Flying in the Navy
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DOesnt get lonely on a Lynx Flight, yes there are only 2 of you, but that is all it takes to keep the fisheads in their box 
Incidentally was in the SE section yesterday having some stuff done and a Stovie came in looking for his helmet. He said it was size small!!! Killick behind the desk did comment when he went that a Stovie without a big head was an oxymoron - I didnt say a word!!!
Incidentally was in the SE section yesterday having some stuff done and a Stovie came in looking for his helmet. He said it was size small!!! Killick behind the desk did comment when he went that a Stovie without a big head was an oxymoron - I didnt say a word!!!
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So there are some junglies out there! thought you'd all be off ferrying booties found warmer climes 
snafu, you obviously haven't got your cabbage hat, otherwise, in addition to raving about the joys of flying around 'kin massive hills in cack vis at night on nvgs,
you'd be espousing the virtues of snow cave life as well! 
call me a wimp if you like but over the oggin there's only other a/c and ships to hit at night. (bit less chance of meeting a jolly unfriendly chap with some sort of AA gun/missile as well)
snafu, you obviously haven't got your cabbage hat, otherwise, in addition to raving about the joys of flying around 'kin massive hills in cack vis at night on nvgs,
you'd be espousing the virtues of snow cave life as well! call me a wimp if you like but over the oggin there's only other a/c and ships to hit at night. (bit less chance of meeting a jolly unfriendly chap with some sort of AA gun/missile as well)
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snafu said:
Sorry OldPinger, but while Sir might not live in a trench, neither do the Junglies!
Purple Helmet USA `96
Crabs living in sh^t named "Tenko" after the jap POW TV series, but the junglies lived in sleeping bags under trees watching the cottonmouth wrigglies sliding by.
Perhaps not a trench then, but not exactly a 5* Best bit of the exercise was when a crab bent a SKing big time.
T_M
Sorry OldPinger, but while Sir might not live in a trench, neither do the Junglies!
Purple Helmet USA `96
Crabs living in sh^t named "Tenko" after the jap POW TV series, but the junglies lived in sleeping bags under trees watching the cottonmouth wrigglies sliding by.
Perhaps not a trench then, but not exactly a 5* Best bit of the exercise was when a crab bent a SKing big time.
T_M
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T-M
Oops, I stand corrected, when in doubt, read the F###ing post before replying I suppose!!
Why is it crabs are so good at bending/blowing up navy kit? remember the Ark Royal vs Practice bomb- (bomb1, ship nil)
Oops, I stand corrected, when in doubt, read the F###ing post before replying I suppose!!
Why is it crabs are so good at bending/blowing up navy kit? remember the Ark Royal vs Practice bomb- (bomb1, ship nil)
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Why is it crabs are so good at bending/blowing up navy kit? remember the Ark Royal vs Practice bomb- (bomb1, ship nil)
Sadly not always the case! Chinook aft wheels make ***** arrestor hooks
Felt sorry for the booty having a fag below aft as the CH47 wheels did a low overshoot minus their host airframe.
Sadly not always the case! Chinook aft wheels make ***** arrestor hooks
Felt sorry for the booty having a fag below aft as the CH47 wheels did a low overshoot minus their host airframe.
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Snafu, you'll find that there are pingers flying low on nvg, doing troop drops, flying under wires and bridges and going to norway on a regular basis. We call these things secondary roles. We are always surprised to find that junglies consider them to be an entire job!
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The sooner you dark blue chaps buy Chinooks with folding fans the sooner the real workers can get back on shore and cut out all this rum, bum and baccy carry-on. Many moons ago a very astute recruiter told me he didn't think the RN was for me (how right); so how come I keep dreaming of some psychopath dragging chains around on the floor above? That's enough rambling.
Ref: the original post - you definitely want to go driver 'cos you get to face forward with a nice view, and a nice handy door if you have to ditch; and Junglie 'cos they don't have O****vers telling them what to do
Ref: the original post - you definitely want to go driver 'cos you get to face forward with a nice view, and a nice handy door if you have to ditch; and Junglie 'cos they don't have O****vers telling them what to do
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If they offer Observer, politely decline because if you have passed the aptitudes and get chopped you can always retread Observer. sadly the reverse is not true.
