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Originally Posted by JayTee777300
(Post 9730861)
FLYINCOLO, You seem keen a and capable guy... In answer to your questions just beware...
- you will be assigned a fleet, there is no bidding at CX. - once assigned you will likely never leave that fleet UNLESS it suits Cathay to do so. Your desires and lifestyle are not considered. Once again, there is NO bidding at CX. - even as you upgrade you will be assigned a fleet that is convenient to them to upgrade on. Your seniority means nothing and you will not be allowed to simply defer upgrade to pick a fleet of your choosing (ie. even if you do defer, you will still be assigned the same fleet... Mostly just to teach you a lesson.) - seat locked? For as long as it suits them. Note: some fleets have significantly worse lifestyles than others. Hope you don't get one of those on day 1, or that is it. Game over. In the DFO's words 'we don't discriminate on fleet pay hence we can put you on any fleet that suits us - we are not required to obey seniority'... This attitude unfortunately does not take into account lifestyle/roster and/or overtime though. Additional info: if CX are still spruiking the "you will have a base in 5 years" line be cautious... I have recently flown with SO's that were STILL being told that in their interviews a couple of years ago (as was I 10+ years ago)... Despite the fact there has been no meaningful movement on bases in the last 9 years. When/if the bases did move there will be a lot of pent up demand... And you will be at the very bottom. At CX you can't downgrade to take a base meaning if you have upgraded to Capt you may never get a base (ie. can't downgrade to fill an FO slot). This info it's just so you know... coming to CX in HK is a long term commitment. It is unlikely you will be taking any base before 7+ years. It is a very different work place to the USA, Europe or Australia. CX as an employer are pretty much allowed to do what they want, picking or choosing to honor the parts of your contact that suit them. Good luck with it. |
Gentlemen, does anyone know the structure of the ASPEQ ICAO exam(Cathay Pacific)? Where can I find this information? And who is good at preparing it? Thanks a lot!
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Originally Posted by mrfox
(Post 9727549)
A RJ puke slinging mud about cheap labour - how ironic.
A tw@t like you would not know real work if it hit you in the face. An SO is the epitome of cheap labour, thats not slinging mud but a fact. I guarentee you a lot of those RJ pukes as you so politely call them will have far superior flying skills and abilities to you. :ugh: |
Originally Posted by Luggage
(Post 9739161)
Nothing wrong with flying RJ, most small airports cant take bigger jets. RJ flying is real and hard.
A tw@t like you would not know real work if it hit you in the face. An SO is the epitome of cheap labour, thats not slinging mud but a fact. I guarentee you a lot of those RJ pukes as you so politely call them will have far superior flying skills and abilities to you. :ugh: |
Originally Posted by cxorcist
(Post 9739220)
Very true, Luggage. However, RJ pilots, in general, are doing the same thing SOs are doing. Working cheap, trying to build good time, all in hopes of better things in the future. The upside for RJ pilots is that they can choose from a plethora of hiring airlines. Not so for SOs, they are locked in at CX for at least 5 years before they get any relevant experience. By then, the RJ pilot is long since a captain but still doesn't have a seniority number anywhere. The SO has a seniority number at CX, which used to be worth something. Now? I'm starting to wonder...
Their flight time and experience is not worth anything less than a 737/747 pilots time and have certainly earned their stripes but for less money. The options available to them should be better than an SO, they do a real world flying job and dont buy their way into jobs like European pilots do with P2F and buying 500 on type (no time for those losers either). An SO could have become an RJ pilot and got real first hand left and right seat experience on a twin jet with an MTOW of 40 tons plus, just as good as a 320 or 737. However they chose to become an SO doing nothing and gaining nothing but sitting in a jumpseat or RHS at FL370 over the Pacific...MONITORING!! I have experience flying RJ and A320 so I know both worlds and RJ guys are some of the best pilots I have ever come accross. The workload is incredible and they get some of the best hands on experience I have ever seen.:ok: |
Originally Posted by Luggage
(Post 9739354)
An RJ pilot on an ERJ175 does the EXACT same job as an A320/330 pilot but for less money
Their flight time and experience is not worth anything less than a 737/747 pilots time and have certainly earned their stripes but for less money. I'm guessing because it was the best opportunity available. Hi kettle! |
Originally Posted by mrfox
(Post 9739369)
So you felt your job was worth more, but you took the low paying offer anyway.
I'm guessing because it was the best opportunity available. Hi kettle! Thats the way it is in the US, seniority is everything, you dont get to buy your way into a shiny AA A320 because you want to. I have no regrets with my career neither have I undercut anybody....unlike some!! |
Originally Posted by Luggage
(Post 9739438)
Thats the way it is in the US, seniority is everything,
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Every SO signed a contract, in that contract DEFO is allowed. If someone joins as a DEFO they are junior in seniority to an SO who joined a day before them.
