Good one CAN-NOT! :ugh:

49 pilots fired so it's generally considered a very unsecure job. Tell that to the thousands that have been furloughed in the USA over the past 5 years!:eek:

CX...go to work...do your job...a job for life! Lots of problems and frustrations with the job but still a job for life. Or you can be happy for 3-8 years at a US pax airline until the next furlough.

Go to UPS, go to FedEx, maybe even SWA but don't leave CX for the US pax majors...not now!

You'd rather be sacked than furloughed? :D :D

I would rather take my chances of being one of 49 than one of thousands! Do the math!:eek: :rolleyes:

Bend over and take it whenever they like it = a job for life.......
Say yes = a job for life
Smile and say more sir= a job for life.

I'm sorry but I have a little bit more to offer than that. I don't want to get to the end of my career and say "thank god that's over". I'd like to enjoy the ride. Working for CX makes me feel like a $2 hooker recieving regular beatings from my pimp Mr Rhodes for not bending over far enough......

Sorry but I ain't anyone's biatch..............

You can ban me again now, I've had my say this month!!!!!

See ya in :ok: April

Total pilots aprox 990, 49 fired = 4% total pilots. UAL 8000 + pilots, 4% = 320 pilots. Gee looks to me to be similar numbers. Not to mention no rehire, tarnished resume, and black listing. Furlough affects people in reverse seniority and while not good on any level at least you know when you are vunerable. Here , we are vulnerable until the day we retire or leave.

Happy thoughts happy thoughts...........

FG

ACMS, If you never have flown with him why did you then post this:

Capt TOGA:- that statement is true. However, I have never flown with PD in Cx.
Get the difference bud?
I'm impressed though.:ok:


Anyway, even if I had flown with PD in Cx it doesn't change the basis of my argument. PD left Cx to join a fast growing Airline to get a rapid command ( which he achieved in under 2 years ) He did not leave because he hated Cx or our standards here.

ACMS,

You can't resist taking a stab at us yanks can you?

Can-not & regretCX:

Don't you guys have anything better to do than to sling mud?

I, for one, am glad you left -- it would be a long day to be stuck on the flight deck with you miserable :mad:

FG, stats are what ever you want them to say especially when you use wrong numbers. I have a friend who was hired at the end of 2000 and he was high in the 1200's so 990 is sure wrong for the summer of 01.

After 9/11 there were over 8000 furloughed pilots in the USA alone. How many did we have in CX? None!

United furloughed 2,172 pilots which reached 10+ years of service. So actually, your post is so full of un-truths you should retract it unless it was meant as a spoof!

As for CX re-hires, I believe over 80% were offered and most elected to say no.:bored:

Don't get me wrong...CX is a lousy place to work but I stand by with my opinion that it is secure.

Cpdude,

8000 furloughs in the USA vs. Zero furlough in Hong Kong.

Where did the towers collapse on 9/11? U.S. or Hong Kong? What exactly are you comparing?? And thanks for keep bringing up some of the worst events in this country's history as the basis for your argument. You're a real class act.

I wouldn't be too vocal mate, you guys may be dealt with another rounds of SARS and the BIRD FLU thing. Don't brag too loudly about CX's record, they didn't furlough you last time because they didn't need to.

It took an extraordinary event for our people to lose their jobs (temporarily). It can just take a bag of peanuts for you guys to lose your jobs permanently.

Good luck mate!

What was I thinking!:eek:

Thought I could have a rational or reasonable conversation but the newbie's just want to attack.

I'll leave this thread to those angry newbie's that have nothing better to do.:8 :}

No furlough, but it didn't stop them taking our money with that stupid SLS scam. It was voluntary wasn't it? The only catch was that if you didn't agree to it you would have been sacked. No, no furlough for CX, there are other ways of keeping an airline afloat during hard times. Namely robbing your staff!!

Newbie?

You mean newly freed?

Or perhaps, even a new happy escapee? You make the pick, but newbie wouldn't be appropriate as I have gotten my ticket out of town.

CP Dude:

First off I ain't no newbie by a long stretch.

Secondly I did not say that those were actual numbers. What I was trying to point out (albeit rather poorly) is that 4% of our pilots being fired IS ALOT. To furlough 4% UAL is looking at 300+ pilots. It would have to be another 9/11 for it to be that bad at every major in the US. With the US economy forecast for moderate growth this year I do not see any signiificant recession on the horizon either.

So which is more likely ? Further industrial strife here or massive terrorist action within the US ? ....hmmmm

So please spare me the retoric about untruths. Speaking of untruths get your facts about the 49ers straight. All were offered a CHANCE to come back, in return for giving up the law suits. As a group they said no, we (the AOA) then forced the deal on them. Then the co. chose a few they liked and turned down those they did not. I have friends who wanted to come back and were not accepted. ALOT worse than furlough, as the emotional stress is considerably higher.