Flying the Lynx is probably the best all round job I had, OK the fish-heads are nobbers but then we get to escape the nausea quite often and they dont relly know how to cope with 'eccentric' aviators. Bringing the mail gets you beers in every mess and there is no senior pilot to steal the jollies.
OK, low level at night getting back to the steamer on a shi**y night is not much fun (NVG's do not help that much).
My advice, for what it's worth, is to go Sea Kings first tour and then Lynx second as you will have the experience to hold your own at Sea and have had the benefit of big squadron life in which to make all the early mistakes; learn how to destroy a wardroom with style and absorb the culture which makes our song book very apt. The book HMS Leviathan neatly encapsulates carrier life.
Once you have the 2 types under your belt then you can choose to go beefing.
Dont let the Junglie/Pinger bit get in the way, franky there is not a Rizzlas thickness between the two. Recently, being a Pinger has been the more sought after as the predictability of Ship deployments whilst not certain, is far far more reliable than last minute deployments to the Adriatic or other 'hot' spots.
Whatever you choose you will be sure to have a varied and interesting career with some terriffic people who still adhere to the work hard , play hard ethos. For me the Fleet Air Arm was the best Rugby club I was alowed to join.
Equally, you will end up being a far more rounded and personable character so that should you desire a career change in later life will find that you are surprisingly well equipped for life outside the pusser. My experience is that not all the services can boast that.
I shall now don a flak jacket and retire!
Flying the Lynx is probably the best all round job I had, OK the fish-heads are nobbers but then we get to escape the nausea quite often and they dont relly know how to cope with 'eccentric' aviators. Bringing the mail gets you beers in every mess and there is no senior pilot to steal the jollies.
OK, low level at night getting back to the steamer on a shi**y night is not much fun (NVG's do not help that much).
My advice, for what it's worth, is to go Sea Kings first tour and then Lynx second as you will have the experience to hold your own at Sea and have had the benefit of big squadron life in which to make all the early mistakes; learn how to destroy a wardroom with style and absorb the culture which makes our song book very apt. The book HMS Leviathan neatly encapsulates carrier life.
Once you have the 2 types under your belt then you can choose to go beefing.
Dont let the Junglie/Pinger bit get in the way, franky there is not a Rizzlas thickness between the two. Recently, being a Pinger has been the more sought after as the predictability of Ship deployments whilst not certain, is far far more reliable than last minute deployments to the Adriatic or other 'hot' spots.
Whatever you choose you will be sure to have a varied and interesting career with some terriffic people who still adhere to the work hard , play hard ethos. For me the Fleet Air Arm was the best Rugby club I was alowed to join.
Equally, you will end up being a far more rounded and personable character so that should you desire a career change in later life will find that you are surprisingly well equipped for life outside the pusser. My experience is that not all the services can boast that.
I shall now don a flak jacket and retire!
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Well thanks for all the input, I have been reading all of them with fascination.
I am waiting to switch recruitment places atm, and they will be in touch shortly.
Thanks for the offers of help, and will be in contact with those that have offered if the need arises.
All I can say is keep these posts coming, certainly a fascination thread!.
Fly safe
Sagey
I am waiting to switch recruitment places atm, and they will be in touch shortly.
Thanks for the offers of help, and will be in contact with those that have offered if the need arises.
All I can say is keep these posts coming, certainly a fascination thread!.
Fly safe
Sagey
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Have to agree with Sagey on this one. Been hooked reading this thread!
Seems to be a bit of a bias towards rotary! I know this is reflected in the Navy, but I'd also like to hear about fixed wing aviation in the FAA.
How are you streamed? Is it the top 99% of any intake through Dartmouth, or is it, to a degree, down to preference?
Just one more question. At the AIB, how could you convince those that matter that you wanted to join the Navy when you already have a rejected application from the RAF?
Would appreciate the input folks.
