What rank is "Master Pilot"
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NRU74
A very brave man!
As radar fitters, on pre-flights, we had to crawl into the organ loft, carrying a pump, to pressurise the Orange Putter wave form generator. Having to change a U/S one was a job for a contortionist. It was a terrible place to work.
I would never have gone up there if there was a fire.
Only a Queens Commendation? I saw a guy earn a George Medal for less, attempting to put out a fire up the rear hatch, the article incorrectly refers to the Bomb Bay, of a Canberra B2 at Coningsby.
https://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarch...0-%201540.html
I had somewhat ineffectively emptied a foam extinguisher on the fire before the fire engine arrived on the scene with the professionals.
Our Crew Chief was a Master Tech and got, I think, a Queen's Commendation for going up into the 'Organ Loft' of a Valiant on the ground at what was then Palisadoes in Jamaica with a fire extinguisher to put out a fire. Brave man!
As radar fitters, on pre-flights, we had to crawl into the organ loft, carrying a pump, to pressurise the Orange Putter wave form generator. Having to change a U/S one was a job for a contortionist. It was a terrible place to work.
I would never have gone up there if there was a fire.
Only a Queens Commendation? I saw a guy earn a George Medal for less, attempting to put out a fire up the rear hatch, the article incorrectly refers to the Bomb Bay, of a Canberra B2 at Coningsby.
https://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarch...0-%201540.html
I had somewhat ineffectively emptied a foam extinguisher on the fire before the fire engine arrived on the scene with the professionals.
Last edited by ian16th; 13th Apr 2016 at 09:24.
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My late Brother was a Master Pilot, joined up in 1940, ans served 22 years, aq long time as NCO pilot and QFI.
There was a time when there were "Pilot 1, Plot 2, and Pilot 3 ranks, and when they ended he did not want a commision as he would lose most of his rank seniority, which counted towards married quarter allocation and things like that,
There was a time when there were "Pilot 1, Plot 2, and Pilot 3 ranks, and when they ended he did not want a commision as he would lose most of his rank seniority, which counted towards married quarter allocation and things like that,
I joined up in 75 as a Rigga Mech, and one of the first things I had to do, on arrival at Tern Hill, was my Promotion exams (plural) LAC to SAC.
Later still, doing the SNCO Team Building stuff at Hereford and Scampton (where the only useful thing I found was learning how to guide a crane properly!)
So yes, the dumbing down of us techies was pretty continual...For me, it picked up as soon as I left the RAF and started learning about all the other things that surround helicopters and aeroplanes! - And I'm still learning.
Safety Demonstration: Showing my Sgt around the hangar fire and first aid points.
Practical: doing a metal bashing test Job to LAC level (Shoite) and
Written: Doing a vote for Joe exam on techie things.
Many Moons later I did the JT/Cpl Promex at Honington - Mentored by a Chief in deeper Techie stuff and again doing Vote for Joe's...but no practical work. My Aptitude Assessment was signed off by lending my Chief a new Phil Collins Album..No Jacket Required. I was still on Time Promotion up to the point I got promoted to JT and I was on Stn Duty Dog at LBH on the day I should have been promoted to Cpl. - although I was promoted some months later. Practical: doing a metal bashing test Job to LAC level (Shoite) and
Written: Doing a vote for Joe exam on techie things.
Later still, doing the SNCO Team Building stuff at Hereford and Scampton (where the only useful thing I found was learning how to guide a crane properly!)
So yes, the dumbing down of us techies was pretty continual...For me, it picked up as soon as I left the RAF and started learning about all the other things that surround helicopters and aeroplanes! - And I'm still learning.
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My late father was a Master Pilot, Jim Perry served 1948 to 1968. He had signed on for 22 years but due to contraction of the RAF took redundancy. His last posting after RAFCAW Strubby was as Unit Test pilot at Cranwell. He was issued a Warrant Officer warrant dated 15 Dec 1965 which I still have. When I went Varsity flying at Cranwell in 1969/70 there were very experienced Master Signallers who looked after us cadets with advice,food & drink.
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Suppose it's just pride but I'm glad my Warrant and the Auxiliary Air Force warrant both say Master Engineer rather than today's 'Master Aircrew'.
Went to Biggin Hill in 1972 (ish) and was in a group with a Sergeant Pilot on Whirlwinds, apparently he told me he was the last one. No idea whether he got commissioned or not.
Master Pilots and other trades were still around in abundance then but disappeared not long afterwards.
Went to Biggin Hill in 1972 (ish) and was in a group with a Sergeant Pilot on Whirlwinds, apparently he told me he was the last one. No idea whether he got commissioned or not.
Master Pilots and other trades were still around in abundance then but disappeared not long afterwards.
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Exnomad said "My late Brother was a Master Pilot"
Brian,
Mine dated 1 Jan 1974 says Warrant Officer !
Mine dated 1 Jan 1974 says Warrant Officer !
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First entry in my logbook, 22 Jun 64, Chipmunk WB 738, M Plt Forrester (same airframe for first solo a little later). Some lovely old SNCO instructors around, my FNT on JPs was with M Plt Naismith.
