To the EK chiefs reading pprune.....
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To the EK chiefs reading pprune.....
So there are not enough ASR’s, VR’s, CSR’s and CHFR’s drippin’in? Well, why am I not surprised? Apparently our VPF and DVPFO will shortly address this issue.
If you read this, dear chief Indians, spare your effort. We would know perfectly well how to use these tools and to what benefit – we just don’t want to. The story about the B-skipper having used this tool correctly, but then being incorrectly (“locally”) shafted, is only too present.
Here’s a better address to work on, dear chiefs: EVPFO and P.
The use of internal reporting systems, it’s decline, refusal or propagation depends directly on corporate culture. Such culture is set up by and depends almost entirely on in house leaders. Therefore this lack or decline of communication “bottom up”, is a brutal mirror of poor leadership.
Any attempt to address this solely “top down” will fail and make it even worse. We first and foremost have to feel that our leaders want to change this blaming and @..covering culture. And by the way: Stick to what was on and promised (ie. productivity pay). Or nothing will change.
Up to you chief Indians to hold this mirror in front of the big chief Indians, or spare the ink.
china
If you read this, dear chief Indians, spare your effort. We would know perfectly well how to use these tools and to what benefit – we just don’t want to. The story about the B-skipper having used this tool correctly, but then being incorrectly (“locally”) shafted, is only too present.
Here’s a better address to work on, dear chiefs: EVPFO and P.
The use of internal reporting systems, it’s decline, refusal or propagation depends directly on corporate culture. Such culture is set up by and depends almost entirely on in house leaders. Therefore this lack or decline of communication “bottom up”, is a brutal mirror of poor leadership.
Any attempt to address this solely “top down” will fail and make it even worse. We first and foremost have to feel that our leaders want to change this blaming and @..covering culture. And by the way: Stick to what was on and promised (ie. productivity pay). Or nothing will change.
Up to you chief Indians to hold this mirror in front of the big chief Indians, or spare the ink.
china
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View from the Date Palm
I get the feeling the blame game or cover my arse has all ready started.
Fairly obvious why we are not putting ASR's and CSR in given the on going company culture and some of the ludicrous responses we get.
The recent email from Long Range Eddy over the GCAA AIC on holding in Dubai or why the company got it correct and the CAA has it all wrong is further example.
And what purpose other than self promotion does the Fatigue and Sleep Deprivation Article serve in the recent November Fleet Facts.
Ask any one who has done the 4 sector night pattern followed by a Long Range flight.Rostering is and continues to be the issue on the Bus Fleet...Better still how about rostering the Author on this pairing a couple of times for Research Purposes .
The solution is to sort out these pairings rather than sending guys to the clinic for debriefing. More buck passing from the Top
Fairly obvious why we are not putting ASR's and CSR in given the on going company culture and some of the ludicrous responses we get.
The recent email from Long Range Eddy over the GCAA AIC on holding in Dubai or why the company got it correct and the CAA has it all wrong is further example.
And what purpose other than self promotion does the Fatigue and Sleep Deprivation Article serve in the recent November Fleet Facts.
Ask any one who has done the 4 sector night pattern followed by a Long Range flight.Rostering is and continues to be the issue on the Bus Fleet...Better still how about rostering the Author on this pairing a couple of times for Research Purposes .
The solution is to sort out these pairings rather than sending guys to the clinic for debriefing. More buck passing from the Top
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Emirates staff suffer terribly from a lack of responsible management, particularly when faced with perceived problems with said staff members.
Sometimes you could be excused for thinking that there is some kind of bounty being offered by upper management to middle management for every employee that can be exposed, accused, framed, shafted, screwed, frightened off, or threatened. Got to keep the staff under control somehow.
The emphasys is on sometimes, but when it happens it is generally quite dramatic and it will be evident to all crew eventually just how poorly we can be treated within the company.
A major contributing factor is the fact that we are on our own with no recognizable support structure to ensure that proper investigations are carried out and proceedures followed. It does not have to be a union but there should be a panel/body of our peers who can add support for all of us if required. THe well over used line from your manager of you can count on me for myfull support just doesn't cut it. Most will drop you right in it if they have the slightest fear of any flow on recriminations.
