CTC holdpool (ATPers)

[bigmustard]

You will not be entitled to a tax refund regardless of your circumstances ie... whether your a UK resident/ living abroad etc... etc....!!!! Sorry!!!!

Now as an accountant you should know better than to make a statement like that!

I started up an aviation related business, registered for vat and successfully claimed back all the VAT and a potion of the cost of my training against income tax.

[Troy McClure]

If you have set up a 'comapny' for tax reasons, can you really claim that a selection course leading to employment with an airline is in your company's interest?

Have heard of people getting CPL/IR tax free by going down that route, but don't think you could wangle an AQC that way.

[bigmustard]

No, But if you have your own aviation related business you can claim it is in your own business interest. If it goes bust after your training and you need to find a job thereafter so be it!

[Dried ears]

Bored accountant: A. None of your business here

Queston 1: I don't know, couldn't go on forever not placing people though.

Question 2: Fairly varied now, but am already closing in on the age you mention later, yet still able to have an opinion in this forum, which differs from your own, although your points are interesting. I would still argue that there has been bad advice given to students, and good advice given to airlines here, who have nothing to lose.

Londonmet: What? Clearly you are too clever for me.

[boredaccountant]

I would still argue that there has been bad advice given to students, and good advice given to airlines here, who have nothing to lose

Dried ears........ Sorry ? Hum...... please let me know? Exactly what advice HAVE YOU been given by CTC ? ? ? Let me know please ? Because I am a product of the ATP scheme, and I was never given any advice!!!!?!!! The only thing I was told was to work hard on your AQC to make the holding pool.
The guys I trained with last Sep/Oct are now line flying for Easyjet on their Airbus and Thomas Cook Airlines on the 757-200/300 . . . . . . need i say another word that highlights the success of this scheme ?
bigmustard .... claiming VAT on personal flight training fees as a buiness expense?! Sounds dodgy to me, but if customs let you away with it good luck buddy!

[Dried ears]

Bored Accountant: My argument originated, albeit some time ago now, around a comparison between the regulation of advice given by other professionals who have to answer to a regulatory body in such matters. I was attempting to assert the opinion that there is no such regulation of companies like CTC, even by the CAA, in such matters.

need i say another word that highlights the success of this scheme ?

For me, yes, a few words defending them for not finding jobs for the many pilots they have "Qualified", rather than highlighting a very small number who you happen to know, and who have found work.

[Sky Wave]

For me, yes, a few words defending them for not finding jobs for the many pilots they have "Qualified", rather than highlighting a very small number who you happen to know, and who have found work

Dried Ears, are you for real? How can you suggest that only "a very small number" of people have found work through CTC? The vast majority of FO's that I bump into at EZY have come from CTC, CTC have placed hundreds of pilots over the years and there's no reason to suspect that anything has changed.

I know that 14 people left the pool between January and March this year which was all AQC's up to July 06. I understand from an earlier poster that people are being taken from the October AQC now, which means about another 20 people have been placed this year. On top of that they are also placing Wings Cadets with airlines.

As, has already been said, CTC make no promises about the timescales involved. The airlines keep their cards very close to their chests so CTC have no way of accurately predicting pilot demand, all they can do is make sure that they have sufficient pilots in the holding pool to be able to meet the demand when it comes. CTC have closed their doors to ATP entrants because of the amount of people in the pool, but I have no doubt that every person in the pool will be given a type rating and placed with an airline eventually, assuming the swimmers don't find themselves alternative employment in the meantime.

I can understand your frustration but to suggest that CTC do not place many pilots with airlines, or suggest that CTC are somehow cheating people is just total rubbish.

Sit back, relax and enjoy the time off, because it gets very very busy once they do place you.

SW

[Dried ears]

I'm not waiting, my comments arose from reading here and elsewhere about the numbers who are in fact waiting. I don't have the benefit of having been on the course so I don't comment from the position of insider like you seem to.

Reading here seemed to suggest things have in fact changed, contrary to your own argument, although there are one or two who have since posted and contested this.

And yes, I am quite real.

[scroggs]

DE, though your arguments may hold water in relation to many Flying Training Operators in the marketplace, CTC have a pretty good reputation in the field. The system they employ means essentially that they do not take on those who are unlikely to be successful in obtaining an airline position, and their reputation in the industry means that the employment rate of their graduates is nearer 100% than 90%. Some have to wait a while, but that's the nature of the market.

So, nice try. Wrong target.

