EK MC miscomm
Join Date: May 2005
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Sorry Gortex, its not splitting hairs. This is the culture at EK. 1500' AAL, yet the triggers are based on Radalt. I find that to be a bit odd to say the least.
As far as this being a 'DEC event' I have to disagree. I'm sure everyone who knows me understands my POV regarding the DEC policy and if you don't, then here it is............ It is the most flawed policy that EK has made in its entire history.
But, I refuse to believe some of the things posted here wrt to the Captains decision- making process.
First off, none of us has all the information. And to be honest, after consultataion with SMNC, voicing my concerns and giving alternate suggestions, if they 'still' requested what they allegedly did, then I too would have done exactly what this Captain did.
Keep in mind that most of this comes from a passenger, and no offence intended, but clearly he is even less informed than what this company allows for us pilots. No doubt the minions sitting at a desk will not be questioned at all, and in their defence, they are overworked, undermanned and under trained. It always boils down to the pilots, yet for some reason we are not given the required authority and respect due, considering this obligation. This is the inherent flaw within EK. They demand so much from us, yet put forth an atmosphere of 'fear and intimidation' towards us.
Then again when you hire the likes of TCAS and ED ( the non-literate native english speaker), then the results are predictable. My god, ED's latest email about ENGLIGH TESTING FOR PILOTS, begins with a sentence at which a 5th grader would laugh. If only we had one person in management that would even try to express to the upper echelons that we must be trained, encouraged and supported to make decisions, then this airline would not be headed towards another serious incident without doubt.
In my opinion, and I totally agree I don't have all the facts, this Captain did a great job and for us to slag him, is undermining our position as pilots as well as inadvertently supporting the misguided policies of management at EK.
As far as this being a 'DEC event' I have to disagree. I'm sure everyone who knows me understands my POV regarding the DEC policy and if you don't, then here it is............ It is the most flawed policy that EK has made in its entire history.
But, I refuse to believe some of the things posted here wrt to the Captains decision- making process.
First off, none of us has all the information. And to be honest, after consultataion with SMNC, voicing my concerns and giving alternate suggestions, if they 'still' requested what they allegedly did, then I too would have done exactly what this Captain did.
Keep in mind that most of this comes from a passenger, and no offence intended, but clearly he is even less informed than what this company allows for us pilots. No doubt the minions sitting at a desk will not be questioned at all, and in their defence, they are overworked, undermanned and under trained. It always boils down to the pilots, yet for some reason we are not given the required authority and respect due, considering this obligation. This is the inherent flaw within EK. They demand so much from us, yet put forth an atmosphere of 'fear and intimidation' towards us.
Then again when you hire the likes of TCAS and ED ( the non-literate native english speaker), then the results are predictable. My god, ED's latest email about ENGLIGH TESTING FOR PILOTS, begins with a sentence at which a 5th grader would laugh. If only we had one person in management that would even try to express to the upper echelons that we must be trained, encouraged and supported to make decisions, then this airline would not be headed towards another serious incident without doubt.
In my opinion, and I totally agree I don't have all the facts, this Captain did a great job and for us to slag him, is undermining our position as pilots as well as inadvertently supporting the misguided policies of management at EK.
Last edited by mensaboy; 6th Aug 2007 at 21:52.
Join Date: Sep 2003
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I can confirm what goretex said.
I am an outsider, I am reading this , and you are w***ers.
Still after three years of it you will be skygods , destined to outdo any mere mortal that dares to be a DEC,
PS I know humour is in short supply and egos a plenty in EK so I'll be clear , it was a joke
I am an outsider, I am reading this , and you are w***ers.
Still after three years of it you will be skygods , destined to outdo any mere mortal that dares to be a DEC,
PS I know humour is in short supply and egos a plenty in EK so I'll be clear , it was a joke
Join Date: Apr 2005
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Trimotor, I'm a bus-boy, so basically, selected is the same as configured, it takes just a second for the flaps to get there. Don't know how you Boeing guys play it.
As for the 160 till 4, we can do that with speed selected and fully configured. The ridiculous thing is that we are now flying fully configured, burning extra fuel to keep the speed (putting extra load on the flaps) and once past 4nm you just reduce and are nicely established at 1000ft.
Instead of treating us like children and making up these stupid rules, why don't they let us just do our job and fly the thing. People who can't decide themselves where to put the gear and the flaps out to make the stabilization criteria just don't belong in the seats their in.
Anyway, I just used this as an example in a previous post, let's get back to the topic...
I would love to see if Ed or whoever will inform us about this cock up for future reference.. He is in his writing phase with all his pathetic letters lately.
Have to go to sleep now, wouldn't want my neighbour asking me tomorrow what I was doing up at 2.25 in the morning. He might want to point out to me how serious my job is and that I need to take my rest blah blah blah...
MR8
As for the 160 till 4, we can do that with speed selected and fully configured. The ridiculous thing is that we are now flying fully configured, burning extra fuel to keep the speed (putting extra load on the flaps) and once past 4nm you just reduce and are nicely established at 1000ft.
Instead of treating us like children and making up these stupid rules, why don't they let us just do our job and fly the thing. People who can't decide themselves where to put the gear and the flaps out to make the stabilization criteria just don't belong in the seats their in.
Anyway, I just used this as an example in a previous post, let's get back to the topic...
I would love to see if Ed or whoever will inform us about this cock up for future reference.. He is in his writing phase with all his pathetic letters lately.
Have to go to sleep now, wouldn't want my neighbour asking me tomorrow what I was doing up at 2.25 in the morning. He might want to point out to me how serious my job is and that I need to take my rest blah blah blah...
MR8
Join Date: May 2005
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Disconnected said and I couldn't agree more
For the rulebound - don't forget good judgement and logic can take precedence over SOP. You shouldn't be a captain if fear of the oak desk results in you and you passengers being in an oak box.
Awesome 
As for legal arguments based on a few feet - get real - even the best lawyers will have a tough time making that a persuasive motion. RIGHT ON !!
WHAT WAS THIS THREAD ABOUT?:
For the rulebound - don't forget good judgement and logic can take precedence over SOP. You shouldn't be a captain if fear of the oak desk results in you and you passengers being in an oak box.
Awesome As for legal arguments based on a few feet - get real - even the best lawyers will have a tough time making that a persuasive motion. RIGHT ON !!
WHAT WAS THIS THREAD ABOUT?:
Join Date: Aug 2006
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Menstralboy,
You're losing it, mate. A whole post and you didn't blame the pimple on your ass on George Bush. Wow. And you almost made it through the whole post without slagging someone from the states. Otherwise agree with you on the original topic here. Damn, I have agreed with MR8 and now menstralboy. I AM losing it.
You're losing it, mate. A whole post and you didn't blame the pimple on your ass on George Bush. Wow. And you almost made it through the whole post without slagging someone from the states. Otherwise agree with you on the original topic here. Damn, I have agreed with MR8 and now menstralboy. I AM losing it.