Seems to be a bit of a bias towards rotary! I know this is reflected in the Navy, but I'd also like to hear about fixed wing aviation in the FAA.
How are you streamed? Is it the top 99% of any intake through Dartmouth, or is it, to a degree, down to preference?
Just one more question. At the AIB, how could you convince those that matter that you wanted to join the Navy when you already have a rejected application from the RAF?
Would appreciate the input folks.
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Funny old thing it being bias towards rotary! Something to do with the large number of helo aircrew, as opposed to the very small number of Fw aircrew in the Navy! (which incidentally have been given to the air farce anyway!)
You get streamed on a mixture on your ability/aptitude and the logistics of bums on seats and spaces available. It is nothing to do with Dartmouth - the flying instructors at JEFTS decide which have the aptitude to go fixed wing - 1 or 2 per course. The ones with crew concept, good looks and team spirit get to fly rotary
Easiest way to get through the AIB is to be yourself! If you dont pass, then the job isnt for you probably. The Navy will expect more on the leadership side than our air farce collegues as when you are at the sharp end, you are quite literally all in the same boat so no - oh I possibly couldnt do that, I am just here to fly attitude.
You get streamed on a mixture on your ability/aptitude and the logistics of bums on seats and spaces available. It is nothing to do with Dartmouth - the flying instructors at JEFTS decide which have the aptitude to go fixed wing - 1 or 2 per course. The ones with crew concept, good looks and team spirit get to fly rotary
Easiest way to get through the AIB is to be yourself! If you dont pass, then the job isnt for you probably. The Navy will expect more on the leadership side than our air farce collegues as when you are at the sharp end, you are quite literally all in the same boat
so no - oh I possibly couldnt do that, I am just here to fly attitude.
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Sagey...
have been reading the thread, and jut wanted to say that I went down to Cranwell for selection in about '94, and after the board, having strongly made my case for pilot, I waited. About nine months (defence reviews apparently) later I was offered Nav. Unsure about all this I asked for an interview with the Wing Commander about what to do. In no uncertain terms I was told that I should take the bursary through university I was offered, as it was a 'foot in the door' and a branch change was easy. I probably should have taped the conversation, as in the four years I was attempting a branch NOTHING happenned.
Sure, give them what they want to hear, but remember what it is that YOU want, and until they hand you the bit of paper saying yes, then don't sign.
I'm probably sounding bitter here, I don't mean to, I left because I couldn't get the pilot slot I wanted, and was chopped because I couldn't be arsed doing a job I had been tricked into doing. All a free-will thing and I thouroughly enjoyed my time in the forces, made load of great mates anddon't regret it at all.
I would give at least a digit or two for a crack at pilot, but if reintatement as nav was offered I wouldnt take it.
Cue rants from loads of navs who love their jobs...
Good on ya, I couldn't cope with having to put my CDs in alphabetical order (Joke).
All I'm trying to say is that if you want something really badly only take that, and don't be pressured into what they want - If you are offered observer (and you didn't arse up your tests,) they're probably hoping that if offered, you'll accept the banter seat. Give it all, and remember, they need you more than you need them.
Best of luck..
Edited because my S key is knackered. Was going to write $tuck but I can't $pell it.
If I've mis5ed a few, here are a few to 5catter around!
SSss5$$
[ 12 October 2001: Message edited by: Frank Spenny ]
have been reading the thread, and jut wanted to say that I went down to Cranwell for selection in about '94, and after the board, having strongly made my case for pilot, I waited. About nine months (defence reviews apparently) later I was offered Nav. Unsure about all this I asked for an interview with the Wing Commander about what to do. In no uncertain terms I was told that I should take the bursary through university I was offered, as it was a 'foot in the door' and a branch change was easy. I probably should have taped the conversation, as in the four years I was attempting a branch NOTHING happenned.
Sure, give them what they want to hear, but remember what it is that YOU want, and until they hand you the bit of paper saying yes, then don't sign.