Scroggs

[Dried ears]

Sc, If it's ok with you, I'll stick to my cynicism.

[waitingwaitingwaitin]

I'm after a bit of advice if I may trouble you all.

I am in the hold pool with CTC and not too far from the top of the pile as I understand it. Have just had a call from another employer to start on a type rating on an E145. Do I take it or hold on for CTC to come good? My preference is CTC for a better type rating and, in my opinion better companies (in terms of terms and conditions) but I just don't know when the call will come from CTC. No one seems too. Bird in the hand and all that is the counter argument!

Any advice will be gratefully recieved! I'm guessing most of you will say take it cause thats one less peron in the hold pool but please try to be objective, helpfull and nice!!!!!!!!!

[Penworth]

Waitingwaitingwaitin. I was in the same position as you a year or so ago, I was going through the CTC process, while at the same time doing the assesments for Flybe. In the end I went with CTC as, like you, it was my preferred option in terms of type rating, future career progress etc. However, I was in the fortunate postion of moving almost immediately from the AQC to the type rating, which obviously isn't the case now.
If I were you I would call CTC and see if you can get some kind of rough idea of how long you will be waiting. Just explain to them that they are your preferred option but that you have another option which you are considering. Are you having to pay for the E145 type rating? That may be quite a big consideration because as you know the type rating is free with CTC (providing you pass it!).

Dried Ears. Not quite sure where your cynicism is coming from, as far as I know every single pilot who has passed the CTC selection process and AQC has gone on to fly for 6 months for a partner airline. A small minority have not been given permanent contracts after that, but that's hardly CTC's fault! Communication may not be CTC's strong point, but the fact is that if you get in the holding pool, you will get put on a type rating course and line training with an airline sooner or later.
PW

[waitingwaitingwaitin]

Not paying for the type rating on the E145 but will be bonded. Have already contacted CTC and they are very non commital suggesting that they have no reason to believe things will not continue to move as it has been.

[Troy McClure]

Guys, it's obvious: Dried Ears failed selection for CTC. That's where the cynicism comes from.

I for one look forward to receiving that phone call from CTC, whenever it may come. And waitingwaitingwaitin, if it's the same E145 operator as I'm thinking of, I'm in that hold pool too. Hoping they don't call me (though it goes against the grain to say it), to save me the dilemma you describe. Know of at least one other that turned down the E145 offer because they figured CTC was a better bet. At least with a CTC partner you start on a jet salary, not a TP one...

[Superpilot]

Looking at the long term future of the ATP scheme, any views on if this scheme will last for much longer? (even if it re-opens for a bit in June). CTC's Wings scheme (Easyjet/Monarch/Thomas Cook packaged integrated training) is still functioning side by side and doing an (obviously) very good job feeding cadets into airlines.

I wanted to apply to it after completing the CPL/IR/ME but being realistic about it, I can't see it happening now that ez's recruitment woes are over.

[shootfromthehip]

Scroggs

and their reputation in the industry means that the employment rate of their graduates is nearer 100% than 90%.

Well my experience of CTC (sutoa's) is that out of my intake the two the selected, 1 failed (as he was a ****.... allededly), and all of us who didn't get selected (100%) are flying for airlines................. CTC = £££££££££

[Troy McClure]

Looks like we've got another one who failed selection..... Pattern developing here.

Can we get this thread back on track and limited to those who are actually in the pool?

[pushapproved]

Hold Poolers

Quite right Troy McClure...this is for the ATPers already in the holdpool.
I am more than happy with the training I received, frustrating as it is waiting and waiting, ('swimming in the pool'), I know I'm in a good place to wait. Meanwhile who knows what else may happen...welcome to the aviation industry!
So how is the pool doing? Last I heard there were 30 in the pool, with some more joining from the April course...
Sep - 0?
Oct - 4/7?
Nov - 4
Dec - 6
Jan - 3
Feb - 5
Mar - 8
Apr - ?
Anyone know different/more accurate figures?

[Troy McClure]

6 from the March course, not 8. That made the pool up to 31 as I understand it.

[Instinct]

I can only answer for the september course. (That is the one starting
Sep -06 ending Oct -06) We´re actually two left in there after an emotional rollercoaster during spring with a few opportunities just not reaching all the way due to merger of companies etc. As I wrote earlier my mindset is to have a relaxed summer trying not to worry to much, looking at everything else as a bonus.
As you put a question mark on the course behind us I might add I believe you´re right. According to what I´ve heard three has been taken from there.

Instinct