What rank is "Master Pilot"
Its only Coriolis if he fell leftwards off the bike whilst turning anticlockwise of course.
Gib being N Hemisphere.
Gib being N Hemisphere.
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Master Tech? That's a new one on me, but then I didn't join until 1965.
How about Master Controller? USAF has those!
https://www.vanguardmil.com/products...-control-badge
How about Master Controller? USAF has those!
https://www.vanguardmil.com/products...-control-badge
Regarding the post from outhouse, there were a fair number of Americans during WW2 who originally joined the RAF/RCAF. When the US entered the war they were given the option to transfer to the USAAF, which many took. Some of those serving with Bomber Command remained with their squadron after transfer in order to complete their tour, then flew subsequent tours with the USAAF.
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Master Tech? That's a new one on me, but then I didn't join until 1965.
Promotion through the Tech ranks was by trade tests and time in rank. The time was initially 5 years between each Technical rank.
But switching between the tech ranks and the old Command ranks was allowed and normal.
It was quite normal for a J/T to be promoted to Cpl, and after passing the trade test, 5 years after becoming J/T he was promoted to Cpl/Tech, and a Cpl/Tech could be promoted to Sgt.
The Tech ranks were paid more than the Command ranks and originally were not liable for such Station Duties as Orderly Cpl and Orderly Sgt. This didn't last long.
Some Flt. Sgts, with the required time in, took and passed the trade test and were PROMOTED to Chief/Tech.
Some time later, the time qualifications were altered. In an effort to encourage advanced tradesmen to sign for longer engagements, anyone doing 12 years had the time qualifications reduced to 3 years between J/T and Cpl/Tech and 4 between Cpl/Tech and Snr/Tech. I can't remember the others.
This reduction in time qualification was later implemented for people on engagements of 9 years. This happened just after I, being on a 10 years from my 18th birthday engagement, had done the 5 years to Cpl/Tech, and I'd passed the trade test over 2 years earlier.
In 1964 it all changed and the ranks of Cpl/Tech, Snr/Tech and Master/Tech were done away with, and these guys became Cpl's. Sgt's and W.O.'s
The rank of Chief/Tech was retained, but is was now JUNIOR to Flight Sergeant! Some Chief/Tech's had been Flight Sergeants for some years, before being PROMOTED to Chief/Tech. To say they were p*ssed off was an understatement.
Cannot believe I remembered that, but cannot remember recent stuff - mind you our drama group jut did "Quartet", set in a retirement home. repeating yourself is now know in Wander00 Towers as "doing a "Quartet""
ian 16th,
My father joined in 1939-coincidentally 39 Entry Halton, went through the War (under 19 into Malta) etc.etc. He spent 8 years as a Corporal/Cpl Tech, wartime and post war (including winning the Curtis memorial prize c.1952) He was as you say, brassed off about such as the Station Duties issue and the perceived blocking of regular RAF by initially "hostilities only" non- technical guys, who then stayed on "having never had it so good" . He therefore, as a Senior Technician in 1954, slung it in after 15 years and, along with many others, was interviewed as to why he was leaving. Hopefully this resulted in the change of policy, but by then he was into the Aircraft Industry and getting on with another career.
My father joined in 1939-coincidentally 39 Entry Halton, went through the War (under 19 into Malta) etc.etc. He spent 8 years as a Corporal/Cpl Tech, wartime and post war (including winning the Curtis memorial prize c.1952) He was as you say, brassed off about such as the Station Duties issue and the perceived blocking of regular RAF by initially "hostilities only" non- technical guys, who then stayed on "having never had it so good" . He therefore, as a Senior Technician in 1954, slung it in after 15 years and, along with many others, was interviewed as to why he was leaving. Hopefully this resulted in the change of policy, but by then he was into the Aircraft Industry and getting on with another career.
Last edited by Haraka; 12th Apr 2016 at 17:02.
ian16th
Wasn't the J/T upturned chevron replaced with a kind of brass 'wheel' and the Chief Tech's crown likewise ?
I seem to remember some spoof adverts in the RAF News put in by pi$$ed off Chief Techs at the time offering crowns for sale.
Our Crew Chief was a Master Tech and got, I think, a Queen's Commendation for going up into the 'Organ Loft' of a Valiant on the ground at what was then Palisadoes in Jamaica with a fire extinguisher to put out a fire. Brave man!
Wasn't the J/T upturned chevron replaced with a kind of brass 'wheel' and the Chief Tech's crown likewise ?
I seem to remember some spoof adverts in the RAF News put in by pi$$ed off Chief Techs at the time offering crowns for sale.
Our Crew Chief was a Master Tech and got, I think, a Queen's Commendation for going up into the 'Organ Loft' of a Valiant on the ground at what was then Palisadoes in Jamaica with a fire extinguisher to put out a fire. Brave man!
