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If not Emirates, then where to ??

Middle East Many expats still flying in Knoteetingham. Regional issues can be discussed here.

If not Emirates, then where to ??

Old 12th Mar 2006, 15:55
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If not Emirates, then where to ??

First, I´d like to thank all people who took their time and posted on threads about EK. For sure, things look a lot rosey from the outside. The thing is, though: I live in a 3rd world country, where I am not satisfied with my job (A320 F/O). Neither my wage is good, nor I have much time home. Management is also close to this "don´t disturb me" approach I read many complaining about. So, for me, going to EK, even though it is not as good as I thought, and being advised by people who work there, would substantially increase my income and family relation.

My question is: If not EK, where to ?? Note that going to an US major or Europe is a no/no due to my citizenship.
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Old 12th Mar 2006, 16:26
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HI,

Where are you from?
Maybe you can go to Qatar Airways or Kuwait Airways or Etihad Airways?

best regards,
Patrick
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Old 12th Mar 2006, 20:14
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Hello, Patrick;
From what I´ve heard, Ethiad is less than EK, and Qatar is not a nice place to bring family to, due to their religious extremism (so I heard, not personal). I did not hear anything about Kuwait, but it sounds to me like the city is not as good as Dubai is.

Last edited by Eisenhower; 15th Mar 2006 at 13:23.
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Old 12th Mar 2006, 20:33
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Eisenhower

Your question is justified.

IF you come to the Middle East there is only one airline to go to:- Emirates.

Emirates might not be paradise but at least they have some level of professionalism and by far the best "total package"....

All others are probably worse than your present airline (esp. QR and GF)

Good luck
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Old 13th Mar 2006, 00:25
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Try Cathay Pacific.
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Old 13th Mar 2006, 01:14
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Yeah, Dog....and go to those forums and you'll see more of the same management / crew / lifestyle issues as here
CX...big issues... heard about the 49ers? ...and that's old news
2 guys from Dragon dismissed for not working on days off
.....seriously, we're all getting the shaft
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Old 13th Mar 2006, 05:47
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To be honest it sounds like most airlines have the same kind of issues... However, when it comes to the Gulf I would say EK is probably the best bet - Etihad's still the new kid on the block, Qatar's trying hard to be like EK (but I don't think that using A319s for medium to long haul is the way to go )

As for where is best to live, well - depends what you like. I like Dubai, I know others will disagree but there is a lot to do there. Abu Dhabi's a long way behind, Qatar again trying to play "catchup". I hear that Bahrain's a nice place, and I know Oman is.... I wouldn't bother with Sharjah though
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Old 13th Mar 2006, 21:32
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Thanks for your posts. I´ve noticed a good number of Europeans and Americans at EK. I would like to know what makes the package at EK more interesting than, let´s say Cathay, that have bases both in the EU and the US. Wouldn´t a company like CX be actually what many are looking for ?
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Old 13th Mar 2006, 22:01
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I think its more about lifestyle,its not just the package that we should consider.Personally if i had to choose between living in US or Dubai i would go to Dubai without thinking twice.
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Old 13th Mar 2006, 22:05
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@White Knight

Why a 319LR is a bad choice for medium ops? First of all I was already a pax on this 319 and it is in points of pax comfort equal to a "real" long range aircraft.
Just because at least one ME airline starts to use it`s brain to reduce costs on low densitiy sectors it doesn`t mean they offer a bad product. I find the 319(I guess as well Airbus does!) fits perfect for 6-7 hour flights from the ME to europe - why should you use a 330 for, lets say 80 Passengers? It would be just uneconomic!

An other thing - I read often the word copy in regard of Emirates and Qatar Airways - do you really think Emirates did develop everything by themself, please .......... I think they where as well really busy copying European and Asian Airlines .

I think places to go in the ME are Qatar Airways and Emirates, Etihad are still ignorants beeing just fixed on typerated guys, gulf air playing in a totally other, much poorer, league.

