaces only and it would indeed be a comedy speculation to imagine the low-observable package remained intact on water entry.
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 15:13
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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If anyone here is still concerned about “someone” being capable to locate the wreckage, the sonar locator in the ADR will be a big clue. Unless, of course, it has a special stealth version that can’t be detected. But…
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 15:22
  #35 (permalink)  
 
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Where you been, Courtney?!
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 15:27
  #36 (permalink)  
 
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If the wreckage is in the deeper parts of the Med, the 37.5khz pinger will not be detected on the surface.
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 16:40
  #37 (permalink)  
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Well the average depth is 5000ft, plummeting to 17,000ft in the Calypso Basin.
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 17:23
  #38 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
Well the average depth is 5000ft, plummeting to 17,000ft in the Calypso Basin.
But he fought the controls to avoid the school and old people's home!

CG
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 17:36
  #39 (permalink)  
 
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James Cameron's phone will be ringing off the hook!
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Old 18th Nov 2021, 18:32
  #40 (permalink)  
 
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If the aircraft ditched in international waters and the Ruskies happened to find it first is it salvage?
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