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COVID-19 vaccine and future pilot risks?

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COVID-19 vaccine and future pilot risks?

Old 28th Jun 2021, 10:41
  #21 (permalink)  
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Quite alarming if you are willing to accept a risk of 1 in 5000 of serious complications or sequelae from Covid-19 over the much lower risks of a vaccination.

I think I shall leave it at that chaps as this has descended into nonsense.
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Old 28th Jun 2021, 11:22
  #22 (permalink)  
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We don't KNOW that the risks are much lower!

Anyway, it's my decision, guess only time will tell whether it's the right one
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Old 28th Jun 2021, 12:03
  #23 (permalink)  
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this has descended into nonsense.
Spot on Fostex but not because of dns's comment

This attempt to shut down anyone who expresses a different opinion really is getting quite boring...
but because people are quoting papers with no value. Please look at the qualifications of the authors.If none is medically qualified then be suspicious. And we keep getting 'learned publications' which state 'I was talking to a person I met in the street'. This is gossip not science.

There is nothing I can add because the issues raised have no foundation or are wrong. Anyone is welcome to send me a paper and I am happy to appraise it objectively and post anything new. I receive 20 papers a day from leading journals. I make no money from the vaccines and will happily call out issues, but the problem facing aviation is that those who are frightened from getting vaccinated by rubbish papers are reducing the total percentage vaccinated. The Indian or Delta variant needs 90% vaccination to suppress it so if you pilots want to return to full time flying we need to overcome hesitancy
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Old 29th Jun 2021, 23:48
  #24 (permalink)  
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Spot on Radgirl
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Old 3rd Jul 2021, 10:26
  #25 (permalink)  
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Also struggling with the vaccine decision. Problem in the US, is that the debate is being shut down. Experienced scientists, including those responsible for the mRNA vaccine itself are being deplatformed. Most of them are not anti-vaccine, they advocate more time, more research and transparency regarding the vaccine. I feel the best is vigorous and open debate from both sides, regarding Covid-19 and the vaccine, but we are not getting that.

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Old 3rd Jul 2021, 10:41
  #26 (permalink)  
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As RadGirl points out, scrutinising and critically appraising a paper or article is a skill. It requires knowledge of how studies are conducted, statistics and an understanding of the underlying subject matter. Most of the ‘click bait’ links chase any article/paper reflecting a particular agenda, fair from being a critical review. Furthermore the ‘renowned scientists’ mentioned in these papers often aren’t and caution is advised.

I find it staggering that people on this forum continue to question regulatory processes that they have no expertise in and that have been refined over the years to regulate the pharmaceutical industry. Even more staggering that pilots are doing this, a cohort of individuals whose jobs are based around following regulatory processes and SOPs.
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Old 3rd Jul 2021, 18:31
  #27 (permalink)  
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Again, scrutinizing the experience and qualifications of the quoted doctor should help with the decision. A cardiologist, as useful as he might be in his field, is neither a virologist nor a vaccine developer, in fact in his normal job he never has to deal with vaccines at all, there is nothing to vaccinate for a cardiologist.

Just for reference, the vaccines approved in the USA have also been approved in the EU. Unlike the USA they do not have an emergency approval, they have the normal full approval same as any other vaccine has, which requires the full and complete set of trials to be done. The new thing this time around was simply the amount of money available for development (throwing a few billions at that problem is cheap if you consider the trillions of economical damage) and the willingness to participate in the very largescale studies done.

As said above by others: we live in a post-information society. So the ability to assess the veracity of news sources is absolutely critical, as is the ability to get information from different sources, and most crucially, outside of ones own bubble. Of course it gets a bit easier if you have access to scientific journals and the ability to read studies and judge their thoroughness and how well they are peer reviewed.
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Old 4th Jul 2021, 11:52
  #28 (permalink)  
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I respect others opinions, but at some point I hope you all take the time to actually hear what Dr. McCullough has to say, and truly analyze his qualifications and statement regarding the Covid-19 response and subsequent vaccinations. Then make a judgment. It should be noted that the manufacturing origins of where the mRNA vaccines came from is the same place where the emergency use authorization is in effect, so yes that means something. They are about to issue warnings regarding heart inflammation, things that people have been aware of for sometime. They are currently analyzing information regarding the effects of vaccinating pregnant women particularly with regards to the first trimester. Pregnant women were not included in trials. The vaccine developer and virologist most responsible for the mRNA vaccine technology that's currently in use has been de-platformed from multiple places, why? All of a sudden he's an idiot? I don't think so. Open debate. Transparency. The ability to make a truly informed decision.That's all we want.
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Old 4th Jul 2021, 17:23
  #29 (permalink)  
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I would be interested where Ugur Sahin and Özlem Türeci have been de-platformed. They developed the "Pfizer" mRNA vaccine, the first one certified both in the US (emergency) and EU (full certification). Yes, it is known as Pfizer vaccine, but was in fact not developed by Pfizer, but by BioNTech who took Pfizer in as partner for its pure manufacturing muscle during the phase 3 trials. I read comments and interviews from Ugur Sahin nearly on a nearly daily basis, not surprising, after all i am based in his home country Germany, but he and his team do not seem to be de-platformed at all, quite the opposite actually.

