PVRs started.....
I don't doubt the professionalism of the RW force at all - far from it. But Bliar's military adventurism in both GW2 and the north-west frontier has resulted in a sandaholic focus at the expense of far too many other areas of military flying - which is why you're there. There are now TriStar pilots who have only ever landed at 3 aerodromes in their whole tour - and who have never even flown one NAT track. The RAF has lost the MPA role, strategic bombing vanished years ago, as did strategic reconaissance - even training is being farmed out to contractors.
By definition, 'expeditionary' warfare is the direct result of failed government policy. The fact that the RAF then has to cope with the fall-out of such a policy is simply a legacy of the military 'can do' attitude.
When the UK has finally pulled out of the north-west frontier, the realisation that the whole RAF force structure is unbalanced will probably come as a shock. What will you do with all those Chinooks, for example, when there is no more north-west frontier operation to support? I suspect that there will be a lot of cuts to the RW world at that time.
The RAF will continue to attract some, but increasing competition from other areas of aviation will become a significant factor. Which 10 years of holding postings and being dicked around pre-OCU will hardly lessen.
(And less of the trucky, thank you very much - I only did a couple of years of that once the AAR role had become 'AT/AAR'
)
By definition, 'expeditionary' warfare is the direct result of failed government policy. The fact that the RAF then has to cope with the fall-out of such a policy is simply a legacy of the military 'can do' attitude.
When the UK has finally pulled out of the north-west frontier, the realisation that the whole RAF force structure is unbalanced will probably come as a shock. What will you do with all those Chinooks, for example, when there is no more north-west frontier operation to support? I suspect that there will be a lot of cuts to the RW world at that time.
The RAF will continue to attract some, but increasing competition from other areas of aviation will become a significant factor. Which 10 years of holding postings and being dicked around pre-OCU will hardly lessen.
(And less of the trucky, thank you very much - I only did a couple of years of that once the AAR role had become 'AT/AAR'
)
I have to agree with BEagle's sentiments regarding job satisfaction and think the criticism by nicecastle and chopabeefer misses his point. To take any satisfaction from the later years of TELIC, and anything on HERRICK, I contend that most choose to ignore the bigger picture and focus purely on their own (or their unit's own) contribution - and there is plenty of magnificent flying done by many who put themselves in harm's way day in, day out.
My own personal example would be the withdrawal of British troops from Basra Palace to the COB in 2007; at the time this was trailed as an 'important development in Basra's future' and a 'major strategic event', I worked very hard throughout it and my unit's part in its success was a source of much pride. Four years later we now know that it was actually a shabby deal, the aftermath of which did much damage to our reputation with both the Iraqis and the US. It takes time and detachment for such realisation to dawn and I think in a few years' time many of our brave, decorated RW pilots will wonder exactly why they and their passengers put themselves on the line in what (at the strategic level) has been nothing but a face-saving operation for the last 3 years. There are plenty of tactical victories to be proud of - but in the end, so what?
The unabated winning feeling "we kicked Saddam out of Kuwait" from 1991 hasn't really been repeated in any of the conflicts I've experienced since, which says a lot about our poor strategic direction (whether based on poor politics or poor military advice, the end result is the same). For a few weeks this spring the Libya operation provided a welcome positive buzz around the place - I reckon this will start to die off fairly soon unless some definitive direction emerges. We'll see!
My own personal example would be the withdrawal of British troops from Basra Palace to the COB in 2007; at the time this was trailed as an 'important development in Basra's future' and a 'major strategic event', I worked very hard throughout it and my unit's part in its success was a source of much pride. Four years later we now know that it was actually a shabby deal, the aftermath of which did much damage to our reputation with both the Iraqis and the US. It takes time and detachment for such realisation to dawn and I think in a few years' time many of our brave, decorated RW pilots will wonder exactly why they and their passengers put themselves on the line in what (at the strategic level) has been nothing but a face-saving operation for the last 3 years. There are plenty of tactical victories to be proud of - but in the end, so what?
The unabated winning feeling "we kicked Saddam out of Kuwait" from 1991 hasn't really been repeated in any of the conflicts I've experienced since, which says a lot about our poor strategic direction (whether based on poor politics or poor military advice, the end result is the same). For a few weeks this spring the Libya operation provided a welcome positive buzz around the place - I reckon this will start to die off fairly soon unless some definitive direction emerges. We'll see!
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: uk
Posts: 277
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Personally I loved the years I spent as a trucky. Awesome flying, crap conditions, awesome flying, amazing people to work with, and awesome flying!
I never understand why some always choose to talk down about certain roles within the military. I never wanted to fly helis or jets but I always saw the many positives in their roles, and would have been very happy to have flown in those roles.
Lighten up Beagle.
I never understand why some always choose to talk down about certain roles within the military. I never wanted to fly helis or jets but I always saw the many positives in their roles, and would have been very happy to have flown in those roles.
Lighten up Beagle.
Beagle, as you mentioned Wegburg, I was reminded of Ely, Nocton Hall and Wroughton as happy hunting grounds though I was never sure who was the hunter and who was the hunted 
Easy Street, I'm glad that at least one person understands!
