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Here it comes: Syria

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Here it comes: Syria

Old 19th Apr 2018, 08:30
  #2341 (permalink)  
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Van,

Perhaps you missed the part of the briefing that said:

“The B-1B strategic bombers approached the facilities over the Syrian territory near al-Tanf”...

“....as well as GBU-38 guided air bombs fired from the B-1B”.

If you are unfamiliar, the GBU-38 is a free-fall LGB.....

GBU-38 JDAM
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Old 19th Apr 2018, 09:50
  #2342 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
Van,

Perhaps you missed the part of the briefing that said:
“The B-1B strategic bombers approached the facilities over the Syrian territory near al-Tanf”...

“....as well as GBU-38 guided air bombs fired from the B-1B”.
If you are unfamiliar, the GBU-38 is a free-fall LGB.....
GBU-38 JDAM

In fact the point of my misunderstanding was that Just This Once... wrote that "....claiming tactical aircraft dropped free-fall weapons ....."

Since the time when B-1 (and then B-1B) was introduced, I was thinking that it was a strategic bomber.


Some sources confirm this, e.g. the following one:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockwell_B-1_Lancer
It says that "It is one of three strategic bombers in the U.S. Air Force fleet as of 2018, the other two being the B-2"Stealth Bomber", and the B-52".


BTW, it was written today in a Russian media that two US missiles were found more or less as whole pieces on the Syrian territory after the attack. They were transported to Russia and are now being examined by experts.
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Old 19th Apr 2018, 10:09
  #2343 (permalink)  
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The B-1 was designed as a strategic bomber, But the B-1B has been pretty much just a tactical bomber since GWI and the disbandment of SAC; used in the same way the Russian Air Force uses the T-22M.
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Old 19th Apr 2018, 11:21
  #2344 (permalink)  
 
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Think about it, A Van?

There was no warning given to the Russians about the strikes on the targets. The Russians are claiming that there was repelled strikes on a number of airfields. Do you really think that the US would risk having Russian forces based at those airfields being caught up and suffering casualties? The whole aim of the strikes on carefully selected targets was to prevent such casualties and allow for no prior warning.

One of those airfields with a claimed successfully repelled attack was Shayrat. The same airfield that was targetted by the US during April 2017. The Russians were warned before hand of the 2017 strike and I believe they were given a 90 minute warning. In addition to the warning the Hardened Aircraft Shelters and the surrounding areas where the Russian helicopter fleet was located was untargeted.

The same goes for those other claimed airfields. Without a warning think of the risk of Russian forces being caught up? Think of the consequences of such a situation? It would have played straight into Putin's hands and the risk of escalation and retaliaton.

The Russians did the same with the 2017 TLAM strike on Shayrat. For propaganda purposes they briefed that only 23 TLAMs out of 59 had hit Shayrat.

Can you not see that the Russian Ministry of Defence have to create these fabrications and that if you believe them you are being played? They did the same during Soviet times for the 1986 raid on Libya. It is just embarrassing for these Russian top brass to be made to go out and spin the spin.

Even in the face of the post strike satellite imagery and analysis of the 2017 Shayrat strike the Russians still stuck with the 23 hits only.

Satellite imagery and analysis at following link.

ISI first to analyze Shayrat airfield missile attack - ISI

A Van wrote

BTW, it was written today in a Russian media that two US missiles were found more or less as whole pieces on the Syrian territory after the attack. They were transported to Russia and are now being examined by experts.
Yes it is possible that some missiles malfunctioned. Just the same as some of the Russian cruise missiles that crashed relatively intact in both Iran and Syria. What you have to factor in with these claims is that it is just a fabricated story. Think of the propaganda value of a Ministry of Defence enhanced briefing showing these missiles with all the details?

What I think has happened here is that some of the Russian media have got hold of the following image and the spin continues.

These are actually two Soviet era R-40 AA-6 Acrid. No fins on them and still with the protective caps. Likely abandoned on one of the Syrian airfields.


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Old 19th Apr 2018, 11:24
  #2345 (permalink)  
 
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The START treaty removed the strategic role from the Bone and a bunch of Russian officers get to inspect the aircraft every year to confirm it.