It amazes me how people can get upset when CX complies with the contract YOU signed. |
An RJ is a very small jet, the SO will probably know a lot more than you . If this is the attitude you might as well not join
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I have had the pleasure of flying with some very talented young (and old) SOs from all backgrounds and experience levels. The smart ones do a grand job and soak up the experience of watching the operation when not in the seat. This is the major part of the transition from their previous life to 'the Cathay Way'. The ability to follow the FDs and not crash in the last 200' is easily taught in the first few sectors. Untraining your (luggage) 'this is not the way we did it on RJs blah' is the difficult part... not that I would be a trainer in Cathay!
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Originally Posted by borntofly737
(Post 9725555)
Hello!
I was wondering if anybody had information on the DEFO interview, or will be attending in May. Any information would be greatly appreciated! Cheers, |
Luggage must be an amazing pilot because he flew the RJ. Who here would like to be in a cockpit with him though?
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Seniority
Originally Posted by mrfox
(Post 9739739)
So seniority is everything to you, except when it comes to DEFO over SO?
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Originally Posted by pfvspnf
(Post 9739886)
An RJ is a very small jet, the SO will probably know a lot more than you . If this is the attitude you might as well not join
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA... Tool of the day comment!! |
Originally Posted by GICASI2
(Post 9739960)
I have had the pleasure of flying with some very talented young (and old) SOs from all backgrounds and experience levels. The smart ones do a grand job and soak up the experience of watching the operation when not in the seat. This is the major part of the transition from their previous life to 'the Cathay Way'. The ability to follow the FDs and not crash in the last 200' is easily taught in the first few sectors. Untraining your (luggage) 'this is not the way we did it on RJs blah' is the difficult part... not that I would be a trainer in Cathay!
Get off your high horse, Im a 777 pilot....I fly a bigger jet so I must be better. Im pretty sure the 13000 hour RJ Captains and FO's I have flown with will make the transition just fine. Those Asiana pilots on their 777 did a bang up job landing in SFO, Guess they followed your well taught fly the FD to the ground theory as well...Jeez!! Heres a thought, you can become an SO and monitor and learn as you put it or actually sit in the right hand seat of a real jet and fly, take off, land, fly an arrival/approach...gee what a novel idea. |
Originally Posted by SkewedFlaps
(Post 9740083)
Luggage must be an amazing pilot because he flew the RJ. Who here would like to be in a cockpit with him though?
I guess those 14 flight sectors over 4 days to all different airport, long and short runways, good and bad weather, busiest airports in the world (DFW/ATL/ORD), inflight emergencies as well as international in North/South America has just been a complete waste of time... I patiently wait to be taken under the wing of a real pilot such as a 777 CX guy...that will show me!! |
Yup you're a sky God because you have bumd around in a regional jet.
Let's see you operate in the typhoon season at VHHH or go into PEK Also do you know that SOs are in the sim being checked very very often , there are things in the jump seat that nobody else sees, it never gets mentioned but they have saved the day many times. What bothers me the most is your poor attitude,I don't think you'll last in the region . If this is the quality that Cx is desperate for I pity the companies future. Captains get ready for some baby sitting ! |
I have to agree with Luggage on most of this. CX is a toxic Petri dish when it comes to flying skills. This rears its ugly head time and again when we are asked to fly a visual approach with nothing more than a PAPI, or God forbid, the CRI VOR 13L without full RNP AR automation.
Face it colleagues, CX pilots' hand flying skills suck. Turning off the flight directors and A/T only happens above 1000' once every blue moon. I personally try to do it more often, but it usually gets the PM very nervous even after having briefed it and I hardly ever see that from others. The 3:1 rule seems lost on most of our younger pilots. Many have no clue what energy state / altitude they should be at for given distances. They're just relying on the VNAV path. Did they ever learn it, or have they just forgotten or become too task saturated for it? Luggage is right. We aren't very good, and certainly not proportional to the egos we read on here. Most of us could use some "regional" time to sharpen up, and especially our lesser experienced colleagues who never flew it in the first place. |
Originally Posted by pfvspnf
(Post 9740230)
Yup you're a sky God because you have bumd around in a regional jet.
Let's see you operate in the typhoon season at VHHH or go into PEK Also do you know that SOs are in the sim being checked very very often , there are things in the jump seat that nobody else sees, it never gets mentioned but they have saved the day many times. What bothers me the most is your poor attitude,I don't think you'll last in the region . If this is the quality that Cx is desperate for I pity the companies future. Captains get ready for some baby sitting ! Typhoon season...hahahahaha, yeah we have no hurricanes or tornados, severe thunderstorms etc in the US...HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. What a stupid comment!! |
Originally Posted by ADFUS
(Post 9740232)
Luggage I don't understand why you are carrying on about the 777 as the DEFO role does not apply for that. Ask how much the 330 flogs around Asia? Do they do enough landings for you?
