Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
ShyTorque - I don't believe I have said in any of my 'puerile holier than thou' posts that the FBH QHIs shouldn't get a fair wage. As Biggus said, they are entitled to take strike action so that's what they are doing - if it is the only way they can get paid at an 'industry acceptable' level then so be it. But how many other jobs in commercial aviation are in such a protected environment instructing good quality (generally) students in a good quality and well maintained aircraft. Not even I can get lost in LFA 9 and there is no commercial pressure to fly when the wx is bad - the military make the weather decisions.
As for expecting parity with the military guys - OK - go on OOA detachments, serve on the front line, do all the crap secondary duties, do station duties. I believe Shawbury, for most mil guys (with a few exceptions) is a brief respite between front line duties.
For info Shy - I escaped the collapse of 2 FTS into DHFS after instructing at Strawberry for 4 years while quite a few of my mates jumped ship to join DHFS as civvies.
Quite happy with my life thanks.
As for expecting parity with the military guys - OK - go on OOA detachments, serve on the front line, do all the crap secondary duties, do station duties. I believe Shawbury, for most mil guys (with a few exceptions) is a brief respite between front line duties.
For info Shy - I escaped the collapse of 2 FTS into DHFS after instructing at Strawberry for 4 years while quite a few of my mates jumped ship to join DHFS as civvies.
Quite happy with my life thanks.
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Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
Getting close now to the results - BALPA ballot result out in the morning (Wednesday), Engineers cancelled their strike today, decided one day not enough to convince the management how serious they are - management got a little smug on the last one day strikes effectiveness - so 2 days next week followed by 3 days the week after if they still don't get treated seriously, and get towards a sensible offer. A good result from the Balpa members will help to focus the managements mind a little more on Wednesday - watch this space! From what I can pick up the sense of determination is solid from both unions - one day the management will realise this and think of a better way to solve this impass, rather than bury their head in the sand and not communicate with the workforce, hoping it will all go away. Bad press for the whole company really - not good for the future bidding wars.
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Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
Link to the technician vacancies here http://www.fbheliservices.com/FBH/Vacancy_Shaw_Tech.htm
Though surprisingly the 'latest news' on the FBH website appears to be this
http://www.fbheliservices.com/FBH/Skeeter2.htm
and absolutely no mention of any industrial relations nightmares anywhere!
BALPA strike ballot result expected sometime tomorrow, as swerve said. Got notified 'bout a meeting after work tomorrow, probably to discuss the result and plan the action ahead. Watch this space
Though surprisingly the 'latest news' on the FBH website appears to be this
http://www.fbheliservices.com/FBH/Skeeter2.htm
and absolutely no mention of any industrial relations nightmares anywhere!
BALPA strike ballot result expected sometime tomorrow, as swerve said. Got notified 'bout a meeting after work tomorrow, probably to discuss the result and plan the action ahead. Watch this space
Last edited by aytoo; 10th Jan 2006 at 22:51.
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Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
"As for expecting parity with the military guys - OK - go on OOA detachments, serve on the front line, do all the crap secondary duties, do station duties. I believe Shawbury, for most mil guys (with a few exceptions) is a brief respite between front line duties."
Don't forget that the QHIs at DHFS have already done their share.
I have, by various means, sneaked a look at some alternative payscales. If the quoted £39K is accurate, it is off the bottom of the scale of one well known N. Sea operator and roughly equivalent to the salary of a 1500 to 2000 hour co-pilot for the other. Any of these guys, suitably equipped with a shiny new ATPL/IR could be quickly employable as a captain.
One well-known onshore operator was paying £8k more for a brand new captain. Three years ago.
These DHFS guys are highly experienced and skilled pilots and it seems they aren't getting paid anywhere near the market rate. Some of them will walk.
That's business. It's got nothing to do with a perception of parity with military pilots.
Don't forget that the QHIs at DHFS have already done their share.
I have, by various means, sneaked a look at some alternative payscales. If the quoted £39K is accurate, it is off the bottom of the scale of one well known N. Sea operator and roughly equivalent to the salary of a 1500 to 2000 hour co-pilot for the other. Any of these guys, suitably equipped with a shiny new ATPL/IR could be quickly employable as a captain.