Since I joined I have seen 4 captains fired, 6 Fos fired, and 3 Sos fired. I have also seen 4 Captains demoted and alot of FOs catb'd. All of these things must be factored against the risk of being furloughed. These are just the ones I know about. I am sure there are more. I would rather be furloughed after 10 years than fired, or so fed up that you quit anyway. It results in the same thing -looking for work-. Only difference is while you are employed, the enjoyment factor in a US major is got to be better than here. Greenish brown grass or not.

FG

United furloughed 2,172 pilots which reached 10+ years of service. Cpdude you have some untruths as well.....
2172 Correct, 10+ years of service NOT CORRECT! Closer to 4 1/2 yrs service when the furloughs stopped. I have a friend who works there, hired late summer 98' and was not furloughed. United's junior capt is a 97 hire, fyi.

Just out of pure curiosity, what is the nationality/aviation background of these Cathay trainers that cause so much grief to the poor line guys. Is it homogeneous bunch, or a mixed bunch. This is a fascinating topic as there is absolutely no need for this kind of philosophy in todays aviation environment.

qx747pilot,
Reading the posts here at pprune you would think that every C+T trip is a nightmare. Well, I have been nervous and anxious(self induced) before every check but the majority have been stress free. I have to say that almost 95-99% of any negative feedback has been justified.

Most of my checks for the last few years have been done by guys that were in C+T when I was an FO! So it makes me wonder what has changed. Has there been some corporate philosphy change? Or have the C+T'ers suddenly got angry or unforgiving? I feel that the checks have been consistent over the last decade on both sides of my command.

I dont know why there have been so many problems over the last few years. I think it is a complicated issue...for example, CX used to be a 'check' airline as it had mostly very experienced people joining. Now it is becoming a 'training' airline but it takes time for the corporate culture to change.

I can say this with absolute certainty...the absolute vast majority that think it is ok here and just get on with it, whilst being aware of CX's shortfalls, have very little problem with the upgrades. Those that notice each and every imperfection seem to continuously have problems. I am not trying to infer that being the 'squeaky wheel' will delay upgrades. I am trying to suggest that having a positive attitude is highly correlated to success within CX. Not a 'kiss-ass' attitude...more of the 'take responsibility for one's own f*#$ups attitude'. Yes there is inconsistency between trainers...one tells you to taxi on the centre line and accept the bumps, the next tells you to taxi off centreline to avoid bumps. The checker will invariably prefer the opposite to what you do. So what? Grow up! Wow, the world isn't always fair. The guys that whinge the most should go to some job that has absolute certainty of right and wrong with no variation...the "Stop/Go" sign holder on road works maybe!!!!

You dont have to read "The power of positive thinking" every day to get by here. Just get on with life...accept that sometimes, hopefully rarely, you will be hard done by(I have). If you decide before you come here that C+T at CX will be a problem, I guarantee you it will be a problem.

No one has ever accused me of being chuck yeager and yet I have got through mostly unscathed by the same C+T guys that others complain about. Unlike some posters here I have been subjected to these guys on multiple occasions.

So mr anti-rupert murdoch, it is difficult to answer your question. I haven't seen any trend in my past or to the gripes I hear about from FOs. Maybe it is a case of just being uncomfortable with any C+T being a different nationality from our own?

NC, would I be correct in guessing you joined on the Tristar/Jurrasic then went to the bus not too long after, and have been on it ever since?

The purpose of this short posting is to reach out to any potential new-joiner reading this thread. It would be natural to think twice about Cathay given the comments by regretCX and others.

In my opinion, the most accurate single-paragraph summary of what is required at Cathay is contained within the post above by numero crunchero:

I can say this with absolute certainty...the absolute vast majority that think it is ok here and just get on with it, whilst being aware of CX's shortfalls, have very little problem with the upgrades. Those that notice each and every imperfection seem to continuously have problems. I am not trying to infer that being the 'squeaky wheel' will delay upgrades. I am trying to suggest that having a positive attitude is highly correlated to success within CX. Not a 'kiss-ass' attitude...more of the 'take responsibility for one's own f*#$ups attitude'.

I could not agree more.

"take responsibility of one's **** up".

You're not allowed have any **** up as a Cathay Pacific pilot.

I have had a few f:mad: k ups, I am still here!
Less time whinging and more time focussing on the job and you will be ok. I think they call it 'error recovery' :ok:

Everyone makes errors. The idea is not to let that error rattle you so that you make further errors.

You may make a 3 or worse during a checkride, but look at that as an opportunity for a 5 on error recovery.

You have moved on though, so why not enjoy your own green grass and stop pissing on ours?

what the hell was this thread about?
Oh yes, why they were leaving....

Some people are going for more money at UPS some returning to former employers. As the idea of being based back in their home country was more appealing. Some didn't get along with some of the trainers. Some had family issues. I have actually spoken to some of them.

