Why would you come to CX?
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 461
Likes: 129
From: Bottom of the Harbour
After that pattern you can relax back in your HK anonymous lifestyle where your HKID is recorded everywhere you go and who your employer is.
Make sure you don’t have an opinion on the 3T’s otherwise you will be marched off an airplane and not recorded as being in HK. Apparently you can cross the border and not be recorded doing so….who would have thought that is possible.
The take away from this is that you are no longer working in an independent HK. You are now part of the mainland, and anyone who has worked there will know what cost that needs to be added to any contract. Unfortunately CX doesn’t seem to account for that..
Last edited by KABOY; 1st February 2024 at 11:48.
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 852
Likes: 6
From: Utopia
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 98
Likes: 4
From: Angola
This is a fact, unarguable .
I might add get a command and disappear, get a good TR a few hours and disappear, stay another two years for the kids to finish school and go.
Joined: Jan 2024
Posts: 51
Likes: 2
From: Hong Kong
Not wrong, but the same argument could be made for hundreds of other airlines, including US majors.It used to be more difficult to get in almost everywhere, and likewise successful candidates have in general less experience nowadays.
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 674
Likes: 10
From: Krug departure, Merlot transition
True, but none of those getting commands in US majors, legacy carriers or even EK are leaving their airlines like in CX. I’ve had two friends leave well under a year after becoming CNs here (one practically handed in his resignation as he received his four bars). Unimaginable until 3 years ago.
We simply can’t compare ourselves to such airlines anymore.
We simply can’t compare ourselves to such airlines anymore.
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 25
Likes: 2
From: Australia
True, but none of those getting commands in US majors, legacy carriers or even EK are leaving their airlines like in CX. I’ve had two friends leave well under a year after becoming CNs here (one practically handed in his resignation as he received his four bars). Unimaginable until 3 years ago.
We simply can’t compare ourselves to such airlines anymore.
We simply can’t compare ourselves to such airlines anymore.
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 128
Likes: 13
From: Asia
We had 230 new joiners and around 210 quit so we're up by 20 or so in last 12 months. we had historically around 50-60 retire every year in the 20 ish years pre 2018. So CX still has 4 times the usual quitting/retirees. The days of anyone with any experience wanting to join CX are long gone, we're cranking up mainland recruitment for flightcrew, it's the only way forward.
As someone said, it's all about money, if you're on base pay at CX as many are you're worse off than if you'd stayed at a legacy carrier elsewhere like BA/QF etc, even with their higher tax base. That's how bad the pay at CX has got, though plenty of CX fanboys refuse to even look at what legacy carriers pay in 2024. We all had the choice and we took CX while our mates stayed and did the extra years to command at legacy carriers and now we're embarrassed to admit it wasn't the best choice.
As someone said, it's all about money, if you're on base pay at CX as many are you're worse off than if you'd stayed at a legacy carrier elsewhere like BA/QF etc, even with their higher tax base. That's how bad the pay at CX has got, though plenty of CX fanboys refuse to even look at what legacy carriers pay in 2024. We all had the choice and we took CX while our mates stayed and did the extra years to command at legacy carriers and now we're embarrassed to admit it wasn't the best choice.
Joined: Jan 2023
Posts: 55
Likes: 1
From: dubai
not true .. there are still a lot of experienced pilots out there queueing to join. just accept all of them will solve the problem. special task force set up for this purpose. HR will make the call and FOP will just take order . hahahahaha....
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 552
Likes: 22
From: Hong Kong
At one time the pilot ranks of Cathay Pacific were considered the gold standard of aviation experience and achievement. Sadly, after decades of toxic mismanagement and mindless cost cutting, the real and respected old China hands have all been pushed out. Mission accomplished.
Today Cathay Pacific has become an embarrassing punch line among the international pilot community.
Thanks goes to those geniuses that occupied the executive and flight ops offices during the long decline. Motivated purely by greed and jealousy, true weasels one and all.
Today Cathay Pacific has become an embarrassing punch line among the international pilot community.
Thanks goes to those geniuses that occupied the executive and flight ops offices during the long decline. Motivated purely by greed and jealousy, true weasels one and all.
Joined: Jul 2022
Posts: 98
Likes: 4
From: Angola
I have been personally in touch with experienced pilots asking for info and they are staying well away these days.
On one count you are correct, FOP just takes orders, from a bunch of incompetent idiots unfortunately but that doesn’t make them less guilty
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 112
Likes: 0
From: Nimbus
I've been told by a friend still at CX that the sim passing rate for new DEFO applicants is absolutely appalling.