I am aware of some really bad threads about Qatar Airways, however, honestly I hardly believe most of the stories coming from always the same writers. If I think back to some of my previous companies, I could write a lot of bad things nearly matching the post about Qatar. And I worked for airlines like lauda air and swiss...
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Old 13th Mar 2006, 22:07
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I dunno Ike
Its just the same toy, repackaged.

...unless my info is out of date Pax fleet ....Start as a SO in Hong Kong ...yeah great!
Cargo fleet...direct entry FO EU bases ( and maybe the States too) ...Doesn't pay the same by a long shot, but you can move ( bid) after a term.
The recent ads in FLIGHT int (expressions of interest) were offering Direct entry FO, Pax fleet in Australia....and considdering that there are alot of Aussie SO, FOs in Hong Kong wanting to base at home, a new recruit going strait into a Brisbane base would be a real kick in the kazoo.

I cant really help with your original question, but I'd have to say EK is as good, or bad as the rest ...if you reed the other forums, no bed of roses anywhere
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Old 14th Mar 2006, 02:17
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tomuchwork,
so where are you now that you know so much about EK?
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Old 14th Mar 2006, 03:22
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CX is a no-brainer.
As an S/O you will earn the same as an Emirates Captain.
2 years later you will earn 50-75% more or get bypass pay.
10 years later you will be on 3 times the pay.
And you can own property outright and after 7 years service you get a permanent resident visa that nobody will take away.

(I want to go there too)
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Old 14th Mar 2006, 14:57
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Red face

......a CX SO...??? pays as much as an EK captain???
Good Christ, man!
....this is getting rather silly now ...
...wild statments like that are not adding credibility to your painting of the EK picture.
Go to the Harbour forum and bask in the dissatisfaction contained within, then get back to me and tell me the flavor of what you find...DECs, DEFOs 49ers. If you still think its a move worth taking, then dont ask why new EK guys 'never listen to good advice'

...and while I'm here, what's current the upgrade time for the fellas in CX? ...with the recent adds in FLIGHT for Direct entry and bases other than Honkers, quite awhile, huh ....sound familiar?

Last edited by Nolights-essential3; 14th Mar 2006 at 15:20.
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Old 14th Mar 2006, 21:15
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@zomp

What you mean? You mean that EK for sure didn`t develop flying (because the brits together with the germans did , at least you get the impression flying in and over this countries).

That the use a livery that as well enough other airlines use as well? What`s your point...

I am following various threads about EK and Qatar. I see on both sides a lot of complainers. Some complaints might be right, some other are propably from some angry F/Os missing out on upgrades, for reasons most likely just the airline and the F/O know.

JUST - to say Emirates is the only good place to go in the ME I personally find a bit snobistic. My opinion.
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Old 15th Mar 2006, 08:55
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Devil

......a CX SO...??? pays as much as an EK captain???

Unfortunately its true, can somebody back me up here i dont have the scales to post.
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Old 15th Mar 2006, 09:20
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cathay pacific (passenger ops)
SO base £38,676
EK:
Capt base 24518 AED (roughly £3650 a month £43,000 a year)

according to PPJ-network, i don't know if EK or CX offers free housing or such and these digits probadly aren't very accurate
Özcan is offline  
Old 15th Mar 2006, 09:50
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C'mon !! ....EK captains get over 28K ...36K after top-ups for DECs is the current rumour
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Old 15th Mar 2006, 11:45
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Not so no-lights. A starter in the left seat is on between 24000 and 25000AED. the web site states 27000ishAED as a start pay, but that would be a 2nd year captain. If he were to take the accomodation allowance that would be another 9000AED per month. So thats just under a CX JFO pay wise. Of course the EK fella will be flying 900hrs a year of back of the clock flying, so saving for a long retirement is not required.

Don
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Old 15th Mar 2006, 18:02
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Join Date: May 2002
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Approximate Numbers CX S/O

CX S/O about HKD45000 per month basic plus HKD20000 housing = ~HKD65000 monthly, about USD8300. Taxed at 16% ~ USD7000.
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