I joined with the idea of completing a full career, so good were the opportunities back then. But those who wrote comment such as:
clearly thought otherwise. And it was a mere 6 years ago when you posted that, eh juliet? Things seem to have worsened considerably since then - hardly a matter over which one would 'lighten up'.
I joined with the idea of completing a full career, so good were the opportunities back then. But those who wrote comment such as:
I've been in for 5 years, 4 of those front line multi. I would leave tomorrow if I thought that I would be allowed to. As it stands I've another 2 1/2 years to do to fullfil my return of service. I am undervalued, taken advantage of and not respected. Why would I stay?
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: uk
Posts: 277
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Beagle, I was commenting on your propensity to slag off trucky types. And I stand by my comments of 6 years ago, but that doesnt mean that I didn't have a hell of a lot of fun amidst all the crap!
Beagle, as you mentioned Wegburg, I was reminded of Ely, Nocton Hall and Wroughton as happy hunting grounds though I was never sure who was the hunter and who was the hunted
Last edited by brakedwell; 29th Jul 2011 at 09:35.
Obviously never been to a party at Lousy Maggie's -Princess Louise Margaret's Military Hospital at Aldeshot - I was there the night the guys returned from Rhodesia after running the Reception centres when the terrorists came out of the bush. These guys, all 2nd Lts as I recall, reckoned they were lucky to have come back - hell of a party!
I expect the next set of PVRs to start soon as those holding out for Tranche 3 redundancy on AFPS75 will be now dissappointed - 9 months severence pay going down to 3 months...
Still, at least they reversed the leave policy today so that you can now carry over 15 days a year - as we always used to.
I can honestly say that I have never known such a crock of cr@p as I have in the past year. When I PVRd recently, you get the chance to give 4 reasons why you have on JPA; pay and allowances, terms of service and lack of stability were in my top three.
I fear I will be just ahead of a very big bow-wave...
LJ
Still, at least they reversed the leave policy today so that you can now carry over 15 days a year - as we always used to.
I can honestly say that I have never known such a crock of cr@p as I have in the past year. When I PVRd recently, you get the chance to give 4 reasons why you have on JPA; pay and allowances, terms of service and lack of stability were in my top three.
I fear I will be just ahead of a very big bow-wave...
LJ
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Scotland
Posts: 217
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Leon you reckon we will have a Tranche 3 ? With the amount of PVRs flying about at the moment surely they are going to reduce the numbers required by that time. I expect many to bang in the PVRs come Sept 1st when those that dont get redundency as expected will just leave anyway.
God knows whats going to happen, it changes everyday
God knows whats going to happen, it changes everyday
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Great Britain
Age: 51
Posts: 340
Likes: 0
Received 11 Likes
on
5 Posts
I've just noticed that the Commutation advice booklet MMP/107 has been removed from the MoD website (under pensions).
I smell something fishy going on...
CPL Clott
I smell something fishy going on...
CPL Clott
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Several miles SSW of Watford Gap
Posts: 596
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The 31 March 2013 date (after which AFRS10 compensation payments were reduced from a max of 9 months pay to a max of 3 months pay) was changed to 31 December 2015 by Statutory Instrument 2011 No.208,
Details are in 2011DIN01-056.
Sorry Biggus
Details are in 2011DIN01-056.
Sorry Biggus
Last edited by Climebear; 4th Aug 2011 at 09:17.
A couple of points:
LJ
The implementation of the change in "severence pay" from 9 to 3 months you refer to has been delayed until 2015. Post 26 of this thread
http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...delayed-2.html
gives details.
RumPunch
I have heard from several sources that the redundancy offer has not been oversubscribed, indeed only about 50% of those leaving in tranche 1 will have volunteered. Therefore I doubt that there will be a large number of PVRs going in on Sept 1, as most people who have applied for redundancy should get it...... Pilots being the one possible exception, there being no pilot slots offered for redundancy.
RATS - just pipped to the post by Climebear!!!
LJ
The implementation of the change in "severence pay" from 9 to 3 months you refer to has been delayed until 2015. Post 26 of this thread
http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...delayed-2.html
gives details.
RumPunch
I have heard from several sources that the redundancy offer has not been oversubscribed, indeed only about 50% of those leaving in tranche 1 will have volunteered. Therefore I doubt that there will be a large number of PVRs going in on Sept 1, as most people who have applied for redundancy should get it...... Pilots being the one possible exception, there being no pilot slots offered for redundancy.
RATS - just pipped to the post by Climebear!!!
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Europe
Posts: 414
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Biggus, there are some people not in tranche 1 hoping to be in tranche 2, if they are not they may well jump. By delaying tranche 2 I would guess that the PVR rush in September will not happen, instead it will spread out as some will have had enough now but others still have to prepare their escape plans.
The 50% figure is fairly accurate. The one surprising figure is that about 150 volunteers have been turned down.
Information about those individuals selected is being sent to CO's soon for time to see how it effects units etc before individuals are informed.
I think it has been stated before but these peopel cannot be 'replaced' as such
Information about those individuals selected is being sent to CO's soon for time to see how it effects units etc before individuals are informed.
I think it has been stated before but these peopel cannot be 'replaced' as such