The SO is an entry level job, just like the RJ is an entry level job in the states. However it is the exact same job a United or American Airlines a 737 pilot does. An SO does not EVEN fly, just monitors...no comparison!! |
Originally Posted by cxorcist
(Post 9740234)
I have to agree with Luggage on most of this. CX is a toxic Petri dish when it comes to flying skills. This rears its ugly head time and again when we are asked to fly a visual approach with nothing more than a PAPI, or God forbid, the CRI VOR 13L without full RNP AR automation.
Face it colleagues, CX pilots' hand flying skills suck. Turning off the flight directors and A/T only happens above 1000' once every blue moon. I personally try to do it more often, but it usually gets the PM very nervous even after having briefed it and I hardly ever see that from others. The 3:1 rule seems lost on most of our younger pilots. Many have no clue what energy state / altitude they should be at for given distances. They're just relying on the VNAV path. Did they ever learn it, or have they just forgotten or become too task saturated for it? Luggage is right. We aren't very good, and certainly not proportional to the egos we read on here. Most of us could use some "regional" time to sharpen up, and especially our lesser experienced colleagues who never flew it in the first place. Im sure there are many skilled 'Heavy' pilot on big birds but their are ton who think they are skilled and certainly dont do the hand flying that an RJ pilot does or have the ability of an RJ pilot. As for the new generation of MPL/777 pilots with VNAV and autoland...god help us all. So good to hear your appreciation for good old fashioned stick and rudder, visual approaches etc. |
Originally Posted by ADFUS
(Post 9740259)
So is the SO job?
So what? After a few years in the back they get to fly. I don't understand why this is such a sore point for you. edit: So why don't United/American airlines pilots do that job? Something to do with money? Na can't be cheap labour. The only way into a US major is thru a regional airline (some military get direct entry) otherwise you will not get in. The regionals fly the routes thru a contract with the US majors, however SCOPE only allows up to a certain size aircraft/number of seats at the regional and do you want to know why?... It is to prevent cheap labour you numbskull!! It stops the regional buyiing A320/757 and flying those routes for those aircraft while undercutting pilot salaries at the majors...hence protection from cheap labour whilst still getting the regional airports serviced and pilots getting good experience on jets. Even though I had A320 experience I had to join a regional when I got here as thats the way it is and I am grateful for the opportunity and flying I have done. As for your SO flying many years later you want to know why I have a problem with it...err they dont fly!!! 4 years later an RJ FO has built up 3000 plus hours of actuall jet flying and you think an SO is the same thing, are you demented!! Cant wait to put my family on a plane with an SO taking over due to pilot incapacitation with his 5 years of monitoring...wow we should all be so lucky!! Sure his flying skills will be top notch. That 35 - 40 knot cross wind landing will be a breeze for him to handle, you know the type us RJ pukes deal with in Chicago (windy city) on a regular basis but hey, what do I know. Im not an experienced CX Pilot Sky god!! |
Originally Posted by ADFUS
(Post 9740320)
Err what were you mad lads getting paid a few years ago? 19K per annum?
You're right, I know nothing about the US market. Couldn't care less. Why are you getting so passionate about CX when you clearly have no interest in working for them? This originally started about SO (So called pilots) whom I think are nothing more than cheap labour with good monitoring skills because they sure as hell dont fly. Either way, CX made their bed and must lie in it, not my problem. |
[QUOTE=ADFUS;9740320]Err what were you mad lads getting paid a few years ago? 19K per annum?
RJ guys may have been getting 19k a few years ago but you are missing one very big point. They were NOT UNDERCUTTING pilots salaries at the majors due to SCOPE which I have just explained!!:D Yet did an honest days work in an RJ getting fantastic hands on twin jet experience whilst doing the EXACT same job as a United 737 pilot. Nothing wrong with that in my book...seems to be a sore point for you though and the holy SO's.:rolleyes: |
Luggage you will never ever make it to captain at Cx or any other major airline . You clearly live in a bubble and don't have a clue how things work.
I truly feel sorry for the SOs that you are going to be flying with. I'd rather trust them in the jump seat than have you up front any day of the week. FYI it's not always 3:1 , the children of the magenta line can multiply too.. |
Originally Posted by ADFUS
(Post 9740345)
So let me guess this straight.
