Gulf Air Developments
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Santo Domingo
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sorry boys, $US110k p/yr for a co-pilot. Never!
In any case, the $US7500 p/mth for a capt is crap money. Can't imagine quality capt's would go for the gig.. Cash too low!
In any case, the $US7500 p/mth for a capt is crap money. Can't imagine quality capt's would go for the gig.. Cash too low!
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: YYZ/BAH
Age: 41
Posts: 63
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
after reading some of these co-pilot salary levels offered for E90s, you all should watch Micheal Moore's film Capitalism where it talks about the average regional jet pilot in USA making US$ 30,000 per year and then it goes on to talk about the Continental Airlines RJ crash in BUF last year and how the pilots before the plane crashed were overheard on the cockpit voice recorder talking about their low salary levels. Moore then showed a segment where bakery staff in one California company were making US$ 65,000 per year compared to a more qualified pilot !!! Interesting 10 minute part of the film which really caught my attention
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: way down south
Posts: 339
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sorry to burst the bubble guys but I can't see how we need to hire guys for the embraer when we have already tranferred too many pilots form the airbus to it(our guys are hardly flying & hence losing lots of money). Unless, of course, Majali & co. have found yet another creative form of thievery. If thats the case then I wouldn't come down here since that means by 2012 we are f***ed.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: way down south
Posts: 339
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
WTF. Majali gets CEO of the year! What has he done except reduce GF to less than a regional carrier competing with the likes of Bahrain air, Air Arabia, etc. I guess we shouldnt take him & his award too seriously since Hogan also got visionary of the year!
On another note despite all his cost cutting we are loosing more than ever-almost US$1.5 a day! Good job Mr M.
It seems his plan is to wreck GFs long haul routes in order to validate his Embraer policy/commission.
Also any truth to the rumor that Antoine applied to Oman Air?
On another note despite all his cost cutting we are loosing more than ever-almost US$1.5 a day! Good job Mr M.
It seems his plan is to wreck GFs long haul routes in order to validate his Embraer policy/commission.
Also any truth to the rumor that Antoine applied to Oman Air?
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 608
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Message to Mephistopheles and all others who think like him.
flying lots of long haul routes with 1000 planes and advertising all over the world does not equal success.
Success for Gulf Air is:
1. Satisfy the travel needs of the people of Bahrain, expat and local.
2. Do it using a good product that satisfies customers.
3. Try and make it so that people give you more money for the services than you spend.
However, SM and the gov't are going further than that by trying to be a leading regional airline, they could stop simply at flying Bahraini locals and Bahraini expats to popular destinations, have maybe 15 aircraft in total but at least they have higher ambitions than that.
So to all of you who still bitch and moan on the basis of routes and expansion; your argument is not valid. An airline of 50 planes, with the majority of them being short haul, serving the needs of the region, and making a profit would be ideal. If all you want is to fly long haul so that you can go to East Asia, America and Europe and do whatever it is that you do there, then join another airline, this airline needs people who support its plan, and its a good one. Wait until the E190s show up, they are a little bigger and may serve Gulf Airs needs a little better than the 170s. But you wont know until both planes are tried out. Its not as if he's put in any firm orders. Majali is trying these aircraft out, how else is he to know what works and what doesn't? Calculating stuff on paper does not substitute real world trail and error.
You guys still don't realize that GF has 320s on order, probably with many many more to come if the 330 deal is renegotiated. The Embraers are not a replacement for the 320s. Any regional carrier needs something that size to go to places that just aren't big enough for the 320. And why does GF have to go to those small markets? Because they are untapped, and will provide GF with a lead in the market. Because if GF is going to be the best regional carrier with the biggest route structure it needs to go everywhere, this is good thinking. Its the same plan as Emirates but on a regional level, not a global one.
Ok, that being said stop complaining about the lack of vision for long haul, GF cannot compete with EK and EY. If the Bahraini gov't is willing to give the airline unlimited money then maybe, but otherwise forget it. If its just your preference to fly farther and bigger planes because of your own ego then go right ahead, but stop making it seem as though there is something wrong with GF, becuase the long haul issue is not a problem at all, it will be perfectly acceptable if GF is a smaller but profitable airline (and even then a 50 plane airline is not small; it is compared to a 200 plane airline but then everything is relative). There are problems at GF but the decision to fly only a few long haul routes is not one of them, its perfectly acceptable and a good one.
flying lots of long haul routes with 1000 planes and advertising all over the world does not equal success.
