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Turkey coup?

Old 25th May 2018, 12:02
  #141 (permalink)  
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I think Turkey will end being treated the same. As to the comparison - they can all spend their money in the UK, where they buy assets they can’t take away. Tourism is not a major industry in any of the other nations you cite.

As for access to high tech arms, I will watch with interest the progress of the bill presently going through Congress. Already approved by the House and apparently sailing through the Senate....

https://ahvalnews.com/us-turkey/turk...-bar-f-35-sale

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Old 25th May 2018, 12:19
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Originally Posted by A_Van
If it's all about human rights issue (suppressed by Erdogan, no doubt), then for consistency similar actions should be taken towards other similar regimes. And compared with Qatar, Saudi Arabia and even UAE, Erdogan & Co. are ultra-liberals So, what about stop buying in Harrods in London (owned by a Qatari royal family, who, BTW, were planning to remove the Diana's statue out of the building this spring)? What about boycotting football matches of Manchester City (owned by a guy from UAE) or Sheffield United (a Saudi prince) or PSG (a guy from Qatar)?
Turkey is not a major oil & gas producer Van - makes all the difference
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Old 25th May 2018, 16:06
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Russia is sniffing in the wings
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Old 25th May 2018, 16:36
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Originally Posted by rog747
Russia is sniffing in the wings
well they are neighbours.............. I'd be amazed if the Russians didn't sense the opportunity - Turkey has been a thorn in their side (and vice versa) for centuries
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Old 25th May 2018, 19:30
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Originally Posted by t43562
Turkey, which is where I am now, and the words "militant Islam" are a ridiculous combination. I wonder if I can be bothered to say any more really. Turks are divided and the split is almost exactly similar in character to the splits you get in countries like the UK right now or in America with the Trump supporters - it's about the fight between classes and the issues are just the weapons being used. Reasons and logic don't work because it's a sort of tribal battle not an issues battle (exactly like in the west). A bunch of conservative ex-country-bumpkins elect people who talk about religion and all the things they like and city snowflake liberals can bugger off kind of thing. Nobody has to behave consistently as long as they shout out "down with Israel" loudly they can get away with doing deals with Israel in private, drinking beer and getting on with their dodgy property deals.
That may well be a quick off the cuff assesement that may satisfy some but Turkey is a predominantly Muslim nation that since 1920 under Ataturk attempted to adopt a democratic tradition and government and become bridge between a democratic West and Islamic East. Together with this strategy Turkey joined NATO in 1951 together with an ancient enemy Greece and is so doing managed to cement better ties with Europe and the US and has had the support of much of the population.

However, in 2001 a party with Islamist roots, the Adalet ve Kalkinma Partisi (AKP) managed to take power, and from then a very discernible political shift has been taking place. Subsequent changes in Turkey’s domestic and foreign policy have led many to feel that Turkey is now moving away from secularism and more to becoming an Islamist state like its former Ottoman roots.

Islamic principles, in relation to governance, provide clues as to why they might seek changes to the secular nature of its government and further incorporate Islamic practices. When Turkey’s present domestic and foreign policies are examined there is a similarity to Islamic revolutions in Iran and Afghanistan that can be see as possible examples of the evolution of Islamic movements and possibly the present situation as a retreat from the West and an attempted revival of Turkey's Islamic heritage by ‘possibly' a majority of the population

Turkey has become very much more proactive in its region, some of it’s recent behaviour, leanings towards Russia together with the perceived current Islamic revival and degraded democratic, moderate values has concerned both European and the US, hence the present situation and discussion over the F-35.
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Old 26th May 2018, 04:35
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It's by no.means certain that Erdoğan will win the next round of elections. Turkey is still a democracy. But it's not helped by silly, unsubstantiated and mendacious articles such as the Times one claiming that the Special Operations Police now work for him, alongside the Jandarma. This story is completely false.

What we should be focussing on is the bills passing through Congress which will deny Turkey military technologies - including the F35 - and Will, as a result, boost Erdoğan's votes and drive a wedges between Turkey and the West.
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Old 26th May 2018, 05:05
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In 2013 Jordan’s King Abdullah reported in an interview that, during a conversation, Erogan had said to him that democracy was like a bus; he would ride it to the destination he wanted and,once there, he would get off.

It would appear that he’s reached his stop......