You are on a work visa in the US (2 years was it?) with absolutely NO CHANCE of progressing into a mainline carrier. You have been bouncing around the world looking for a job (Cebu, Macau, DHL, AJX, KA, CX) after you paid for an a320 type rating and got some hours in it (why only a few hundred?). Now after finding out that in CX you will be behind a couple of hundred SOs for command you got your panties in a twist and started spewing insults on the forum. With an attitude like that how will you ever survive as an SO in QANTAS? How's the application going so far? Edit: Wishing you all the best for the 2018 Diversity Visa lottery. Err..I have a green card, secondly never paid for a rating in my life as I stated in an earlier post (dont abide by p2f and screwing my fellow pilots over). Thirdly have many options and interviews lined up in the US with very good TA rates unlike you on you CX/KA salary in a place thats as expensive as NY. Would never ever join QF as an SO even though I respect the airline. SO is just a complete and utterwaste of time. Why would I do that with 1000's of jet hours....wake up man. I would gladly work for QF but equally happy at Hawaiian airlines, Delta, Fedex, UPS, JetBlue, Virgin America, Alaska, Southwest...all good airlines. Already have an interiew with a US major so CX, DHL, Cebu...not very high on my list. Unlike you, I have options.. Hows life in that polluted dump you now call home..hahahahahha!! |
Originally Posted by pfvspnf
(Post 9740357)
Luggage you will never ever make it to captain at Cx or any other major airline . You clearly live in a bubble and don't have a clue how things work.
I truly feel sorry for the SOs that you are going to be flying with. I'd rather trust them in the jump seat than have you up front any day of the week. FYI it's not always 3:1 , the children of the magenta line can multiply too.. |
[QUOTE=ADFUS;9740345]So let me guess this straight.
You are on a work visa in the US (2 years was it?) with absolutely NO CHANCE of progressing into a mainline carrier. You have been bouncing around the world looking for a job (Cebu, Macau, DHL, AJX, KA, CX) after you paid for an a320 type rating and got some hours in it (why only a few hundred?). It's called resigning from your job and emigrating to a different country for my familys future but dont let that get in the way of you knowing more about me and my career than I do.. |
FYI it's not always 3:1 , the children of the magenta line can multiply too..[/QUOTE]
Pity they cant fly but Im so glad they can use vnav and disconnect at 800 feet for a straight in approach on a calm sunny day...heavy workload after 6 hours in the bunk, as for that SO watching the landing...what knowledge gained verses say actually hand flying it yourself. |
Progression
Originally Posted by ADFUS
(Post 9740392)
Written by you a few months ago.
Of course you do :D:D:D and I am the Queen Of England. It called lifestyle and seniority, something you keep harping on about. ....and now Im on a green card, whats so hard to understand. I applied and got one... As for the majors interview...whatever floats your boat man. Life is peachy, hows life for you in HK, still bitter and twisted are we...hahahahaha. |
Originally Posted by pfvspnf
(Post 9740357)
FYI it's not always 3:1 , the children of the magenta line can multiply too..
Not to worry though Magenta, you just keep following that Chinese glideslope. It's never led anyone astray. |
Originally Posted by Luggage
(Post 9740199)
No numbskull, Im just telling you how it works in the US.:D
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Originally Posted by mrfox
(Post 9740695)
Enjoy flying in the US. I think we are both happier that you are over there and not here. Have a nice life.
Would be a shame to seea terrific brand go down the tubes...I mean that!! |
Best thread I've seen on this forum in a long time! Keep it up!
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Luggage it's funny how it's the people like you who claim to have all the options for jobs are here asking for career advice and then berating others
Your 200 hours on the a320 really does sound strange , you either paid to fly or was given the sack quite early You will be easily identifiable where ever you end up |
Originally Posted by pfvspnf
(Post 9740921)
Luggage it's funny how it's the people like you who claim to have all the options for jobs are here asking for career advice and then berating others
Your 200 hours on the a320 really does sound strange , you either paid to fly or was given the sack quite early You will be easily identifiable where ever you end up |
Originally Posted by 773
(Post 9740769)
Do everyone a favour mate & walk away from PPRUNE.
You're not doing your case any favours arguing with people you've openly stated you have no desire working for. |
Originally Posted by pfvspnf
(Post 9740921)
Luggage it's funny how it's the people like you who claim to have all the options for jobs are here asking for career advice and then berating others
Your 200 hours on the a320 really does sound strange , you either paid to fly or was given the sack quite early You will be easily identifiable where ever you end up Hahahahahahahahahhaha...you clown!! |
Originally Posted by Luggage
(Post 9741337)
People like you really are imbeciles..I guess you know my work history better thn me. I must have been sacked everywhere I worked, paid to fly and am desperate for a job...Im probably not even flying a jet now....hell am I even a pilot?
Hahahahahahahahahhaha...you clown!! |
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