It’s tactical role just gets bigger - now with added maritime capabilities too.
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Old 19th Apr 2018, 11:40
  #2346 (permalink)  
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What goes up must come down. It the SADS launched missiles wholesale it is quite possible they bombed their own airfields.
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Old 19th Apr 2018, 13:19
  #2347 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by A_Van View Post
Since the time when B-1 (and then B-1B) was introduced, I was thinking that it was a strategic bomber.
It can perform either role (tactical bomber or strategic bomber) though noting JTO's point on START is worthwhile. You may find it interesting that for a while, B-1's were tasked with close air support in a couple of our operations. They did OK, but the ground guys always expressed a preference for A-10's. (Go figure).
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Old 19th Apr 2018, 15:52
  #2348 (permalink)  
 
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The photo of Russian made AA-6 missiles is typical. Surely there are many folk in Russia who would instantly recognise them and those that don’t must find it odd for 2 supposedly shotdown missiles landed next to each other with one of them magically refitting its ‘remove before flight’ cover?
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Old 19th Apr 2018, 17:27
  #2349 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Just This Once... View Post
The photo of Russian made AA-6 missiles is typical. Surely there are many folk in Russia who would instantly recognise them and those that don’t must find it odd for 2 supposedly shotdown missiles landed next to each other with one of them magically refitting its ‘remove before flight’ cover?

Sure.. write to the papers and point it out...... and put yr affairs in order.....
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Old 19th Apr 2018, 20:40
  #2350 (permalink)  
 
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It has been a sunny day and yet my front door handle was a bit wet....
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Old 20th Apr 2018, 14:15
  #2351 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by A_Van View Post
BTW, it was written today in a Russian media that two US missiles were found more or less as whole pieces on the Syrian territory after the attack. They were transported to Russia and are now being examined by experts.
There are some mighty gullible people who post here. Just sayin'.
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Old 20th Apr 2018, 14:16
  #2352 (permalink)  
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Perhaps they sent two in post #2345?
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Old 21st Apr 2018, 07:57
  #2353 (permalink)  
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Is it my imagination but has the missile strike more or less dropped off the news circuits?

In other words Russian maskirovka either succeeded or is wasted as the media soon forgets it anyway.
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Old 21st Apr 2018, 18:30
  #2354 (permalink)  
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Less than, shall we say, complementary by the Russians of their allies......

Assad is in a weaker position than most think

“.......“The Syrians can’t fight,” said one commander. “I’ve seen it many times. At the drop of a hat they’ll abandon their positions and flee. ‘Go, go, Russia, go!’ they’ll yell. Where are you going, god damn it, let’s defend the position! But no. When there’s an assault, for instance, we’ll take the high ground, hand it over to the Syrians in the evening, come morning, no Syrians.”

The Russians regard the poor fighting capacity of the regime forces as connected to what they see as moral failings. “It’s a grotesque country,” said the commander to RFE/RL. “Faggotry flourishes there. They’ve all got it to a man.” The depletion of fighting-age men in regime areas has been a massive problem, and apparently drives the unwillingness to fight: “I ask one of the translators: ‘Why do your boys not want to fight?’ ‘Oh’, he says, ‘many of our boys have been killed in the war. We need some to stay alive to **** some girls so there will be children’. ‘Look, let us **** your girls’, I say, ‘and you guys go fight. It’s your country’. ‘No’, he says, ‘we need to preserve our blood’. What blood? Your gay blood?”

In another interview by the Estonian public broadcaster’s Russian-language channel, a Wagner fighter named Oleg also discusses how it was impossible to get the Syrians to fight – even when the Russians would shoot at their feet. The Russians had to undertake all assaults under Syrian friendly fire and lost staggering amounts of men thanks to regime incompetence. “God forbid one should have such allies,” he said, “because they always **** up every task. Always.” An Izvestia interview in October with a Russian special forces officer in October paints a similar picture. “We have to instruct them to let us return from the battlefield and not open fire and kill us … Sometimes you’ll say ‘run!’ while they’re getting shot at and they can’t move—their legs have turned to rubber. Sometimes they start crying.”........