One well-known onshore operator was paying £8k more for a brand new captain. Three years ago.
These DHFS guys are highly experienced and skilled pilots and it seems they aren't getting paid anywhere near the market rate. Some of them will walk.
That's business. It's got nothing to do with a perception of parity with military pilots.
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Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
Originally Posted by serf
Well leave then and find another job!
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Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
The result is out..
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/s...re/4601278.stm
94% of those who voted were in favour of a strike. My my,things must be bad down there!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/s...re/4601278.stm
94% of those who voted were in favour of a strike. My my,things must be bad down there!
Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
According to that news report even the military instructors at Shawbury are only on £36k to £47k. As ShyTorque noted, that's not even a brand new onshore captains salary 3 years ago.
Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
So after 111 posts, there really does seem to be a strike imminent. Finally.
CG
Who's gonna churn this year's 300 out now then?
CG
CG
Who's gonna churn this year's 300 out now then?
CG
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Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
Great Fantastic!
I live at Shawbury and we are so pleased the sods are going on strike, we might get a nights sleep now, bloody helicopters are like flies around a cow's bum!
Joking aside.
You had your chance to stay in the mob earning a military pay and you blew it for an easy life as a civvy with no OOA, secondary duties and mil crap. No doubt you are all reaping the benefits of a nice fat juicy pension?
Get back to work you lightweight tossers!
I live at Shawbury and we are so pleased the sods are going on strike, we might get a nights sleep now, bloody helicopters are like flies around a cow's bum!
Joking aside.
You had your chance to stay in the mob earning a military pay and you blew it for an easy life as a civvy with no OOA, secondary duties and mil crap. No doubt you are all reaping the benefits of a nice fat juicy pension?
Get back to work you lightweight tossers!
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Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
LOVE the quotes from "a good headin" above - forgot one basic point - Tosser- your profile shows you as a brit mil air trafficer!!! perhaps all those helicopters flying around due to your poor controlling - why do you live in Shawbury village next to an airfield? oh sorry forgot you are probably living in subsidised accommodation there paid for by the MOD, so can not possibly understand the cut and thrust of the real world, where normal people are paying real prices to live! enjoy your next posting (if your bad back,leg head etc can allow you to be posted) then one day I would love to welcome you to the real world.
Meanwhile good luck to the BALPA guys there who deserve a sensible pay rise for a unique job they do!
Fact - most ATC types are failed aircrew, wanabe pilots!!! Most pilots could with training be airtrafficers, most airtrafficers could be_ _ _ _ airtrafficers - nuf baiting
Meanwhile good luck to the BALPA guys there who deserve a sensible pay rise for a unique job they do!
Fact - most ATC types are failed aircrew, wanabe pilots!!! Most pilots could with training be airtrafficers, most airtrafficers could be_ _ _ _ airtrafficers - nuf baiting
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Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
"Get back to work you lightweight tossers!"
Have to agree with that comment. Geographical stability is worth £5k pa IMHO along with the prospect of living in one house in a desirable location (as opposed to Aberdeen); able to make long term plans that PMA have no input to, and having little or no secondary duties along with a 'part time' work schedule in which many of you disappear long before 5 pm.
DHFS civvies do not work in a commercial environment where an employer extracts the last drop of blood for their pounds£ They live a privileged lifestyle of military ethos (ish) without the nausea bits and with a pension on top.
The BALPA woman on BBC TV this evening made my blood boil demanding that you get parity to military crews, you forfeited that right (as I did) the day you handed in your F1250 or RN / Army service equivalent.
...and at this time of year when none of the military guys have any leave left your absence for a day or two will be un-noticed. Middle August may have been different but I hope that this leads to the cancellation of MFTS and military plc being reinstated at DHFS. If the outside world is so rosey, will the last one out switch the lights off.
Have to agree with that comment. Geographical stability is worth £5k pa IMHO along with the prospect of living in one house in a desirable location (as opposed to Aberdeen); able to make long term plans that PMA have no input to, and having little or no secondary duties along with a 'part time' work schedule in which many of you disappear long before 5 pm.