I'm probably sounding bitter here, I don't mean to, I left because I couldn't get the pilot slot I wanted, and was chopped because I couldn't be arsed doing a job I had been tricked into doing. All a free-will thing and I thouroughly enjoyed my time in the forces, made load of great mates anddon't regret it at all.
I would give at least a digit or two for a crack at pilot, but if reintatement as nav was offered I wouldnt take it.
Cue rants from loads of navs who love their jobs...
Good on ya, I couldn't cope with having to put my CDs in alphabetical order (Joke).
All I'm trying to say is that if you want something really badly only take that, and don't be pressured into what they want - If you are offered observer (and you didn't arse up your tests,) they're probably hoping that if offered, you'll accept the banter seat. Give it all, and remember, they need you more than you need them.
Best of luck..
Edited because my S key is knackered. Was going to write $tuck but I can't $pell it.
If I've mis5ed a few, here are a few to 5catter around!
SSss5$$
[ 12 October 2001: Message edited by: Frank Spenny ]
Military Wannabees....
Not sure if its been mentioned before on this thread but one of the most important snippets of advice for both shades of blue AIB's, is when the, (totally loaded), question 'if in the unlikely case we are unable to offer you pilot, are you willing to accept nav/obs?' the answer has to be 'no sir', unless of course, you genuinely are!
Not sure if its been mentioned before on this thread but one of the most important snippets of advice for both shades of blue AIB's, is when the, (totally loaded), question 'if in the unlikely case we are unable to offer you pilot, are you willing to accept nav/obs?' the answer has to be 'no sir', unless of course, you genuinely are!
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Once again all the advice seems to be hold your ground on requesting pilot, rather than anything else they offer. And don't fool for the in 3 years you can change routine either.
Will just have to keep fingers crossed it will all work out ok, and make sure I know enough about the RN Fleet!.
Sagey
Will just have to keep fingers crossed it will all work out ok, and make sure I know enough about the RN Fleet!.
Sagey
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Sagey and Tim C...
There's obviously been a lot of good advice and info in this thread. What you have seen is a wide cross section of the FAA all giving you their perspective and selling the merits of each aviation job. (I'm an observer but my two points are not role specific:
Firstly, the AIB/selection tests probably have changed since many of us did them all those dog watches ago! But, a couple of things will be the same; A broad view of military/current affairs is essential and
irrespective of the type of leadership test, the selectors will be looking for common sense and stacks of enthusiasm.
Finally,(sorry if this repeats any comments in the thread) the advice given by those of us currently serving is obviously a present day viewpoint. Your career will hopefully span one of the most exciting development periods that the RN and FAA will have experienced in our generation. New Carriers, Future Combat Aircraft replacing the Sea Harrier, AEW Mk7 coming on-line and progressing down the Future Organic AEW route, continuing introduction of the Merlin and Lynx replacement(?). All of this kit will be cutting edge for once and not put together on the back of 20 Benson and Hedges.
What I'm saying is, don't just focus on what we have now, but look at what fixed/rotary/pilots/observers will be doing over the next 15 years or so and where you'd like to fit in (this will also demonstrate forward thinking on your part during AIB interviews).
Good luck in whichever specialisation you choose...see you in the bar!
There's obviously been a lot of good advice and info in this thread. What you have seen is a wide cross section of the FAA all giving you their perspective and selling the merits of each aviation job. (I'm an observer but my two points are not role specific:
Firstly, the AIB/selection tests probably have changed since many of us did them all those dog watches ago! But, a couple of things will be the same; A broad view of military/current affairs is essential and
irrespective of the type of leadership test, the selectors will be looking for common sense and stacks of enthusiasm.
Finally,(sorry if this repeats any comments in the thread) the advice given by those of us currently serving is obviously a present day viewpoint. Your career will hopefully span one of the most exciting development periods that the RN and FAA will have experienced in our generation. New Carriers, Future Combat Aircraft replacing the Sea Harrier, AEW Mk7 coming on-line and progressing down the Future Organic AEW route, continuing introduction of the Merlin and Lynx replacement(?). All of this kit will be cutting edge for once and not put together on the back of 20 Benson and Hedges.