“The skill level of the Syrian army is less than nonexistent, one could say,” says another fighter. “The Russians give tanks to the Syrians, the Syrians give the tanks to ISIS, the Russians come and take the tanks back from ISIS … give them back to the Syrians again … and the cycle restarts.” Similar reports have come from Assad’s Iranian allies. Journalist Sulome Anderson quotes some Iranian-backed Hezbollah sources calling Assad’s forces “garbage people” and “sons of bitches.” One Hezbollah captain told her: “If you have 600 Syrians before a battle, when the battle starts you’ll have six.”.........
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Old 21st Apr 2018, 21:53
  #2355 (permalink)  
 
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This should not be a surprise, Arab armies have long had difficulty getting the troops sufficiently motivated. Even T E Lawrence made a point of highlighting this as a major reason for his tactics.
The situation should be even less impressive today. If the choice is to fight for Assad or for ISIS, most would agree that 'neither' is a rational response.
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Old 23rd Apr 2018, 11:06
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A reasonable summary and lots of photos at:

https://www.f***book.com/pg/aerospac...=page_internal

obviously the *** will need replacing…...
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Old 30th Apr 2018, 19:18
  #2357 (permalink)  
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The Times: Middle East tensions rise after Israeli strike on missile base in Syria



Suspected Israeli cruise missile strikes on military bases and an arms depot in Syria killed scores of regime and possibly Iranian soldiers, according to monitors and state media.

The air-to-surface missiles, said to have been fired from Israeli jets, sent flames into the night sky of northern Syria above the bases near Hama and Aleppo. The blasts were so powerful they triggered earthquake sensors in neighbouring Lebanon and Turkey. Syrian rebel sources said the main target, the Brigade 47 base a few miles from Hama’s city centre, housed the northern command and control centre of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard based in Syria.

The guard has hundreds of officers and advisers helping defend the Assad regime, and backs a further estimated 20,000 Shia militia operatives it has sent in from across the region. However, Israel fears Tehran is also establishing a long-term presence to counter it from Syrian soil.......

The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights, a monitor, said 26 soldiers were killed, most of them Iranian. Tehran state media initially appeared to confirm the attack, saying 18 Iranians died, but later reported an unnamed official denying that any of its countrymen had been killed.

A Syrian rebel intelligence officer operating in north Homs province not far from Hama said the Brigade 47 base was extensive, partly dug into a hillside, and contained a “scientific research centre” used to produce missiles as well as to house the Revolutionary Guard command. Syrian state media and pro-Hezbollah news agencies in Lebanon reported that a major weapons depot was struck.

The Observatory said it contained surface-to-surface missiles - a category that Iran has provided to Hezbollah in large quantities but which may now be intended for the wide range of Shia militias, including Iraqi, Afghan and Pakistani Shia fighters, who the Guard is supporting in Syria. “The strike hit the Guard sites in the centre and the ammunition warehouses,” the rebel officer, Captain Abdullah al-Zoubi, told The Times. “An estimate of 80 soldiers and commanders from the Guard and the regime were killed.”......

Senior Israeli officials, who rarely admit military operations in Syria, conspicuously failed to deny suggestions that its air force was responsible for the raids.
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Old 10th May 2018, 05:43
  #2358 (permalink)  
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https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/n...n-up-0gv8hnp3g

Iranian forces based in Syria fired a salvo of rockets at Israeli military positions as Tehran vented its fury over President Trump’s decision to withdraw from the nuclear deal.

According to the Israeli military, Iran’s Quds Force, the expeditionary unit of the Revolutionary Guards, launched 20 artillery rockets into the Golan Heights. Israel said that some of the rockets were intercepted and shot down by its Iron Dome missile defence system. A few got though and caused “some damage” to Israeli military installations but no casualties.

The Israeli army said it hit back by striking “dozens” of Iranian sites in Syria, targeting intelligence, storage and logistics as well as the origin of the rockets. Air-raid sirens were heard on the Israeli side of the Golan before the shelling and residents were told to stay in shelters. Israel is not seeking an escalation, a military spokesman said......

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Old 10th May 2018, 13:27
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It's not as though the Israelis didn't see this coming ...

Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/n...n-up-0gv8hnp3g
The Israeli army said it hit back by striking “dozens” of Iranian sites in Syria, targeting intelligence, storage and logistics as well as the origin of the rockets. Air-raid sirens were heard on the Israeli side of the Golan before the shelling and residents were told to stay in shelters. Israel is not seeking an escalation, a military spokesman said......
If I may respond to the "spokesman's" assertion about not seeking escalation, I'll offer that in the last few weeks, the Israelis have lobbed a few rounds into Syria at (reported) Iranian positions/facilities.
OK, the Iranian Quds force lobs a few rounds back at them.
So the Israelis lob a few back ... no, wait, they do indeed escalate. Dozens of targets isn't "a few."

Methinks the major protests too loudly ....
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Old 10th May 2018, 16:34
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This smells of an Israeli false flag operation like the US’s Tonkin Gulf excuse to get deeper into Vietnam.
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