The list of examples of poorly handled issues is extensive and covers all areas of flight ops and training. When any issue is refered to HR or management, the perception is that absolutely anything could happen, even if you are totally innocent of the alleged indescretion/crime/stuffup.
The resulting company culture is :- Accusation and punishment.
There is simply no in between process or transparency..
If you are lucky they will fire your ass, then you can go home and sue their ass and live comfortably ever after off the winnings.
Sometimes you could be excused for thinking that there is some kind of bounty being offered by upper management to middle management for every employee that can be exposed, accused, framed, shafted, screwed, frightened off, or threatened. Got to keep the staff under control somehow.
The emphasys is on sometimes, but when it happens it is generally quite dramatic and it will be evident to all crew eventually just how poorly we can be treated within the company.
A major contributing factor is the fact that we are on our own with no recognizable support structure to ensure that proper investigations are carried out and proceedures followed. It does not have to be a union but there should be a panel/body of our peers who can add support for all of us if required. THe well over used line from your manager of you can count on me for myfull support just doesn't cut it. Most will drop you right in it if they have the slightest fear of any flow on recriminations.
The list of examples of poorly handled issues is extensive and covers all areas of flight ops and training. When any issue is refered to HR or management, the perception is that absolutely anything could happen, even if you are totally innocent of the alleged indescretion/crime/stuffup.
The resulting company culture is :- Accusation and punishment.
There is simply no in between process or transparency..
If you are lucky they will fire your ass, then you can go home and sue their ass and live comfortably ever after off the winnings.
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Up to you chief Indians to hold this mirror in front of the big chief Indians, or spare the ink.
china[/quote]
While I must agree with most of your comments, I would prefer to write to the bosses directly; it could be more effective
china[/quote]
While I must agree with most of your comments, I would prefer to write to the bosses directly; it could be more effective
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While I must agree with most of your comments, I would prefer to write to the bosses directly; it could be more effective
My guess is that you haven't been here very long.
Writing to EK management, in the hope of effecting positive change, is probably the most futile pursuit I can think of right now.
But by all means try your hardest.
V
P.S If you want evidence of this, log on to the crew portal and read the responses to the guys that have asked questions about transferring to the 777. I have rarely seen so much written that says so little (i'm assuming its from Mr Ed.)
My guess is that you haven't been here very long.
Writing to EK management, in the hope of effecting positive change, is probably the most futile pursuit I can think of right now.
But by all means try your hardest.
V
P.S If you want evidence of this, log on to the crew portal and read the responses to the guys that have asked questions about transferring to the 777. I have rarely seen so much written that says so little (i'm assuming its from Mr Ed.)
Last edited by Vorsicht; 20th Nov 2006 at 06:42.
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I've done it once, a very unpleasant experience. EK only wants "top down" changes, adopting the Arab way of doing things. At first it's a easy way of managing, but very soon you're confronted with passive resistance. Nobody gives a damn, no more reports, your leading capacity runs through your hands like water. Then you might try pressure, but water is incompressible, like passive resistance. That has been proven over and over again. It's definitely more effective than standing ostensively in the way of some fat tank or dumb dictator.
Our leaders, especially AAR and TC, will never listen to you, you're way too low in the food chain. They need to suddenly realise that they have created a workforce that simply does as told, but does not think any inch further than "when is block on". They will only react if it hits the polls and the sooner it does, the better for us. Anyone working on days off, going into excessive overtime, going the extra mile for anything or anyone but for himself, is just emphasizing EK in believing they're doing it right.
Submitting more reports or writing to our bosses merely tells them you actually read their crap and you actually care.
I would care for the company, and finally for myself, if there would be a two way street, but the one in EK today looks about as intelligently built as the Al Barsha crossing to the Greens road. And there's about as little concern about both shortcomings among any of the respective bosses.