Yes, vaccines have side effects. Obviously they do, but they are surprisingly rare, especially in the mRNA vaccines, less so in the vector-based ones although even there the serious side effects are extremely rare. Heart inflammation is by now a well known side effect, especially in young males and quite easily treatable.

And yes, open debate and transparency is a very good sentiment. In fact, there are several specialized platforms for that, for example the New England Journal of Medicine, The Lancet and so on. I suggest reading those, it is truly wonderful information, discussed and peer reviewed before publication and based on a very broad scientific consensus.
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Old 5th Jul 2021, 00:18
  #30 (permalink)  
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I've kept reasonably quiet about what ails me just lately but it has to be said that if I could go back in time, December/January, and NOT have my Pfizer jabs, I might well do just that just to see what the difference would be. I've felt ill with a mixture of symptoms for a long time but the last few months have been hard to endure. Daily, I consider not enduring them.

When finally I was able to see a doctor we sat talking for at least two sessions, possibly three, but he has no idea what's wrong with me. I have an horrendous increase in a confused spectrum of tinnitus, the associated deafness is all but total. One day I'm cycling to the beach for my walk, the next I can barely make it to the front door. A focussed feeling of inflammation in a point ~S2/3, seems to coincide with other problems. Wine was a focal part of my day, avoiding cheap wine like the plague. But now, half a glass will give an almost instant headache which will last much of the night. In the middle of all this I lost my tear production and the wonderful job Ipswich eye hospital did for me is spoiled as nothing I can use comes close to real tears. I just can't accept Blephitis could start so abruptly in both eyes so wondered if there's a common cause. (I've tried heating the lids and coaxing stuff out of the ducts but with not real improvement.)

All in all I'm a mess and I accept some things as I approach 82, but it's the suddenness of the changes I find hard to comprehend. It's like a switch. However, Radgirl picked up on the fact that a bad period started before Covid hit the UK. I was just coming to terms with this when I had the jabs. There is no comparison with the December me and the wreck sitting here now.

The point being - so many of my friends, well, the few that are left, are saying the same thing. Some are saying they wish they hadn't had the jab. In real terms, without the time travel, I'd have them anyway as I consider it a duty, but I'd love to know what's going on. The stuff being jabbed in is by design supposed to be noticed, presumably to elicit one form of reaction or another and while I accept I'm reacting to more and more unwanted things - and my body has become a war-zone for quite unnecessary battles - I don't feel confident that anything being introduced, anywhere, in my systems will leave me free from unwanted reactions of one sort or another.

So, put me down for an undecided.

Funnily enough, my son's dissertation was on Stress and the Immune System.
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Old 5th Jul 2021, 06:22
  #31 (permalink)  
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Those symptoms sound awfully like long Covid, many who had it, even without symptoms, describe similar long term changes. Which is why it is so wrong to "just" concentrate on deaths, as roughly 20% of those that contracted the virus will have similar life changing experiences for a long time. And in our profession that means not only the changes itself, but also losing ones job.

I had around 4 to 5 days of side effects after my AZ jab, only had the first one so far. And yes, those were mildly unpleasant and stronger than for any flue jab i ever got, but very much manageable. Will be interesting to see how my second jab (BioNTech/Pfizer or Moderna) will work out. Yes, over here in Germany it was already advised for those under 60 to get different vaccines if the first was AZ, now it is the standard policy for all to get AZ first and any mRNA vaccine as second jab. 12 weeks between jabs is deemed the optimal time frame, but that can be shortened to 6 weeks if one really has to go on vacation.

Anyway, hope you do experience an improvement in your situation, that does indeed sound awful.
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Old 6th Jul 2021, 11:33
  #32 (permalink)  
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Mentioned in the Times this morning. https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/e...x=1625555002-1

One of many Wiki - https://berlincures.de/new-paper/

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Old 8th Jul 2021, 19:06
  #33 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2010
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Similar concerns to the above were brought up in my lectures in relation to specific vaccines (not SARS) when I was in med school, before I moved to the dark side that is.

I think one could find an interesting correlation between multiple strain- single dose vaccines vs cytokine storms, autoimmunity and death. For the non-clinically minded, skip the list of proteins, it’s heavy reading.

Let us also not forget that moving from SARS to SARS Cov 2 doesn’t naturally occur over 10 years. This mutation takes a very very long time. It was helped along.
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Old 11th Jul 2021, 11:55
  #34 (permalink)  
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There is NO DNA in the COVID vaccines. You might want to ‘research’ what mRNA is and how it in no way relates to DNA, interacts with or changes DNA.
Ollie Onion is offline  

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