Success for Gulf Air is:
1. Satisfy the travel needs of the people of Bahrain, expat and local.
2. Do it using a good product that satisfies customers.
3. Try and make it so that people give you more money for the services than you spend.
However, SM and the gov't are going further than that by trying to be a leading regional airline, they could stop simply at flying Bahraini locals and Bahraini expats to popular destinations, have maybe 15 aircraft in total but at least they have higher ambitions than that.
So to all of you who still bitch and moan on the basis of routes and expansion; your argument is not valid. An airline of 50 planes, with the majority of them being short haul, serving the needs of the region, and making a profit would be ideal. If all you want is to fly long haul so that you can go to East Asia, America and Europe and do whatever it is that you do there, then join another airline, this airline needs people who support its plan, and its a good one. Wait until the E190s show up, they are a little bigger and may serve Gulf Airs needs a little better than the 170s. But you wont know until both planes are tried out. Its not as if he's put in any firm orders. Majali is trying these aircraft out, how else is he to know what works and what doesn't? Calculating stuff on paper does not substitute real world trail and error.
You guys still don't realize that GF has 320s on order, probably with many many more to come if the 330 deal is renegotiated. The Embraers are not a replacement for the 320s. Any regional carrier needs something that size to go to places that just aren't big enough for the 320. And why does GF have to go to those small markets? Because they are untapped, and will provide GF with a lead in the market. Because if GF is going to be the best regional carrier with the biggest route structure it needs to go everywhere, this is good thinking. Its the same plan as Emirates but on a regional level, not a global one.
Ok, that being said stop complaining about the lack of vision for long haul, GF cannot compete with EK and EY. If the Bahraini gov't is willing to give the airline unlimited money then maybe, but otherwise forget it. If its just your preference to fly farther and bigger planes because of your own ego then go right ahead, but stop making it seem as though there is something wrong with GF, becuase the long haul issue is not a problem at all, it will be perfectly acceptable if GF is a smaller but profitable airline (and even then a 50 plane airline is not small; it is compared to a 200 plane airline but then everything is relative). There are problems at GF but the decision to fly only a few long haul routes is not one of them, its perfectly acceptable and a good one.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: way down south
Posts: 339
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Airmann you obviously have no idea about the aviation business(?) in the region. Firstly, the idea that GF can become profitable is total BS & is not feasable when you have 3 huge airlines next door with almost unlimited funds & a well run low cost carrier like Air Arabia around.
You will also find that many airlines do feasability studies before "trying out" new aircraft & then take around 6mths to a year inducting them into the airline. Not get them & see how is goes!!!
Maybe you are brown nosing for a job of the Embraer my friend? Good luck.
You will also find that many airlines do feasability studies before "trying out" new aircraft & then take around 6mths to a year inducting them into the airline. Not get them & see how is goes!!!
Maybe you are brown nosing for a job of the Embraer my friend? Good luck.
Join Date: May 2010
Location: fools paradise
Age: 61
Posts: 15
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Airman
GF has been established in the international market. The major problem that GF is that they suffering because of the money hungry (over paid)people from upper management( not surprise there). I have been almost on all interntaional route ( mainly Europe) which GF flies to and most of them are packed with pax.So i dont see a reason for them to stop flying there.
Opening regional untapped destination is a great thing. However, it doesnt mean that you should not look into the international destination. After estabilishing the airline in the middle east, the airline should look into destinations liks JFK and a couple of countries in Europe as many people from the ME and the indian subcontinents fly there very often and vise versa. Thats what Mr.M is not looking into. Options for redicing the 330-300 aircraft is acceptable
. But cancelling the entire 330 orders is not a good move in my opinion
. This will prevent the airline from tapping some untapped international marketwhen needed .And the same goes for the 787s specially because it is fuel efficiant ,easy to maintain and high in demand.
Making the airline dependant entirely on narrow body fleet is just not the right way to reduce costs. I have stated this before; its not whether you make the profit or not, Its how you make the profit..
i am not claiming that the CEO is an idiot or not doing his research etc ... But I would its just that he is being very close minded regarding the international routes in purticular the USA and alot of them in Asia.Its just something that needs to be given some attention.
P.S New European routes TBA in April ( an unofficial report)
Opening regional untapped destination is a great thing. However, it doesnt mean that you should not look into the international destination. After estabilishing the airline in the middle east, the airline should look into destinations liks JFK and a couple of countries in Europe as many people from the ME and the indian subcontinents fly there very often and vise versa. Thats what Mr.M is not looking into. Options for redicing the 330-300 aircraft is acceptable
. But cancelling the entire 330 orders is not a good move in my opinion. This will prevent the airline from tapping some untapped international marketwhen needed .And the same goes for the 787s specially because it is fuel efficiant ,easy to maintain and high in demand.Making the airline dependant entirely on narrow body fleet is just not the right way to reduce costs. I have stated this before; its not whether you make the profit or not, Its how you make the profit..
i am not claiming that the CEO is an idiot or not doing his research etc ... But I would its just that he is being very close minded regarding the international routes in purticular the USA and alot of them in Asia.Its just something that needs to be given some attention.