Hurriyet: Erdo?an plans a radical restructuring of the Turkish state

Erdoğan plans a radical restructuring of the Turkish state

President Tayyip Erdoğan’s plans to reduce the number of ministries if elected seems to aim beyond simply cutting the spending of the huge bureaucratic machine of Turkey. The reporting of Hürriyet’s Nuray Babacan about a planned reduction in the number of ministries to 14 (with at most four deputy presidents) if Erdoğan is re-elected in snap elections on June 24 - or on July 8 if a second round is needed – seem to aim for a radical restructuring of the Turkish state apparatus, according to evaluations in Ankara’s political circles.

The framework of this restructuring is the April 2017 referendum transferring all executive powers to the president, who will also be given additional influence on the judiciary (such as the appointment of more judges to the Constitutional Court) and the parliament (such as enabling the president to keep the party chairmanship post).........

The biggest difference in the new system will be the lack of a prime minister, whether Erdoğan or some other candidate is elected. The president will form the cabinet and the cabinet will not need a vote of confidence in parliament. Another major change, which has already gone into effect, is that the chief of general staff and the head of the National Intelligence Agency (MİT) will directly report to the president as the commander in chief (they used to report to the prime minister)......

The logic behind this radical restructuring is the centralization of all political decisions in presidential hands. The president will serve as head of the cabinet, which will be made up of ministers who are not members of parliament. If the president wants a certain name to be a member of his (or her) cabinet, then his or her membership of parliament will be lifted. The fundamental message is that there will be only one voice as the political decision-making mechanism: The president.........

Erdoğan had actually signaled this kind of restructuring during the referendum campaign. He denied that it would mean “one-man rule,” instead claiming it will simply speed up decision-making mechanisms and increase the efficiency of the bureaucracy and the economy.




Last edited by ORAC; 26th May 2018 at 05:20.
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Old 27th May 2018, 17:14
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Turkey has threatened to ‘retaliate’ if they do not get the F-35.
https://sputniknews.com/world/201805...buy-russia-us/

Oh dear!!!

Now that is very worrying news. (Really??)

Perhaps they can take over where India pulled out?
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Old 27th May 2018, 17:18
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Originally Posted by Whenurhappy
It's by no.means certain that Erdoğan will win the next round of elections. Turkey is still a democracy. But it's not helped by silly, unsubstantiated and mendacious articles such as the Times one claiming that the Special Operations Police now work for him, alongside the Jandarma. This story is completely false.

What we should be focussing on is the bills passing through Congress which will deny Turkey military technologies - including the F35 - and Will, as a result, boost Erdoğan's votes and drive a wedges between Turkey and the West.
Erdogan seems to be fully capable of driving the present wedges created by him quite deep enough to do that job.

As for speeding up the decision making progress he is spot on. It most certainly will and is generally called ‘Dictatorship!!'
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Old 27th May 2018, 17:18
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Originally Posted by Brat
Turkey has threatened to ‘retaliate’ if they do not get the F-35.
https://sputniknews.com/world/201805...buy-russia-us/

Oh dear!!!

Now that is very worrying news. (Really??)
Practically they'd be cutting of their nose to spite their face but a continued Turkish drift towards Russia and away from NATO is very worrying - just recolour the map with Turkey as "neutral" and see how it complicates life in the E Med and Middle East for operations never mind politics
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Old 28th May 2018, 00:10
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The way it has been behaving recently is becoming less like an ally and more like a neutral by the day.
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Old 28th May 2018, 07:19
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Originally Posted by Brat
The way it has been behaving recently is becoming less like an ally and more like a neutral by the day.
I know..................... not good for them and not good for us................................
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Old 28th May 2018, 08:41
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A point that seems sadly elusive to Erdogan.
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Old 5th Jun 2018, 19:10
  #154 (permalink)  
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The Times: We will hunt down ‘coup plotters’ in Greece, warns Ankara

Turkey has vowed to find and seize eight soldiers who it says helped to organise a failed military coup to try and overthrow President Erdogan before they fled to Greece. Bekir Bozdag, Turkey’s government spokesman, said it was a “duty to hunt them down and bundle them” back home after Greek courts freed them to stay in the country.

