ASCOT ops love or hate
But it's not just the Ascot Ops folk......
When I was doing a spell in the Fuerza Aerea Malvinas Air Wing, yet again the mail didn't arrive from Blighty.... Some extremely pi$$ed-off teddies indeed, so we did some delving.
It transpired that the load control people had filled up the Timmy, so that when the crew did their calculations (very low QNH at Brize), the required trip fuel plus the ZFW put them over RTOW. Only solution - reduce the ZFW. So off came the mail...
We needed to sort this, because the rumour had spread that the 'TriStar crew had forgotten the mail'. Clearly bolleaux, but when people are stuck miles away from civilisation spuriously defending the Bennies from the Argentine hordes
, not getting the mail is a very big issue indeed.
But what had made it worse was that an earlier TriShaw had been days late as well due to late dispatch, poor weather in the Malvinas etc......
When I was doing a spell in the Fuerza Aerea Malvinas Air Wing, yet again the mail didn't arrive from Blighty.... Some extremely pi$$ed-off teddies indeed, so we did some delving.
It transpired that the load control people had filled up the Timmy, so that when the crew did their calculations (very low QNH at Brize), the required trip fuel plus the ZFW put them over RTOW. Only solution - reduce the ZFW. So off came the mail...
We needed to sort this, because the rumour had spread that the 'TriStar crew had forgotten the mail'. Clearly bolleaux, but when people are stuck miles away from civilisation spuriously defending the Bennies from the Argentine hordes
, not getting the mail is a very big issue indeed.But what had made it worse was that an earlier TriShaw had been days late as well due to late dispatch, poor weather in the Malvinas etc......
quote:
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decisions were usually correct, although of course at the time we thought they were all idiots!
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So what has actually changed?
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Perhaps that the board that took up a wall in the old old ASCOT ops HQ has been replaced by the same information spread over several A3 sized computer pages? Although information is shared more easily using the electronic system, when you want overall SA sometimes 'The Big Picture' needs to be just that!
That and the people working there are simply chimps at times
. A recent ex-Lyneham bloke who was very able when he was still here argued with one of our Captains about max take-off weight and range, refusing to believe that he couldn't carry the freight and the fuel until the correct jetplan was sent to him!!! Thank heavens for people like MALM G********e. At least when he answered the 'phone there was some practical help on offer.
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decisions were usually correct, although of course at the time we thought they were all idiots!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So what has actually changed?
================================
Perhaps that the board that took up a wall in the old old ASCOT ops HQ has been replaced by the same information spread over several A3 sized computer pages? Although information is shared more easily using the electronic system, when you want overall SA sometimes 'The Big Picture' needs to be just that!
That and the people working there are simply chimps at times
. A recent ex-Lyneham bloke who was very able when he was still here argued with one of our Captains about max take-off weight and range, refusing to believe that he couldn't carry the freight and the fuel until the correct jetplan was sent to him!!! Thank heavens for people like MALM G********e. At least when he answered the 'phone there was some practical help on offer.
Though not having had the privilege of experiencing it myself, I do recognise some of the sentiments and tales on this thread in my father's "Rompers Green" cartoons. If anyone would like to acquaint, or reacquaint, themselves with the series, they are all available at www.rompersgreen.com
-MFK
-MFK
After a typically farcical display by ASCOT's Telephone Answering Branch, I returned to Blighty to charge them with Sabotage.
Wilfully Disrupting Military Ops etc etc
Boss didn't like that charge so subsequent report was diluted to a case of 'poor communications' blah blah
Bull, each telephone request to Ascot Ops was followed by a fax to confirm plans etc, there was no excuse for their lack of AT support - only the fact that the incumbents were negligent and would have been dismissed if they were working in 'civvy' street.
Talking of 'civvy' street, ain't it great!
Wilfully Disrupting Military Ops etc etc
Boss didn't like that charge so subsequent report was diluted to a case of 'poor communications' blah blah
Bull, each telephone request to Ascot Ops was followed by a fax to confirm plans etc, there was no excuse for their lack of AT support - only the fact that the incumbents were negligent and would have been dismissed if they were working in 'civvy' street.
Talking of 'civvy' street, ain't it great!
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I am intrigued by something in the table in Hansard; ZH880 C130J Mk5 Apr 99 675 1,317. 600 hours in 6 years does seem odd and even more odd (to me without the Herc experience) is why so many landings and so few hours? Please explain any one. Thanks. WH
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From UK Serials (link courtesy of the immensely shy Boss Eyed!! 
), it gives:
Airframe SNo 5478
ZH880 Hercules C5
First Flight 12/04/1999, ex N73238
Delivery Date Boscombe Down 22/04/1999
HTH
), it gives:Airframe SNo 5478
ZH880 Hercules C5
First Flight 12/04/1999, ex N73238
Delivery Date Boscombe Down 22/04/1999
HTH
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Jock Pi,
Don't sit on the fence, do you?