P.S New European routes TBA in April ( an unofficial report)
Last edited by finalcall; 24th Sep 2010 at 10:16.
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canada
Posts: 608
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mephistopheles, I am voicing my opinion, I am not brown nosing for a job. Secondly, yes you are right my years of experience in the aviation do not compare to most people on this forum, but thats why I am here, partly to voice my opinion and also to learn. If GF didn't do a thorough study on the Embraer then you are right about that mess up. But my point about bitching about routes still stands.
I still think that it is a better strategy for GF to have their foot firmly placed in the Gulf first, and to then use that position to start international routes, not the other way around. GF was in damage control mode when Majali got in, he had to shut down what wasn't working, and immediately (mostly long haul international routes).
Look GF still has a head start on all the regions big players when it comes to its Middle East network. GF has to build on this and use it to their advantage, and I think that is what the CEO is trying to do. That was the point of my post, I'm not disagreeing with you on the mismanagement of funds by some folk and all the other problems, I'm not even going to touch on that, I'll leave it to you. But, and I'll say it again more plainly, my argument is that GF has to first have a great local (and I use the term local to mean GCC, Iraq, Iran etc.) route structure to funnel passengers to Bahrain before taking them abroad, they should not be focusing on flying Brits to Thailand or Indians to North America, that is what all the big players have been doing and they have only just realized that they need to start collecting passengers from their local areas hence the sudden rush for smaller planes, the creation of FlyDubai etc. Relying on far away markets for the majority of your revenue is a little risky. Especially since a few changes with regard to price, route structure and product from some airlines in Europe, Asia and Africa could lead to big changes in passenger numbers for the 3 ME carriers. Relying on your local passengers to make up your business is, in my opinion, and I'm sure of some others is a sound business policy.
Now over to mismanagement, corruption and the rest of that, like I said I'll leave that to someone else to discuss.
I still think that it is a better strategy for GF to have their foot firmly placed in the Gulf first, and to then use that position to start international routes, not the other way around. GF was in damage control mode when Majali got in, he had to shut down what wasn't working, and immediately (mostly long haul international routes).
Look GF still has a head start on all the regions big players when it comes to its Middle East network. GF has to build on this and use it to their advantage, and I think that is what the CEO is trying to do. That was the point of my post, I'm not disagreeing with you on the mismanagement of funds by some folk and all the other problems, I'm not even going to touch on that, I'll leave it to you. But, and I'll say it again more plainly, my argument is that GF has to first have a great local (and I use the term local to mean GCC, Iraq, Iran etc.) route structure to funnel passengers to Bahrain before taking them abroad, they should not be focusing on flying Brits to Thailand or Indians to North America, that is what all the big players have been doing and they have only just realized that they need to start collecting passengers from their local areas hence the sudden rush for smaller planes, the creation of FlyDubai etc. Relying on far away markets for the majority of your revenue is a little risky. Especially since a few changes with regard to price, route structure and product from some airlines in Europe, Asia and Africa could lead to big changes in passenger numbers for the 3 ME carriers. Relying on your local passengers to make up your business is, in my opinion, and I'm sure of some others is a sound business policy.
Now over to mismanagement, corruption and the rest of that, like I said I'll leave that to someone else to discuss.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: way down south
Posts: 339
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Plan A was for them to arrive was Sept 14 but there were some financing problems. Don't know which team is in Brazil but its not the guys that are going to bring it to Bah?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Bahrain
Posts: 196
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
These are what I have heard:
1 - Wet leased B737 to fly to new EU destinations until the A319LR arrive
2 - The Embraer implementation has been frozen due to too much headache
3 - Mr M. is about to leave (as usual with all GF's CEO...)
4 - DEC in all fleet
5 - At least another 20 FO's will leave up to December due to no carreer progression
6 - They will all be replaced by brand new SO...
1 - Wet leased B737 to fly to new EU destinations until the A319LR arrive
2 - The Embraer implementation has been frozen due to too much headache
3 - Mr M. is about to leave (as usual with all GF's CEO...)
4 - DEC in all fleet
5 - At least another 20 FO's will leave up to December due to no carreer progression
6 - They will all be replaced by brand new SO...