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Countless CSRs & genuine technical Qs, all of which have gone unanswered, give me little incentive if any to waste precious d/o time to write anything. However, having signed a voyage report in the wrong place then I'm guarenteed a response from them.
4.9% resignations, 86+ pilots, the year ending Nov, more resignations submitted to be included in next years figures and more to come; what more feedback do these idiots want before they actually see that the emperor has no cloths?
If TC wants 650 aircraft then he & AAR better start learning to fly because they will continue receiving more and more resignations (personal feedback forms) until the the aircraft get parked by the nice new terminal that they will no doubt take all the credit for building.
And as their current recruitment policy of picking the carcasses of failed airlines begins to fail to attract sufficient replacements for the experienced pilots they're losing, with any luck they could be looking for another job like most of us are doing now.
4.9% resignations, 86+ pilots, the year ending Nov, more resignations submitted to be included in next years figures and more to come; what more feedback do these idiots want before they actually see that the emperor has no cloths?
If TC wants 650 aircraft then he & AAR better start learning to fly because they will continue receiving more and more resignations (personal feedback forms) until the the aircraft get parked by the nice new terminal that they will no doubt take all the credit for building.
And as their current recruitment policy of picking the carcasses of failed airlines begins to fail to attract sufficient replacements for the experienced pilots they're losing, with any luck they could be looking for another job like most of us are doing now.
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Not complaining... but I've been seriously tempted to sign the new look VR with my staff number, (and would anyone notice?) as my name appears nowhere else on the form.
Someone a lot more cynical than I am might be tempted to say that if anyone suspected they were something more than "just another number" in today's EK, the new nameless VR form proves otherwise.
Someone a lot more cynical than I am might be tempted to say that if anyone suspected they were something more than "just another number" in today's EK, the new nameless VR form proves otherwise.
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Most (if not all the big shots in the Gulf carriers and elsewhere) read PPRuNe. PPRuNe is also read in many offices. Many people do not participate in order not to be “spotted” red-handed and prefer to do it elsewhere.
How many times did I see people’s screens with it on it? Given the subject, and cause there are some good ideas in PPRuNe sometimes, I wished many top guys use them to implement some new policies and procedures in order to improve quality life in the office and at home for the many guys and girls. I'm really talking about the big (£,€,$ and others) guys.
Shortly, you'll have PPRuNe in the cockpits and galleys.
How many times did I see people’s screens with it on it? Given the subject, and cause there are some good ideas in PPRuNe sometimes, I wished many top guys use them to implement some new policies and procedures in order to improve quality life in the office and at home for the many guys and girls. I'm really talking about the big (£,€,$ and others) guys.
Shortly, you'll have PPRuNe in the cockpits and galleys.
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I fly for NWA and all I can say is that ED is an arse and a back stabber. Be careful with that a-hole!
Specific ident removed. Welcome to the site Jam-Yo - I get the feeling you're going to be a veritable font of hot gen. But I like your style, sniping with a howitzer. 4HP
Specific ident removed. Welcome to the site Jam-Yo - I get the feeling you're going to be a veritable font of hot gen. But I like your style, sniping with a howitzer.
4HP
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Mister Ed (Long Range Eddy)
Thanks Jam-Yo, your conclusions coincide with the general opinion here.
However, the profile you have described is the ideal profile for an EK Flight Ops. manager. The upper echelons don't want flight ops. managers compromising commercial decisions with pesky annoyances like regulations. Look how frangible the Flight Operations Manual has become under TCAS's reign, any time that a Captain makes a stand on an issue related to the FOM, TCAS is quite happy to issue a "dispensation" knowing full well that should something happen, the Captain would take full responsibility.
Seems that when TCAS did his cadet course, he was away the day that they did regulatory compliance.
Long Range Eddy is simply another in a long line of EK flight ops. management seat warmers.
However, the profile you have described is the ideal profile for an EK Flight Ops. manager. The upper echelons don't want flight ops. managers compromising commercial decisions with pesky annoyances like regulations. Look how frangible the Flight Operations Manual has become under TCAS's reign, any time that a Captain makes a stand on an issue related to the FOM, TCAS is quite happy to issue a "dispensation" knowing full well that should something happen, the Captain would take full responsibility.