And that FOP has been asked to justify why they're failing candidates that obviously can't fly.
Scraping the bottom of the barrel, it seems...
And that FOP has been asked to justify why they're failing candidates that obviously can't fly.
Scraping the bottom of the barrel, it seems...
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 451
Likes: 6
From: the land of chocolate
From the captains flying at cx I’ve heard the quality of who they work with in the cockpit has gone down significantly, making their job harder than say 3-4 years ago. Fo training is something like 15 sectors. When I went through it was at least 40, if you were lucky, many went to 60, if not more.
They should be paying the captains 30 percent MORE, not less!
They should be paying the captains 30 percent MORE, not less!
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 68
Likes: 75
From: Australia
It’s great to see that cygnet78 is so upbeat about the future at CX. I fly with ex CX guys and girls every month. They’re very clear about why they left and what happened to the culture when “the two Chinese a@#$&#@s” were assigned to management roles.
I had with a few who still fly there, their family lives are almost unliveable, no rostering, commuter type rosters and rubbish pay.
A once great airline has been ruined, that’s undeniable.
I had with a few who still fly there, their family lives are almost unliveable, no rostering, commuter type rosters and rubbish pay.
A once great airline has been ruined, that’s undeniable.
Joined: Dec 2020
Posts: 192
Likes: 55
From: HK
It’s great to see that cygnet78 is so upbeat about the future at CX. I fly with ex CX guys and girls every month. They’re very clear about why they left and what happened to the culture when “the two Chinese a@#$&#@s” were assigned to management roles.
I had with a few who still fly there, their family lives are almost unliveable, no rostering, commuter type rosters and rubbish pay.
A once great airline has been ruined, that’s undeniable.
I had with a few who still fly there, their family lives are almost unliveable, no rostering, commuter type rosters and rubbish pay.
A once great airline has been ruined, that’s undeniable.
It is sad to see how far CX has fallen. A once mighty world class airline to a basic Chinese LCC with a premium product. Truly one of the greatest falls from grace.
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 552
Likes: 22
From: Hong Kong
Ten years ago I went into Flight Ops to complain to the Chief Pilot of Training about my concern that mindless cost cutting was leading to a decline in experience on the flight deck, with specific emphasis on the stupidity of rostering two second officers on a four man long haul crew.
The rostering of two second officers on a four man crew was bad enough, but it was beyond belief that it was being implemented in an unrestricted manner, once again to save costs. For example, crew control was free to roster two brand new second officer (fresh out of basic pilot training) with a brand new relief commander and a brand new captain. What could go wrong?
As I tried to argue how idiotic this was his response to me was beyond belief. He asked me what I would have him tell the CEO (RH at the time)?
I looked at him stunned for a moment then slowly replied that he should tell him that it was unsafe! That it was his job to tell him that it was unsafe! That his position as a manager was moot if all he was going to tell senior executives was only what they wanted to hear!
I’m convinced that the reason for the decline in any great company would mirror a similar mindless cost cutting protocol. Penny wise and pound foolish.
I remember a conversation I once had with a grizzly old captain about whether he lamented the loss of the navigator in airliners. His answer was no, that pound for pound…he’d rather carry fuel.
I think this same logic should apply to employing weak flight ops managers afraid to relay real safety concerns to senior airline executives. Pound for pound….an airline would be better off purchasing fuel.
The rostering of two second officers on a four man crew was bad enough, but it was beyond belief that it was being implemented in an unrestricted manner, once again to save costs. For example, crew control was free to roster two brand new second officer (fresh out of basic pilot training) with a brand new relief commander and a brand new captain. What could go wrong?
As I tried to argue how idiotic this was his response to me was beyond belief. He asked me what I would have him tell the CEO (RH at the time)?
I looked at him stunned for a moment then slowly replied that he should tell him that it was unsafe! That it was his job to tell him that it was unsafe! That his position as a manager was moot if all he was going to tell senior executives was only what they wanted to hear!
I’m convinced that the reason for the decline in any great company would mirror a similar mindless cost cutting protocol. Penny wise and pound foolish.
I remember a conversation I once had with a grizzly old captain about whether he lamented the loss of the navigator in airliners. His answer was no, that pound for pound…he’d rather carry fuel.
I think this same logic should apply to employing weak flight ops managers afraid to relay real safety concerns to senior airline executives. Pound for pound….an airline would be better off purchasing fuel.