"An old Master Pilot, quietly Master Piloting away in the corner"
"An old Master Pilot, quietly Master Piloting away in the corner"
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...What rank is "Master Pilot"...
If you survived 12 months, you were promoted Flight Sergeant and got a few more "bob". If you defied all the odds, and made it for another 12 months, you were promoted Warrant Officer, got a bit more pay, a nice barathea uniform to replace your scratchy serge, lived in equal comfort to (in the Sergeants' Mess), and much more cheaply than any junior Officer.
Your juniors called you "Sir", an officer would address you (formally) as "Mister Smith" (in your crew you were, of course, "Skipper", "Paddy"or "Johnny" or whatever).
So matters stood as the war ended.
Around '48 the Air House had one of its brainstorms, but instead of lying down in a darkened room till it went away, put it into practice. This was the "Four-star Brandy" idea described in detail in these columns already. "P.1" was a poor substitute for "Warrant Officer", protest arose on all sides, and they changed it to "Master Pilot, etc", which was much better.
Then they threw away the whole "Four-star" idea (to general acclamation), and went back to what they'd had before. But (unwilling, as always, to admit that they'd made the mess in the first place *), they retained the "Master" rank. In later years all the old aircrew NCOs had worked up to "Master" (I don't know what the time requirement was). And the rest you know.
Note *: exactly the same subterfuge (which fooled nobody) was used for the three-button officers' No.1 Jacket of the '50s (to replace the wartime four-button).
Danny42C.
Leave well alone - if it ain't broke, don't fix it !
Last edited by Danny42C; 16th Apr 2016 at 16:56. Reason: Error.
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Heading back to the Master Pilot thread - lets not forget MPlt Dennis Rowe, at Binbrook in the early 70's as a Lightning Sim Instructor.
A gentleman who, in between Sim Slots, built a state of art electronic organ in the Sim computer room, at that time the organ was more electronically advanced than the simulator !!!!!
Yet hitching a ride with him between space cadet AEF on Chipmunks was a joy.. Never realized a Chippy could be considered as a WW2 train buster - Dennis often demonstrated the technique, he used in 1944, over Covenham Resevoir...
Anyone remember Dennis ???
Uptime...
A gentleman who, in between Sim Slots, built a state of art electronic organ in the Sim computer room, at that time the organ was more electronically advanced than the simulator !!!!!
Yet hitching a ride with him between space cadet AEF on Chipmunks was a joy.. Never realized a Chippy could be considered as a WW2 train buster - Dennis often demonstrated the technique, he used in 1944, over Covenham Resevoir...
Anyone remember Dennis ???
Uptime...
In 1975 we had a M Pilot Ken Shardlow as a Deputy Ops Controller at 46 Gp Ops Upavon. His last flying tour I believe was on Brigands in Malaya. His wife all 4ft 6 of her, an ex wartime WAAF used to drink every lunchtime and evening in the Antelope Pub in the village, where she would consume at least 6/7 pints of bitter at every session!!!!!
After he retired we gained M Pilot George Pope who had been ops on 216 Sqn when they flew Comets at Lyneham. Working with all of the Master Aircrew at Upavon certainly helped when I decided to apply for Airmen Aircrew in 78, great men who guided and mentored me into what turned out to be the best move of my 38 year career.
After he retired we gained M Pilot George Pope who had been ops on 216 Sqn when they flew Comets at Lyneham. Working with all of the Master Aircrew at Upavon certainly helped when I decided to apply for Airmen Aircrew in 78, great men who guided and mentored me into what turned out to be the best move of my 38 year career.
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Fixed Cross, I well remember after my high & low level sorties with M Plt Naismith (Jock?)thinking if I ever got to a position of testing students, that's the way to do it, a real gentleman and QFI
In ASCOC I was fortunate to work with Master Nav John Ford ex Mosquitos, York, Hastings. Master Pilot Ken Shardlow, he flew just about everything under the sun. These two gentlemen kept the long night shift interesting with stories of their past exploits. 1971/72
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... we gained M Pilot George Pope who had been ops on 216 Sqn when they flew Comets at Lyneham.
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Legend had it that M/Plt Jackson was also missing his Adams apple (war wounds) and, without this obstruction, he was capable of downing a pint faster than anyone else! Does anyone know if this was true?
Last edited by donthaveone; 18th Apr 2016 at 21:16.
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Not to forget M/Plt "Andy" Anderson, who was my Jet Provost instructor at Syerston '65/'66. A hard taskmaster, but he must have taught me well, since I managed a 38-year flying career.
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With the 'New Trade Structure', introduced in 1951, came the ranks of Junior Tech, Corporal Tech, Senior Tech, Chief Tech and Master Tech. These ranks were identified by their chevrons being worn point uppermost. A Master Tech wore the same 'Tate & Lyle' badge as a W.O.
Promotion through the Tech ranks was by trade tests and time in rank. The time was initially 5 years between each Technical rank.
Promotion through the Tech ranks was by trade tests and time in rank. The time was initially 5 years between each Technical rank.
That explains the picture here then
Halton