Seems that when TCAS did his cadet course, he was away the day that they did regulatory compliance.
Long Range Eddy is simply another in a long line of EK flight ops. management seat warmers.
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[quote=chinawladi;2975681]You must be from Down Under, liking boomerangs ...........
Noooo, I am not from that part of the world, Thank God !!
Our leaders, especially AAR and TC, will never listen to you, you're way too low in the food chain.
You should try the "lower" bosses next time, such as Mr. ED or TCAS. Those mentioned above, really, wouldn't give a damn to whatever you would say.
Noooo, I am not from that part of the world, Thank God !!
Our leaders, especially AAR and TC, will never listen to you, you're way too low in the food chain.
You should try the "lower" bosses next time, such as Mr. ED or TCAS. Those mentioned above, really, wouldn't give a damn to whatever you would say.
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Dear Ed and TCAS
[I]aimscabinet[I] says that if we write to you nicely you will turn this flight ops department around by:
1/ Returning to a fair and transparent seniority system.
2/ Binning the DEC program.
3/ Reinstating the previous productivity and credit system.
4/ Addressing roster issues, in particular the mix of long haul/short haul duties.
5/ Implementing a realistic payrise.
6/ That's it.
Do these things and your recruiting problems will be over.
You know it makes sense.
mtc.
[I]aimscabinet[I] says that if we write to you nicely you will turn this flight ops department around by:
1/ Returning to a fair and transparent seniority system.
2/ Binning the DEC program.
3/ Reinstating the previous productivity and credit system.
4/ Addressing roster issues, in particular the mix of long haul/short haul duties.
5/ Implementing a realistic payrise.
6/ That's it.
Do these things and your recruiting problems will be over.
You know it makes sense.
mtc.
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Well said, Montecee.
Plus we want the jump seat back!
Oh, and a realistic pay rise in my books is between 50 - 70 %, dont waste our time with anything less!
Thats it, ''good night and good luck''
And Check Six!!
Plus we want the jump seat back!
Oh, and a realistic pay rise in my books is between 50 - 70 %, dont waste our time with anything less!
Thats it, ''good night and good luck''
And Check Six!!
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And to add my bit ...
Don't forget the outbases. And let's not again try to "nickle and dime" (ie:short change and insult) -the fortunate few able to hold those precious basings, with a "reduced" package for the "privaledge" of such basings. Remember, Dubai is a "world class" city in the likes of London, New York and Paris and with the cost of living the same, we shouldn't have less disposable income to re-establish ourselves in our prefered domicile. We promise to carry closer to "your" minimum fuel then, -operational considerations taken into account of course! FOM 11.1.1, -second bullet is the most relevent. Your book, not mine... and we'll save the sandwiches for the next crew if we don't eat them. +
Don't forget the outbases. And let's not again try to "nickle and dime" (ie:short change and insult) -the fortunate few able to hold those precious basings, with a "reduced" package for the "privaledge" of such basings. Remember, Dubai is a "world class" city in the likes of London, New York and Paris and with the cost of living the same, we shouldn't have less disposable income to re-establish ourselves in our prefered domicile. We promise to carry closer to "your" minimum fuel then, -operational considerations taken into account of course! FOM 11.1.1, -second bullet is the most relevent. Your book, not mine... and we'll save the sandwiches for the next crew if we don't eat them.
+
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The last time a colleague lodged an ASR he was summoned to the office to recieve an abusive and irrational hour long tirade by a meglomaniacal fleet manager where he was threatened with disciplinary action and demotion amongst other things. This "manager'' would be considered a joke outside of the UAE, however, wields power in the EK organistaion. Unfortunately, if you have an issue he's the sort of moron you have to deal with at EK.
Why would you submit an ASR ever again after that sort of response?
Better still, why would you work for these arseholes?
Why would you submit an ASR ever again after that sort of response?
Better still, why would you work for these arseholes?