Yes it is a bit different here. Doesn't mean it isn't possible to enjoy it (although reading the stuff here would make you doubt it). It is also not for everybody. It is different than working back in your home country. Different culture than other airlines too. But it works just fine for many, not so well for others.
Some things could certainly be improved, but that can be said about most airlines.

do not believe N.C. !

Training in CX is absolutely terrible, degrading, unfair and simply ridiculous. the vast majority would agree on that ( especially FO's) , no doubt at all.

anyone interested in joining should really get as much information as possible before making a decision, I personally would not do the move twice.

From an outsider looking in......... it's unbelievable fellas. Cannot believe that adults sling mud at each other like it has been going on through out this thread. Certainly alot of handbags being thrown (with the mud attached)!!!
C'mon can the topic not resume it's initial title...'how many are leaving???'
If you hate the place leave....if you love it......stay....if you have to throw your handbags at each other then open another thread and bash CX, it's training, it's SOP's, it's Captains...and whatever else, to your hearts content. Amazing really and you claim to be professionals!!!:rolleyes:
Ummm really sucks!!!
Better duck, cos I can see a handbag flying my way!

"Confotare esto vir"..................:ok:

No matter who's closer to the truth here, this mud flying around is to say the least disturbing (for a new joiner wannabe) - I think it has to do with the general atmosphere in the company?

Does it not seem that CAN-NOT and regretCX are actually the same person?

Well,

They are 100% accurate in their views, and I am neither.

I have to say that whereas there are a few poor trainers and checkers it is a small proportion and about the same proportion as in my previous life in a bigger airline. The difference is in thestar chamber system that does not seem to have any balancing oversight.

I would say 90% of pilots go through their career in CX without any major hiccups, only minor ones that ensure you stay on the ball.:ok:

Standing by for incoming!!:eek:

Heard last week there's 4 S/Os putting in their notice for Oasis. Does anyone know if Oasis does not have the Cathay style management?

(CPDUDE, I know how to use search function just chose not to).

Just home from another wonderful trip on the mighy 777. God I love this job:ok: We had a good, safe, relaxing fun time out in the real world. The FO said he never reads PPrune, I wonder why??????
Time for all of you ex Cx types to get on with your lives in whatever place you find yourselves in. !!!!ting on our parade has not worked, we actually enjoy it here. So please leave us alone. You can't change the past , so try to change your future. Something you might actually have a little control over.
regards to all.

ACMS:
I´m an outsider looking in and I simply can´t understand why you are so obsessed with selling your version of Cathay as the only true version.

Why is it you can´t accept that other people have a different opinion? In one of your previous posts you made it sound like you were being persecuted by other posters when in fact you started the whole thing with your remarks about yanks, UA and the like.

And why are you so obsessed with telling everyone what wonderfull a trip you´ve just had and that people of a different opinion can go home?

Why don´t you accept that we live in a world where people are entitled to have an opinion that might not be the same as you have?

And no, I´m not a yank, I´ve never applied to Cathay and I´ve never failed a check. I´m just a mere NARROW-body SH captain.

Funny ol' thing.

B4start posts at 1128 and regretCX is right on to it 5 mins later.

An airline is what you make of it. People are big enough and ugly enough to make their own decisions. regretCX Do you not think that you are very much a square peg in a round hole if you are indeed working for CX? I wonder what recruiting were thinking about if they really did employ you? Now kindly p*ss off home and cry in mom's apron before you soil your diapers again.

Holy smokes there are some weird people out there.
I went to work, actually enjoyed the trip and came home. What is the big deal about that? It doesn't mean I fully support Cx all they screw us with. Quite the opposite but after all the negative postings about Cx and our operation in here by Regretcx and others I'm trying to put a little perspective into the argument.
You all need to get a life.

yes jtr, joined on the 'queen of the skies' and then airbus a few years later. Why do you ask?

I really dont understand why you are posting regretcx/cannot. I guess if you truly believe CX is that bad you are trying to do future new joiners a favour. But would they listen or believe you? Would you have not joined after reading a few posts on PPRUNE?

I enjoyed being an FO in this company...a position I held for around 9years. I can count on one hand the number of a#$hole captains I flew with. This includes check and trainers.

I dont think I will ever change your mind about CX nor can you change my mind. I am a pragmatist...I work here as I like the job and I like the money. I would like more money and less work but I haven't worked out how to achieve that yet;-)

You know regretcx/cannot, I was happy before I joined CX, I am happy in CX and I will be happy after CX. I wish I could say the same for you two.

Numo Cruncho/cpdude/ACMS.

Same person!! And why do I believe this? Because in the time I spent in CX..I never met 3 people that liked the place.

I think I quoted you correctly! Sad...very sad.:8

It must be time to have our own CX forum within PPRuNe restricted to registered users only. I am ashamed to be associated with some of the characters here.

hey that's a good idea. that way all the kool-aid drinkers can speak among yourselves and and the public will be spared from all the lies you guys spread about CATHAY PACFIFIC.

CAN---"got any ride reports at flight level three four oh" NOT!!