The sackings will continue until....
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 92
Likes: 0
From: gutter
So we get fired/demoted now when pax complain?
Make sure you bring that up during the next SEP when they tell the cabin crew that they can press charges against abusive pax and the company will back them up.
Make sure you bring that up during the next SEP when they tell the cabin crew that they can press charges against abusive pax and the company will back them up.
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,835
Likes: 85
From: Boldly going where no split infinitive has gone before..
xkred,
And who will that help?
What's happened is bad because someone has lost their livelyhood. Your solution? See if we can get someone ELSE (Probably a poorly paid guy trying to feed his family on a pittence in a third world country) to lose THEIR job, and hopefully start a tit-fot-tat war in the process.
Pretty petty and not at all helpful....
And who will that help?
What's happened is bad because someone has lost their livelyhood. Your solution? See if we can get someone ELSE (Probably a poorly paid guy trying to feed his family on a pittence in a third world country) to lose THEIR job, and hopefully start a tit-fot-tat war in the process.
Pretty petty and not at all helpful....
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 15
Likes: 0
From: ME
Wisofoz is right, by the way
I have seen some of our new pilots (in the four or five year range), doing many stupid things, both technically and/or socially.
Everyone here must remember that Emirates IS NOT a normal airline in a normal country. Employees are not supported by any laws. Every rule here is to protect the company, not you. They are bound by religion, costumes, and money, money, money. Any real or perceived threat to any of those and you are on your way home. Trust me.
That AS and ED blabber about support is nonsense.
I have seen some of our new pilots (in the four or five year range), doing many stupid things, both technically and/or socially.
Everyone here must remember that Emirates IS NOT a normal airline in a normal country. Employees are not supported by any laws. Every rule here is to protect the company, not you. They are bound by religion, costumes, and money, money, money. Any real or perceived threat to any of those and you are on your way home. Trust me.
That AS and ED blabber about support is nonsense.
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 227
Likes: 0
From: Stratosphere
For perspective, AS and ED's advice that they will support pilots is restricted to supporting that pilot when he/she has done something based on doing the best they can, with responsible use of resources (i.e. info gathering) and making a decision/taking a course of action based on the best info available to him/her.
Not defending anyone in particular, and ignoring the outcomes of some recent events for a second, if you don't follow the rules or take reasonable steps to get all the info relating to the problem, how can you expect support? Not knowing the rules is not a reasonable defence. Anywhere.
Could you defend someone who didn't follow the rules (that's the game we are in) when they had a choice? Like to see you try...
Not defending anyone in particular, and ignoring the outcomes of some recent events for a second, if you don't follow the rules or take reasonable steps to get all the info relating to the problem, how can you expect support? Not knowing the rules is not a reasonable defence. Anywhere.
Could you defend someone who didn't follow the rules (that's the game we are in) when they had a choice? Like to see you try...
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 280
Likes: 7
From: Dubai
Fair enough but...
When you can get fired over a single line of more than 3000 pages of rules...
FCOM 1-2-3-4
QRH
FCTM
OMC
FOM
AFM
MEL
CCEM
Cabin Logbook
Aircraft Logbook
CDL
Aircraft Library
LIDO text Book
LIDO Approach Chart
LIDO En-Route Chart
OPT Manual
Dangerous Good Manual
CAP 413 ( Radio Telephony)
NOTAMS
SIGMETS
Employee Handbook
Every Single Country RULES ( about 80 )
AS WELL AS WITH
FCI (# seventy something)
FCN(# ?)
FTN(??)
Emails: (DL instructions)
Alerts on F.O.I.P
Managements on F.O.I.P
Weekly Reports
My Mint
Vistair
Pelesys
Training Info on F.O.I.P
PLUS...
FCOM Amendments
Temporary Revisions
O.E.B Airbus /Boeing
O.E.B Emirates
FCOM Bulletins
And make sure you are to the standards of...
OMD
FCTP
FTM 1-2
APT 2
Recurrent Manual
Conversion Training Manual
DID I FORGET SOMETHING???????
(Please add what i forgot)
When they say they will back you up if you stay within SOP, they mean all of the above. Like very well said before the rules are there to protect the company from us. They expect you to operate on limits constantly ( Exemple:Max weight, Min Fuel, Max Duty...) They are almost perfect. Proof is they constantly have to rewrite some SOP procedures so we remain sitting ducks. How can you be aware of about 3000 pages of constantly changing information. But if you are not happy you can leave... If you stay be ready to be as good as your last flight and everything will be okay. This is just how it is around here
Take it or leave it! Where is the rule about the pics i did not find it?