Like to know the rumour about being replaced by some aircrew mate. Surely they aren't going to wheel the MALM I replaced in again. Leave the old fellow alone!
I think you will find that ASCOT is slowly losing its aircrew mates to Flt Ops/TG 9. Judging by some of the posts delving back into the good old days before Flt Ops, looks like we can't do much worse (absolutely no disrespect intended to the current ASCOT aircrew mates).
Most grateful you could back up your 'Hate, simple as that' with a recent example or two.
Probably give you a few 'Aircrew, bloody awful' examples aswell. Then again, as always, it's always the odd one or two who spoil it for the rest.
Oh and for those who know me at ASCOT, what a week (or two) to go on leave, eh? How's the aircon coping?
God Bless
Rev I. Tin
Don't sit on the fence, do you?
Like to know the rumour about being replaced by some aircrew mate. Surely they aren't going to wheel the MALM I replaced in again. Leave the old fellow alone!
I think you will find that ASCOT is slowly losing its aircrew mates to Flt Ops/TG 9. Judging by some of the posts delving back into the good old days before Flt Ops, looks like we can't do much worse (absolutely no disrespect intended to the current ASCOT aircrew mates).
Most grateful you could back up your 'Hate, simple as that' with a recent example or two.
Probably give you a few 'Aircrew, bloody awful' examples aswell. Then again, as always, it's always the odd one or two who spoil it for the rest.
Oh and for those who know me at ASCOT, what a week (or two) to go on leave, eh? How's the aircon coping?
God Bless
Rev I. Tin
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Im sure that my memory was of the whole door being dislodged. In fact it was as big a mess as Scroggs glasses in MPA after he "headbutted" A mess cannon projectile during a corridor party!
" Go on, fire it at me, I'll hit it with me baseball bat"
" Go on, fire it at me, I'll hit it with me baseball bat"
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Agree totally Jock Pi. From what we're hearing across the road, the idiots will be thrown out when ASCOT Ops is subsumed in to Brize Ops and the savings of chopping them will allow aircrew to be put on the ops desk to manage both DOC jobs in one (and still only work half as hard or as long as on sqn). From what I hear if OC Ops gets his way ASCOT will die a death in the new year, the non-flight non-ops buffoons will get binned and the ops clerks sent back to flight planning where they belong (there isn't a good looking one worth sending over here). And not a moment too soon in my view. Roll on getting pilots in there to do the job properly - just as long as PMA don't send me!
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Grum Peace Odd
Cant comment on the looks of the "Ops Clerks" in ASCOT myself but hey you never see an ugly front ender do you ?? 
All the females in this world aren't made of wood, the eyes aren't painted on, they don't cry splinters and most certainly don't bath in pledge when it comes to the winged master race. They cant help be drawn to the beautifully cultivated beer bellys, double chins and man tits that frequent Brize.
Glad to see that "Ops Clerks" have a rightful place in your eyes softlad
oh and does it hurt having your head shoved so far up yor own Ar$e?
and the ops clerks sent back to flight planning where they belong (there isn't a good looking one worth sending over here)
All the females in this world aren't made of wood, the eyes aren't painted on, they don't cry splinters and most certainly don't bath in pledge when it comes to the winged master race. They cant help be drawn to the beautifully cultivated beer bellys, double chins and man tits that frequent Brize.
Glad to see that "Ops Clerks" have a rightful place in your eyes softlad
oh and does it hurt having your head shoved so far up yor own Ar$e?
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Bu99er, hurumph, can't let this one go so yes I will bite.......
Whole reason I left the RAF was because of aircrew t0$$ers like Jock Tw@t and Grum Pieces.
When I was 'in' I loathed that condasending term 'Ops Clerks', in all my time in the RAF I never found a trade of 'Ops Clerk', plenty of AATC's/FOA's and OSM's/FOM's though.
I left the RAF I hating it and my job as the SNCO 'Ops Clerk' on a FJ Sqn doing a non job, 6 months down the line I now know that my 22 years in military aviation has been a monumental waste of time and effort. Thankfully now I am happily working as an Ops Controller for a cargo airline doing the job I should have been doing in the RAF in a far more challenging and rewarding environment the RAF could ever offer.
Don't slag off the peeps trying to do a job. Before you berate somebody have a hard look at the training and culture of your organisation and yourself too.
Train the Flt Ops troops properly, and by that I DO NOT mean a 3 day ITOC intro and then the standard RAF OJT numpty training package drawn up by an incompetent. Something meaningful like the FAA Flight Dispatchers licence would be a good starting point.