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NRI74 - the JnrTech inverted single chevron was replaced by a four bladed propeller, similar to the three bladed prop of an SAC. This confused me when I arrived at Northolt in the summer of 1964 after a 12 month tour in Sharjah and I saw these folk with 4 bladed props
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Thanks, ian6th and Haraka ... I am enlightened.
I knew the Tech Trades had some rocky times regarding promotion and status. Especially the perpetual Chf Tech, because there were no FS slots ... I have a few old Bisley colleagues who got stuck there!
I knew the Tech Trades had some rocky times regarding promotion and status. Especially the perpetual Chf Tech, because there were no FS slots ... I have a few old Bisley colleagues who got stuck there!
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I remember the purge in the 70's to get rid of a glut of Chief techs at the time, those that were any good at the job took the volunteer redundancy package as they knew they would walk into industry and those that were dire sadly stayed on.
MPN 11
I think another burden that had to be considered was that of National Servicemen.Through no fault of their own, many of these young men were "NFI" . Thus the burden of supervision was increased on the "regulars", especially when issues pertinent to flight safety were involved. So it befell those in charge often having to " do it themselves" for peace of mind. but of course, not of body.
I think another burden that had to be considered was that of National Servicemen.Through no fault of their own, many of these young men were "NFI" . Thus the burden of supervision was increased on the "regulars", especially when issues pertinent to flight safety were involved. So it befell those in charge often having to " do it themselves" for peace of mind. but of course, not of body.
Sometime in the 70's I think, they created a Chf Tech rank for Telegraphists, basically for Sgts who would never make Flt Sgt. I believe it also had something to do with pension entitlements.
Gentleman Aviator
Re: Taff Walker et al
Further to my post 57 above, I last flew with Taff in January '73.
Can't find the name of the FS Nav - maybe I never flew with him. The navs on the Sqn in them days were Ops/Nav, and didn't fly that much .............
Further to my post 57 above, I last flew with Taff in January '73.
Can't find the name of the FS Nav - maybe I never flew with him. The navs on the Sqn in them days were Ops/Nav, and didn't fly that much .............
Do a Hover - it avoids G
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Master Pilot Jimmy Hindson sent me solo in a Provost at Hullavington on 12 Jan 56.
I didn't think I was up to it but he knew his trade.
He was also the best instructor I could have had. When we met for the first time I was an Acting Pilot Oficer. His first words were "You will call me sir". He got no argument from me. Years later he came to my wedding.
I didn't think I was up to it but he knew his trade.
He was also the best instructor I could have had. When we met for the first time I was an Acting Pilot Oficer. His first words were "You will call me sir". He got no argument from me. Years later he came to my wedding.
The first time I saw a our bladed prop on a JT in 1964 I thought he was in the Air Training Corps because they had a similar badge.
I was a but embarrassed when he explained what it was.
I was a but embarrassed when he explained what it was.
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I remember the purge in the 70's to get rid of a glut of Chief techs at the time
I left with money in the bank a pension and a good job to go to in IT aged 37.
I personally believe the glut was caused by reducing the promotion exam to just a question paper. My cpl/tech and senior/tech exam boards were far more difficult.
Re Master Pilots, my first flight was with a Master Pilot Batchelor, in a Meteor NF 11. He was a fighter pilot in WWII and I recall watching his cine film of air to air gunnery practice. It was extremely accurate and the envy of the young pilots on the Sqdn.
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NRU74
Originally a Chief Tech wore 3 chevrons, point up, and a crown.
As Ricardian said, the new J/T's badge was a 4 bladed prop, the new Chief/Tech's badges were 3 chevrons point down and the new J/T's 4 bladed prop above it.
The 4 bladed brass 'wheel' always was the Boy Entrants and Apprentices badge. I never heard of it being used anywhere else.
This is my 64 year old one.
ian16th
Wasn't the J/T upturned chevron replaced with a kind of brass 'wheel' and the Chief Tech's crown likewise ?
Wasn't the J/T upturned chevron replaced with a kind of brass 'wheel' and the Chief Tech's crown likewise ?
As Ricardian said, the new J/T's badge was a 4 bladed prop, the new Chief/Tech's badges were 3 chevrons point down and the new J/T's 4 bladed prop above it.
The 4 bladed brass 'wheel' always was the Boy Entrants and Apprentices badge. I never heard of it being used anywhere else.
This is my 64 year old one.
While we are talking about old ranks, how many of you knew we used to have sergeant majors in the RAF? From 1919 we had the ranks of sergeant major 1st class and 2nd class which were renamed warrant officer 1st and 2nd class in 1933. I once owned an RAF LS&GC (George V issue) which was named 'SM2 J.Bloggs, R.A.F." The rank of WO2 was abolished in 1939, but of course it remains in the army.