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Russia Warns Sweden and Finland Against NATO Membership

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Russia Warns Sweden and Finland Against NATO Membership

Old 20th Nov 2023, 16:04
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Originally Posted by The Helpful Stacker
The mutt was likely only there for a couple of hours, what with it being the dog watch...
You would need another one then - for the second dog watch,
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Old 21st Nov 2023, 20:23
  #242 (permalink)  
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​​​​​​​"No! Go to Russia" Estonian border guards do not allow migrants to enter the country

A group of refugees from Africa and the Middle East was brought by Russian special services to the Russian-Estonian border the day before. The video was published on Tuesday, November 21, by the portal 47news.
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Old 22nd Nov 2023, 23:56
  #243 (permalink)  
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Finland has said it will close all but one crossing point on its border with Russia in an effort to halt a flow of asylum seekers to the Nordic nation, as Estonia accused Moscow of mounting “a hybrid attack operation” on Europe’s eastern border.

The announcement on Wednesday came after weeks of tension on the 830-mile (1,330km) border across which Helsinki accuses Moscow of guiding refugees and migrants in an apparent act of revenge for the Nordic nation’s cooperation with the US.

From midnight on Friday, said the Finnish prime minister, Petteri Orpo, the only open border crossing of Finland’s eight stations would be its northernmost at Raja-Jooseppi.…

Estonia has made preparations to follow in the footsteps of Finland and close border crossings if “the migration pressure from Russia escalates”, the interior minister, Lauri Läänemets, told Reuters through a spokesperson.

“Unfortunately, there are many signs that Russian border officials and possibly other agencies are involved,” said the minister. “Quite frankly, [the] ongoing migration pressure on Europe’s eastern border is a hybrid attack operation,” he added.

Russian officials were not immediately available to comment.
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Old 23rd Nov 2023, 12:26
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Finland has closed all the Border crossings bar one with Russia, the northern one is still open, so a journey from St Petersberg to Helsinki is now a little longer.







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Old 23rd Nov 2023, 14:20
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Originally Posted by NutLoose
Finland has closed all the Border crossings bar one with Russia, the northern one is still open, so a journey from St Petersberg to Helsinki is now a little longer.
Excellent presentation! What a cock-up!
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Old 28th Nov 2023, 17:55
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Finland is now closing all its road border crossings with Russia: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-67555626

Finland is closing all crossings on the Russian border after accusing Moscow of deliberately helping migrants into the country.

Seven of eight road posts have already shut over a rise in crossings this month.

The government now says the last, located in the Arctic Circle, will close on Thursday for two weeks.

Around 900 asylum seekers entered Finland from Russia in November, up from fewer than one a day on average.

They come from countries including Morocco, Pakistan and Syria, authorities say.

Finland is "determined to put an end to the crossings", Prime Minister Petteri Orpo said in a statement.

The government says Russia is channelling asylum seekers towards Finland in what it calls an "influence operation" and "hybrid attack", and has progressively closed more and more border posts.

The Raja-Jooseppi crossing was the last road one to remain open, but it too will be closed by Friday. A rail crossing will remain open for freight traffic.
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Old 26th Dec 2023, 23:23
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Turkey’s parliamentary foreign affairs committee gave the green light to Sweden joining NATO on Tuesday, putting the Nordic country one step closer to membership in the alliance.

Now that the committee has approved Sweden’s membership the parliament itself could hold a vote in the coming days - and all eyes will then be on Hungary.

Viktor Orbán's government has been telling, both in public and in private, representatives of both NATO and the EU that Hungary "won't be the last” to ratify Sweden's NATO accession.

Were they telling the truth, were they telling what they believed was the truth – or were they intentionally deceiving their Western allies all this time?

Watch this space…
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Old 23rd Jan 2024, 20:14
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Turkish parliament has just approved Sweden's accession to NATO.

Hungary will be last.
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Old 23rd Jan 2024, 23:30
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https://www.politico.eu/article/swed...-negotiations/

Sweden declines Orbán’s push for NATO negotiations

Swedish Foreign Minister Tobias Billström on Tuesday rejected Hungary's call to negotiate about his country's bid to join NATO.

"I see no reason to negotiate at this point," Billström said, responding to a request made by Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orbán. "What we hope, of course, is that Hungary will ratify membership as soon as possible."

In a letter sent Tuesday to his Swedish counterpart Ulf Krissterson and obtained by POLITICO, Orbán called for a meeting and stressed the need for "strong mutual trust ... between Sweden and Hungary."

Budapest has bridled at Stockholm's criticism of its backsliding on the EU's democratic principles.

Orbán continued: "I invite you to visit Hungary at your earliest convenience to exchange views on all issues of common interest, including our complex bilateral relations, our future cooperation in the field of security and defence as allies and partners, and Hungary's approaching presidency of the Council of the European Union."

Billström pointed out that the "good" tone of the letter was different from Orbán's tweet, which read: "Today I sent an invitation letter to Prime Minister Ulf Kristersson ... for a visit to Hungary to negotiate on Sweden’s NATO accession."

"You have to remember that the letter is one thing, and what is written on X is another," the Swedish minister said. "We welcome a constructive conversation."