When you have self important and pompous aircrew hell bent on maintaining their status in concert with the morally and professionally corrupt ATC trade, who are responsible for training and development of FOA's and FOM's but choose to exclusively focus their energies on ATC, it's no wonder that people lack the tools they require to do the job and the motivation to succeed.
You're all a bunch of chisellers
Whole reason I left the RAF was because of aircrew t0$$ers like Jock Tw@t and Grum Pieces.
When I was 'in' I loathed that condasending term 'Ops Clerks', in all my time in the RAF I never found a trade of 'Ops Clerk', plenty of AATC's/FOA's and OSM's/FOM's though.
I left the RAF I hating it and my job as the SNCO 'Ops Clerk' on a FJ Sqn doing a non job, 6 months down the line I now know that my 22 years in military aviation has been a monumental waste of time and effort. Thankfully now I am happily working as an Ops Controller for a cargo airline doing the job I should have been doing in the RAF in a far more challenging and rewarding environment the RAF could ever offer.
Don't slag off the peeps trying to do a job. Before you berate somebody have a hard look at the training and culture of your organisation and yourself too.
Train the Flt Ops troops properly, and by that I DO NOT mean a 3 day ITOC intro and then the standard RAF OJT numpty training package drawn up by an incompetent. Something meaningful like the FAA Flight Dispatchers licence would be a good starting point.
When you have self important and pompous aircrew hell bent on maintaining their status in concert with the morally and professionally corrupt ATC trade, who are responsible for training and development of FOA's and FOM's but choose to exclusively focus their energies on ATC, it's no wonder that people lack the tools they require to do the job and the motivation to succeed.
You're all a bunch of chisellers
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Ops Clerks
I will step gently in to the puddle.
Back in the mists of time it was Ops Clerks and no complaints. We had lots of clerks. Ops Clerks sat in Ops, Admin Clerks sat in the registry etc. Names change but many hang on to the old terms even when they never served at that time.
How to p*ss off the civilian admin is to call them Civil Admin. They have been Civilian Personnel for years but they are still admin wallahs.
The people that do the camp maintenance - some still call them PSA, others learn the name of the first contractor to take over and use that name for ever more.
There is no disrespect intended calling an assistant a clerk.
As for flight planning clerks - where there is one SAC working alone in FP handling notams, new docs etc, they can be working totally unsupervised and are that one essential person in the pre-flight planning phase for ALL flights. If they don't get the notams out or forward the latest docs then they are the weakest link.
Don't knock flight planning; don't take them for granted.
I will step gently in to the puddle.
Back in the mists of time it was Ops Clerks and no complaints. We had lots of clerks. Ops Clerks sat in Ops, Admin Clerks sat in the registry etc. Names change but many hang on to the old terms even when they never served at that time.
How to p*ss off the civilian admin is to call them Civil Admin. They have been Civilian Personnel for years but they are still admin wallahs.
The people that do the camp maintenance - some still call them PSA, others learn the name of the first contractor to take over and use that name for ever more.
There is no disrespect intended calling an assistant a clerk.
As for flight planning clerks - where there is one SAC working alone in FP handling notams, new docs etc, they can be working totally unsupervised and are that one essential person in the pre-flight planning phase for ALL flights. If they don't get the notams out or forward the latest docs then they are the weakest link.
Don't knock flight planning; don't take them for granted.
Reinventing the wheel, the main reason for moving the 'Sons of Fun' out of OPs was to get more aircrew flying. I worked in many an Ops Room wher some of the 'Aircrew' hadn't flown for over 10 years. Still not sure about the 'FOTS' (failed other trades), but give them a chance. Finally if you move the 'Ops Clerks' out of Ops who is going to, make the tea. display the NOTAMs, answer the phone, start your computer, finish your crossword and all the other things that FOA's do. If you want to go into Ops relinquish your Flying Pay.
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Misrepresentation
DK338 Quote "Whole reason I left the RAF was because of aircrew t0$$ers like Jock Tw@t and Grum Pieces".
Shouldn't that read "to$$ers" rather than "aircrew to$$ers" I hate to be picky but not all aircrew are arrogant wank$rs. This sounds like you have a chip on the old shoulder about aircrew fullstop. There is a VAST difference between FJ Squadrons and Truckie Squadrons. At Lyneham we had a pretty good relationship in all aspects when I was there. SD
Shouldn't that read "to$$ers" rather than "aircrew to$$ers" I hate to be picky but not all aircrew are arrogant wank$rs. This sounds like you have a chip on the old shoulder about aircrew fullstop. There is a VAST difference between FJ Squadrons and Truckie Squadrons. At Lyneham we had a pretty good relationship in all aspects when I was there. SD