The men — two majors, four captains and two sergeants — hijacked a military helicopter to escape from Turkey days after the botched coup in 2016, and Ankara wanted them extradited as fugitives. One has been granted asylum, and the others have applied. Turkey has ruthlessly purged coup plotters and anyone suspected of aiding or abetting them. Its agents snatched six Turkish citizens from Kosovo last month, taking them back to Ankara where they now face trials on charges of conspiring against the government of President Erdogan.

The threat to find and seize the Turkish fugitives in Greece follows the freeing of the last of the men after an 18-month holding order expired late on Monday. Four others were released following court orders last month. Details of the men’s whereabouts remain secret but their lawyers told The Times they were under heavy police protection.

The case has led to a sharp deterioration in relations between the two neighbouring states. “We’re not afraid of Turkey,” said Nikos Kotzias, the foreign minister. “We remain vigilant of its every move and intention, reviewing and evaluating constantly. We will continue to respond in line with what best serves Greece’s interests.”

Other Greek politicians were less diplomatic. Christos Simorelis, of the ruling Syriza party, said: “Rest assured that if they dare take to such a stunt we will break their hands.”

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Old 6th Jun 2018, 18:02
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Turkey escalates row with Greece over 'putschist' soldiers
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...chist-soldiers

Turkey has sent fighter jets roaring into Greek airspace as tensions mount between the two neighbours following the release from pre-trial detention of eight Turkish army officers described as traitors by Ankara
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Old 2nd Aug 2018, 05:36
  #156 (permalink)  
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https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/u...nson-qndll6hpk

US issues sanctions over jailed pastor Andrew Brunson

The US imposed financial sanctions on Turkey’s justice and interior ministers yesterday for detaining an American pastor accused of backing a coup attempt against President Erdogan.

In an extraordinary move directed at government officials of a fellow Nato country, the Treasury is freezing US assets belonging to Abdulhamit Gul, the justice minister, and Suleyman Soylu, the interior minister. The US blames them for the arrest and imprisonment of Andrew Brunson, who led a Protestant church in the city of Izmir. Mr Brunson is accused of aiding plotters of an attempted coup in 2016. If convicted, he faces up to 35 years in jail. He was put under house arrest last month after two years in prison in Turkey.

“Pastor Brunson’s unjust detention and continued prosecution by Turkish officials is simply unacceptable,” Steve Mnuchin, the US Treasury secretary, said. The Treasury notice states that Mr Gul and Mr Soylu are being sanctioned “as leaders of Turkish government organisations responsible for implementing Turkey’s serious human rights abuses”.

The White House disclosed that Mr Trump had spoken directly to President Erdogan about the detention and has previously threatened sanctions if Mr Brunson is not released. However, Mr Erdogan accused Washington yesterday of showing an “evangelist, Zionist mentality” and vowed not to give in to ultimatums from the US. “We will not give any credit to this type of threatening language,” Mr Erdogan told reporters in Ankara.

Last night Turkey’s foreign ministry called Washington’s action a “hostile stance” and said that it would retaliate.

Mr Brunson has denied the accusations. His next hearing is on October 12.

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Old 9th Aug 2018, 20:20
  #157 (permalink)  
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https://www.newsweek.com/turkey-want...-group-1065017

TURKEY WANTS TO ARREST AMERICAN TROOPS FOR TIES TO 'TERRORIST GROUP


Turkish lawyers are trying to arrest a group of American soldiers based in Turkey for alleged links to a terrorist group, amid an ongoing souring of relationships between Washington and Ankara. The pro-government lawyers have filed complaints against almost a dozen personnel at the Incirlik Air Base on the country’s southern coast, Stars and Stripes reported.

The 60-page complaint was issued by the Association for Social Justice and Aid, known to be supportive of Turkey’s President Recep Tayyip Erdogan. The document requested a temporary freeze on flights leaving the base—which is home to thousands of Americans—and a search warrant to allow investigators access. The group alleges the 11 soldiers are linked to Fethullah Gulen, a Turkish religious leader and political figure Erdogan claims was behind a failed military coup in 2016. The lawyers argue that through their supposed ties to Gulen, the Americans have attempted to “destroy the constitutional order” of Turkey. Gulen's followers have been branded terrorists by the Turkish government.

Those named include General Joseph Votel, the commander of the U.S. Central Command, retired U.S. Army General John F. Campbell and Air Force Brigadier General Rick Boutwell, director of regional affairs for the deputy undersecretary of the Air Force.