Keep Discovering
FCOM 1-2-3-4
QRH
FCTM
OMC
FOM
AFM
MEL
CCEM
Cabin Logbook
Aircraft Logbook
CDL
Aircraft Library
LIDO text Book
LIDO Approach Chart
LIDO En-Route Chart
OPT Manual
Dangerous Good Manual
CAP 413 ( Radio Telephony)
NOTAMS
SIGMETS
Employee Handbook
Every Single Country RULES ( about 80 )
AS WELL AS WITH
FCI (# seventy something)
FCN(# ?)
FTN(??)
Emails: (DL instructions)
Alerts on F.O.I.P
Managements on F.O.I.P
Weekly Reports
My Mint
Vistair
Pelesys
Training Info on F.O.I.P
PLUS...
FCOM Amendments
Temporary Revisions
O.E.B Airbus /Boeing
O.E.B Emirates
FCOM Bulletins
And make sure you are to the standards of...
OMD
FCTP
FTM 1-2
APT 2
Recurrent Manual
Conversion Training Manual
DID I FORGET SOMETHING???????
(Please add what i forgot)When they say they will back you up if you stay within SOP, they mean all of the above. Like very well said before the rules are there to protect the company from us. They expect you to operate on limits constantly ( Exemple:Max weight, Min Fuel, Max Duty...) They are almost perfect. Proof is they constantly have to rewrite some SOP procedures so we remain sitting ducks. How can you be aware of about 3000 pages of constantly changing information. But if you are not happy you can leave... If you stay be ready to be as good as your last flight and everything will be okay. This is just how it is around here
Take it or leave it! Where is the rule about the pics i did not find it?Keep Discovering
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: )
Alerts on F.O.I.P
Managements on F.O.I.P
Weekly Reports
Managements on F.O.I.P
Weekly Reports
Joined: Aug 1998
Posts: 773
Likes: 1
From: the ridge where the west commences
ekpilot: you've missed one of the 3000 pages...
.... on whch you will find the welcome news that you are bound by nothing contained in the AFM: it is a dead document.
That probably takes your total down to 2870 or so.
Keep reading.
That probably takes your total down to 2870 or so.
Keep reading.
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
From: dubai
Wiz of OZ
of course your right, let's as pilots accept some 3rd world moron dob us in
and lose our jobs. If their some poor schmuck, then they should do their job and mind their fu#@ing business what we do.
of course your right, let's as pilots accept some 3rd world moron dob us in
and lose our jobs. If their some poor schmuck, then they should do their job and mind their fu#@ing business what we do.
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,835
Likes: 85
From: Boldly going where no split infinitive has gone before..
Xred,
Yes, they should.
Would mounting a campain to dob THEM in make it more or less likely that they would take the oppertunity to see US sacked?
Accrimony towards them has made you keen to seek revenge. Why should they be any different?
Yes, they should.
Would mounting a campain to dob THEM in make it more or less likely that they would take the oppertunity to see US sacked?
Accrimony towards them has made you keen to seek revenge. Why should they be any different?
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 240
Likes: 0
From: DontBai
Like aiming point says!!! How long do we get pushed,poked and prodded before someone stands their ground and pushes back!! To answer your question, several times and yes milk may get spilt but it never happened again.
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 165
Likes: 0
From: UK
The mess of information coming through the various channels, some controlled and some uncontrolled, I believe is actually a good defence.
The company has lost control of the flow of data. So many manuals have duplicated, contradictory data. So many channels are uncontrolled. The authenticity of the information is often at question. Much is not part of the legal documentation so can be ignored.
I think if if got to a legal scrap after some kind of omission resulting in action against a crew, a good lawyer would have much to work with. Some serious questions would be asked higher up and embarrassment and dismissal of those responsible would probably result from the legal argument.
Stick to the basic SOP, forget the rest. Its impossible to keep up. Take out some good legal insurance. Write the odd email about the overload of information and changes, and keep it on record.
If ever anyone throws the book at you sling it right back.
The company has lost control of the flow of data. So many manuals have duplicated, contradictory data. So many channels are uncontrolled. The authenticity of the information is often at question. Much is not part of the legal documentation so can be ignored.
I think if if got to a legal scrap after some kind of omission resulting in action against a crew, a good lawyer would have much to work with. Some serious questions would be asked higher up and embarrassment and dismissal of those responsible would probably result from the legal argument.
Stick to the basic SOP, forget the rest. Its impossible to keep up. Take out some good legal insurance. Write the odd email about the overload of information and changes, and keep it on record.
If ever anyone throws the book at you sling it right back.
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
From: Dublin
Heard rumblings that an EK A380 FO was sacked recently. Can anyone confirm or deny this rumour??
Was told it had something to do regarding commuting to Europe and got caught doing it on standby days....
Was told it had something to do regarding commuting to Europe and got caught doing it on standby days....