What I'm saying is, don't just focus on what we have now, but look at what fixed/rotary/pilots/observers will be doing over the next 15 years or so and where you'd like to fit in (this will also demonstrate forward thinking on your part during AIB interviews).
Good luck in whichever specialisation you choose...see you in the bar!
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Hi again
Unfortunately I have been told I cannot apply for observer as my eyesight is not good enough as the requirement for obs is the same as for pilot(?). I was classed as S2 (was actually borderline S1/S2) in my most recent eye test.
I have, however, been told that my eyesight is good enough for the warfare branch (which was my 2nd choice). So I have decided to go for that, hopefully specialising as a Hydrographic, Oceanographic and Meteorological Officer. I know that this is probably the wrong place to ask about this job, but does anyone have any views/experience of it?
Thanks for all the advice
Unfortunately I have been told I cannot apply for observer as my eyesight is not good enough as the requirement for obs is the same as for pilot(?). I was classed as S2 (was actually borderline S1/S2) in my most recent eye test.
I have, however, been told that my eyesight is good enough for the warfare branch (which was my 2nd choice). So I have decided to go for that, hopefully specialising as a Hydrographic, Oceanographic and Meteorological Officer. I know that this is probably the wrong place to ask about this job, but does anyone have any views/experience of it?
Thanks for all the advice
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Sagey,
Fixed wing selection is indeed still done at JEFTS. Everyone does their 60 hr training on the basis that everyone is going rotary and then only towards the end of the course are things more finely assesed. It is indeed a small number that make it through. In the year I went through I think there were only in the region of 6-8 selected. If you think they put through about 60 people a year, its not a great deal. Then you pop off and join the RAF for the next two years and follow their fast jet system, although rumour has been rife that Canada is being viewed as a serious addition to the Navy's fast jet training capability in view of pilot numbers being required for JSF introduction.
What's interesting is how people, throughout the course, change their focus. Initially most people would love to give jets a crack, but after a while motivation drops off considerably and a lot just want to go to choppers. But, not for me to judge why.
Tim C....
sorry about the eyesight situation. With the warfare stuff. You will get plenty of time at Dartmouth to experience each sector thru motivation briefs etc. There is a lot to do before you get the choice....some say that you don't, especially when there is a requirement for sub drivers. Be very prepared for fishead banter, cos aircrew will give you a lot of grief!!!!
Good luck to both of you.
Fixed wing selection is indeed still done at JEFTS. Everyone does their 60 hr training on the basis that everyone is going rotary and then only towards the end of the course are things more finely assesed. It is indeed a small number that make it through. In the year I went through I think there were only in the region of 6-8 selected. If you think they put through about 60 people a year, its not a great deal. Then you pop off and join the RAF for the next two years and follow their fast jet system, although rumour has been rife that Canada is being viewed as a serious addition to the Navy's fast jet training capability in view of pilot numbers being required for JSF introduction.
What's interesting is how people, throughout the course, change their focus. Initially most people would love to give jets a crack, but after a while motivation drops off considerably and a lot just want to go to choppers. But, not for me to judge why.
Tim C....
sorry about the eyesight situation. With the warfare stuff. You will get plenty of time at Dartmouth to experience each sector thru motivation briefs etc. There is a lot to do before you get the choice....some say that you don't, especially when there is a requirement for sub drivers. Be very prepared for fishead banter, cos aircrew will give you a lot of grief!!!!
Good luck to both of you.
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I stand to be corrected, but I was recently told that in the past decade, only 11 ab-initio pilots have gone fixed wing front line straight through. All the rest have been ex rotary guys converting later.
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Tourist,
I suspect you may be correct with reference to those who have made it all the way through to the frontline without mishap. Sounds shocking though - that's not very many.
I was just talking about who got selected from jefts or UAS.
[ 14 October 2001: Message edited by: Wasted ]
I suspect you may be correct with reference to those who have made it all the way through to the frontline without mishap. Sounds shocking though - that's not very many.
I was just talking about who got selected from jefts or UAS.
[ 14 October 2001: Message edited by: Wasted ]