Orbán's sudden proposal for negotiations comes as Turkey's parliament is poised to ratify Sweden's bid this week, leaving Hungary as the last NATO country stalling on Stockholm's application.
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 00:45
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Orban is positioning Hungary to being the sick man of Europe, which takes some heat off other contenders. Both the EU and NATO need to revisit their wording and in fact, their assumptions in the absence of explicit wording which is the area that has empowered goats like Orban; there is no legal basis for 100% concurrence in many of the stunts that Urban pulls.
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 01:58
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fdr, are you saying that NATO and EU ought to welch on the deal?
Some kind of post hoc back stab? (as seen by Orban, or Erdogan, or others).
I'd be careful about that.
If you want to erode trust in an institution, go right ahead and change what you've promised.
You've seen that work out in how many different situations in life. Did it ever go well, or was it ever received well?
No, it hasn't.
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 03:37
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Turkey has approved Swedens application to join NATO.

​​​​​​​
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 09:07
  #253 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Lonewolf_50
fdr, are you saying that NATO and EU ought to welch on the deal?
Some kind of post hoc back stab? (as seen by Orban, or Erdogan, or others).
I'd be careful about that.
If you want to erode trust in an institution, go right ahead and change what you've promised.
You've seen that work out in how many different situations in life. Did it ever go well, or was it ever received well?
No, it hasn't.
Orban is holding the EU and NATO to ransom, and doing so by disregarding the tenets of both charters, So, playing politely the 100% consensus policy that has evolved over time while dealing with member nations who were mainly on the same page with respect to the EI and NATO, seems now curiously quaint. It is not a requirement, it has just worked for 75 years as the players hadn't descended back into a totalitarian-dictatorial state previously. So, yeah... they wan't to be like Russia, then let them leave the EU and NATO, and close their borders. Insanity seems to be prevalent in many parts of the planet, from Russia, to China, to Hungary and to those wanting to dismantle a democratic republic in the Americas.
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 16:36
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Originally Posted by fdr
Orban is holding the EU and NATO to ransom, and doing so by disregarding the tenets of both charters, So, playing politely the 100% consensus policy that has evolved over time while dealing with member nations who were mainly on the same page with respect to the EI and NATO, seems now curiously quaint. It is not a requirement, it has just worked for 75 years as the players hadn't descended back into a totalitarian-dictatorial state previously. So, yeah... they wan't to be like Russia, then let them leave the EU and NATO, and close their borders. Insanity seems to be prevalent in many parts of the planet, from Russia, to China, to Hungary and to those wanting to dismantle a democratic republic in the Americas.
Widen the field of view. If you want to increase the membership of EU, or NATO, and offer to the new members equal standing with the other members, the risk that you take is that sometimes these new members will act as though they are full members.

Who would have imagined that they would do that? (See Turkey in NATO as but one example among many).

What you seem to be proposing is that "some members are more equal than others" which isn't how the organizations are set up.
What is happening is that NATO and the EU are dealing with this old saw:
"Be careful of what you wish for, since you are sure to get it."
These are the consequences of expansion. (The UN suffers from that to an even greater extent).
So, yeah... they wan't to be like Russia, then let them leave the EU and NATO, and close their borders.
What a foolish remark.
Hungary has shown no desire to quit NATO, nor to quit the EU.
That you don't like what they are doing (I didn't care for their resistance to Sweden's entry to NATO, my own self) in no way means that they can't do it. They are a full member, and NATO invited them to be in 1999.
Deal With It.
AVIATION CONTENT:
Our dear NATO friends, the Italians, Spanish, and French, didn't allow overflight from the UK-based F-111s in 1986 for Operation El Dorado Canyon Raids on Lybia.
As was their right. (Annoying but true).
We Dealt With It.

Last edited by Lonewolf_50; 24th Jan 2024 at 16:48.
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 16:51
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And Orbán has signified his support for Sweden's accession to NATO.
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 17:02
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Originally Posted by Expatrick
And Orbán has signified his support for Sweden's accession to NATO.
Glad to hear that.
(Bloomberg) -- Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban is preparing his lawmakers to ratify Sweden’s accession to NATO after Turkey’s parliamentary approval effectively left Budapest as the lone holdout to the military alliance’s enlargement.

Under pressure to act after leaving the ratification protocol languishing in the Hungarian parliament for more than a year, Orban told North Atlantic Treaty Organization Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg on Wednesday that he’ll urge its approval “at the first possible opportunity,” according to a post on the social media site X. Stoltenberg, for his part, said he was heartened by Orban’s apparent commitment.
I wonder what the catch is. There's always a catch, isn't there?
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 17:10
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Originally Posted by Lonewolf_50
Glad to hear that.
I wonder what the catch is. There's always a catch, isn't there?
Pragmatism prevails.
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 18:37
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Maybe a new batch of Gripens at discount pricing?
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 18:44
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Originally Posted by admikar
Maybe a new batch of Gripens at discount pricing?
God forbid that a NATO country should reinforce it's defences.
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Old 24th Jan 2024, 19:01
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Where did I say that?
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