The Air Force told Stripes that all questions over the case should be referred to the Turkish government. “We continue to carry out our mission here at Incirlik Air Base, and we are proud of the relationship we have with our Turkish military partners,” said Air Force Captain Amanda Herman, spokeswoman for the base........
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Old 27th Aug 2018, 05:40
  #158 (permalink)  
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https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/w...sing-g62v5d2kg

Commandos accused of taking part in failed Turkish coup go missing

Two Turkish commandos who sought asylum in Greece over their alleged involvement in the botched coup against President Erdogan have gone missing from police custody and may already be in the hands of Turkey, their lawyer said yesterday.

Halit Cetin and Fatih Arik fled to Greece months after their unit, the SAT special operations force, led the failed Turkish coup in July 2016. The men, dubbed “public enemy No 1” by the Turkish government, claimed political asylum and were placed in detention for 18 months for illegal entry. However, according to Stavroula Tomara, their lawyer, the men went missing on August 20, the day the detention order ran out, and may have been spirited back to Turkey in a prisoner exchange.

“I went to collect them and they were gone,” she told a Greek television channel. “I seriously doubt the two commandos are in Greece any more. They have either been bundled up and taken to a third country or deported back to Turkey. No one has the authority to transfer my clients to any secret location. They should have walked free.”

Ms Tomara alleged that her clients may have been exchanged for two Greek soldiers who were returned to Greece on August 15 after being held for five months by Turkey on suspicion of espionage. She claimed that her clients may have been taken away under duress in similar circumstances to three of their comrades, who arrived in Greece with Mr Cetin and Mr Arik but quickly disappeared. “The day [the three comrades] were arrested and requested political asylum they were taken to a local hotel,” she said. “They were served dinner and as they were eating, a team of hooded Greek commandos burst into their room, strapped them and returned them back to Turkey.”

Ms Tomara also said that the whereabouts of eight Turkish officers who arrived by helicopter after the 2016 coup attempt was unknown since they were moved from a military camp in Agios Andreas on the outskirts of Athens when wildfires razed the region last month, killing 96 people.

Theodore Chronopoulos, a senior Greek police spokesman, said that Mr Cetin and Mr Arik’s release order came through last week but the two men “were immediately taken to a secret location following a separate request they had made to the authorities for their protection”. He declined to comment on Ms Tomara’s allegations.

Thousands of Turkish citizens have fled to Greece to escape the post-coup purges of state apparatus by Mr Erdogan’s government. The asylum claims of elite Turkish commandos have strained relations between Greece and Turkey, bringing them to their lowest point since the neighbouring states came to the brink of war in 1996. Although Athens has rejected a string of extradition requests by Turkey, the government of Alexis Tsipras has billed the military defectors as “putchists”, tacitly agreeing with Turkey’s claims that they played an instrumental role in the ill-fated coup attempt.

Last week Dimitris Kammenos, an independent Greek MP, submitted a letter of inquiry to parliament demanding explanations about the fate of the Turkish commandos.

European Union and Greek law forbids extradition to a country where an alleged offender could be at the risk of torture — a claim that the two Turkish commandos and eight officers have repeatedly made.

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Old 13th Sep 2018, 07:33
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Erdogan assumes control of Turkey’s $200bn wealth fund

President Erdogan has appointed himself head of Turkey’s sovereign wealth fund, a pot of $200 billion collected from the sale of public assets......... Berat Albayrak, his son-in-law and treasury minister, will be his deputy and the fund’s management staff have all been replaced.

The fund was set up a month after the failed coup in July 2016, to provide financing for large state development projects. It has been staffed by technocrats close to Mr Erdogan but there have been internal rifts, with some arguing that its wealth should be used to try to steady the lira, which has tumbled against major currencies this year.

Traditional wealth funds derive their income from state budget surpluses, usually in resource-rich countries or those with high-export economies. Turkey has high government debt and a large trade deficit, however, so has filled the fund’s coffers through public stakes in companies such as Turkish Airlines and using profits from the privatisation of state assets.

Mr Erdogan has ignored advice to rein in spending on huge infrastructure projects and his new role indicates that he is unlikely to change tack.

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Old 3rd Nov 2018, 20:31
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