DHFS civvies do not work in a commercial environment where an employer extracts the last drop of blood for their pounds£ They live a privileged lifestyle of military ethos (ish) without the nausea bits and with a pension on top.
The BALPA woman on BBC TV this evening made my blood boil demanding that you get parity to military crews, you forfeited that right (as I did) the day you handed in your F1250 or RN / Army service equivalent.
...and at this time of year when none of the military guys have any leave left your absence for a day or two will be un-noticed. Middle August may have been different but I hope that this leads to the cancellation of MFTS and military plc being reinstated at DHFS. If the outside world is so rosey, will the last one out switch the lights off.
Tightgit
Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
According to that news report even the military instructors at Shawbury are only on £36k to £47k. As ShyTorque noted, that's not even a brand new onshore captains salary 3 years ago.
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Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
Not for pilots with the experience that these people have and there is a shortage of experienced onshore captains (watch out for another operator soon to advertise for more pilots). Most of these chaps could be earning a lot more money within a year.
If they DO decide to move on, as some small minded posters here suggest, who will replace them?
757 pilots? I doubt that one as they would take a salary CUT. Or some of those pontificating from inside the military?
If they DO decide to move on, as some small minded posters here suggest, who will replace them?
757 pilots? I doubt that one as they would take a salary CUT. Or some of those pontificating from inside the military?
Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
Shy Tq, you talk nonsense. Try getting an onshore job at the salary you mention, go and ask PAS, BAS etc what they get paid.
As for offshore, you have NO chance of starting as a captain, no matter how good you think you are, it is all done on seniority, adhered to rigidly.
I know plenty of people, most of them probably at Shawbury who would who would take a job there, because it is so cushy.
As for offshore, you have NO chance of starting as a captain, no matter how good you think you are, it is all done on seniority, adhered to rigidly.
I know plenty of people, most of them probably at Shawbury who would who would take a job there, because it is so cushy.
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Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
I hope that the strike is successful, high profile and politically embarrassing.
Because that's the only way to prove that 'outsourcing' and 'PFI's and all the other phrases that mean cutting costs or standards do not work in an environment when you have to rely on your personnel being more than an average workforce.
Because that's the only way to prove that 'outsourcing' and 'PFI's and all the other phrases that mean cutting costs or standards do not work in an environment when you have to rely on your personnel being more than an average workforce.
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Re: Imminent strike at RAF Shawbury?
Serf,
Check your facts before you begin casting aspersions. You seem to be under a misunderstanding of your own making.
Firstly, as you keep referring to me personally, I should point out that I don't work at DHFS; you seem to have added two and two together and come up with five. If you read earlier posts properly you might have spotted that.
Secondly, since leaving the military well over a decade ago, I have never worked there. I WAS a QHI at Shawbury twenty years ago so I do know what the level of effort is. I possibly could have obtained employment at DHFS after becoming a civvie, I looked at the opportunity but chose to go elsewhere.
My facts are correct. Obviously, I know what I earn (more than I would at DHFS) and I also have the BALPA payscales in writing. There are more employers in UK than PAS - I know full well how much they pay (obviously so do you, as you fly a 902, even though you have just changed your profile) but that's not who I referred to. The figure of "£8k more" for an onshore captain I mentioned is a figure quoted on a letter signed by a company chief pilot.
Check your facts before you begin casting aspersions. You seem to be under a misunderstanding of your own making.
Firstly, as you keep referring to me personally, I should point out that I don't work at DHFS; you seem to have added two and two together and come up with five. If you read earlier posts properly you might have spotted that.
Secondly, since leaving the military well over a decade ago, I have never worked there. I WAS a QHI at Shawbury twenty years ago so I do know what the level of effort is. I possibly could have obtained employment at DHFS after becoming a civvie, I looked at the opportunity but chose to go elsewhere.
My facts are correct. Obviously, I know what I earn (more than I would at DHFS) and I also have the BALPA payscales in writing. There are more employers in UK than PAS - I know full well how much they pay (obviously so do you, as you fly a 902, even though you have just changed your profile) but that's not who I referred to. The figure of "£8k more" for an onshore captain I mentioned is a figure quoted on a letter signed by a company chief pilot.
Last edited by ShyTorque; 11th Jan 2006 at 20:41.